Android audio quality : my surprise revelation

shibashis

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This was a revelation, and I am happy for it.
Late night working hours, tired mind and body, a strong cup of coffee to keep you company, more common these days than we care to admit. It has been such a night for me, but this changed all that and a bit more I think.

Recently got myself a Lenovo K900 Android, it used to be a 'flagship' model, not anymore, that did not bother me. I needed a vivid and big screen, to read comics and casual books, this serves the purpose, has 2 GB RAM to boot, so all in all not bad. This however is not a review of the Lenovo K900.

Along with that strong cup of coffee, my AT M50 is by now my without-fail companion for nightly working hours, with my laptop and Asus Xonar U3.
I was listening to some music tonight as well, no different than any other. Then I got up to get myself some coffee....while in the kitchen I do not know why I thought of it or how it came to pass, but I thought I would connect my Audio Technica to the new Lenovo K900. Just curiosity I suppose.
Good thing that I did. :)

My Laptop uses the Xonar U3 (in HF mode, turning off all kinds of synthetic enhancements), and Foobar with WASAPI (Flacs mostly), it has kept me happy. Imagine my surprise when humble Lenovo either matched or surpassed the SQ offered by my regular config. I was not excited about the result honestly. I owned a HTC Desire V in the distant past, that had decent audio quality, since then I have been distinctly underwhelmed by more than one make of Sony Xperia's claims, and then the LG Nexus 4. Nexus was a superb phone, just amazing but listening to music was a less than satisfactory affair.
I should mention I own an iPod touch 4th gen, had an iPod classic (till it met its end), and have had experience with different Cowons. So I can make out the difference in portable audio quality, and believe me I was astounded with what the Lenovo offered. They are making my Audio Technical sing, and loud enough too. I have so far listened to Buddy Guy, Alice in Chains, Dire Straits....and what can I say, superb for a phone. Mind it, for a phone.

This was a true revelation, never expected this. If I was happy with the Lenovo before, then what am I now? :)
I started to look for answers, found that K900 uses the Wolfson WM5102, akin to much much pricier Samsung S4, I was not surprised given me experience tonight. So I decided to start this thread about Android sound quality with the myriad devices available in the market. Share your experiences with audio on phone, does not have to remain confined to Android I suppose.

My little search led me to this:
Complete Guide to Android Smartphone Audiophile

Thanks everyone for reading.
 
This was a revelation, and I am happy for it.
Good for you, but this is no surprise to me.
Before I simplified my main system, I used a Marantz SACDP, feeding Quad 99/909 amplification, powering a pair of Harbeth C7 speakers.
The SACDP has a USB socket on the front panel, that can take digital signals from an iPod/touch/phone, for conversion on its DAC.
Playing SACDs/CDs from the SACDP, or the same files in lossless version from an idevice wired to the USB socket to use the DAC in the SACDP, there was no audible change in the sound quality from the Harbeths.
Indeed, even wiring the Idevice from its docking socket to an analog input of the 99 pre amp, which means that the Idevice DAC is in use, one has to listen very carefully to hear a difference. Sometimes I thought I did, often I could not.
Modern handheld devices are hifi system components in disguise overlooked for reasons that aren't always rational.
 
Indeed, even wiring the Idevice from its docking socket to an analog input of the 99 pre amp, which means that the Idevice DAC is in use, one has to listen very carefully to hear a difference. Sometimes I thought I did, often I could not.
Modern handheld devices are hifi system components in disguise overlooked for reasons that aren't always rational.

Sawyer while I do value your experience, I find it impossible to believe that there would be no difference between a quad CD player and an ipod/iphone line out unless something is really wrong with the system setup.

I can hear the difference between the line out from the bottom connector of an ipod touch and the internal dac of my car's basic no frills blaupunkt MP57 head unit very very easily. The ipod's line out sounds thin with barely any body to the music. I'd be able to identify it in a blind test 9 times out of 10 I think. I never bothered comparing it with my main system as I'm sure it would not stand a chance.

Again this is my personal experience, YMMV.
 
Sawyer while I do value your experience, I find it impossible to believe that there would be no difference between a quad CD player and an ipod/iphone line out unless something is really wrong with the system setup.

I can hear the difference between the line out from the bottom connector of an ipod touch and the internal dac of my car's basic no frills blaupunkt MP57 head unit very very easily. The ipod's line out sounds thin with barely any body to the music. I'd be able to identify it in a blind test 9 times out of 10 I think. I never bothered comparing it with my main system as I'm sure it would not stand a chance.

Again this is my personal experience, YMMV.
My experience is from a rigorously set up, precise level matched blind listening test. Note that I wasn't using the I touch DAC, the made for I pod socket on the SACDP takes digital inputs and does the conversion using its DAC. Except for the digital signal, all other electronics in the iPod was bypassed, and the iPod was only doing file transport duties.
So: my mileage does vary, and I for one am thankful for that. It has allowed me to move to a Sonos front end for unmatched for me till now, and extremely convenient access to music that is also of CD quality. Bliss.
While I have not done the kind of test you seem to have, it is possible that in it the volume control of the iPod is in play. This may mean two things for the comparison. The volume control circuit may not be as hifi as it needs to be. More likely, the thin sound is due to sound level differences, which need to be as small as 0.2 db to make an audible difference. But this is speculation, I have never done this comparison.
 
I have said it time and again the quality of portable audio equipment is improving by leaps and bounds. Some people who are too much in to stereotypes find it tough to believe, however, the improvement is there for one and all to experience.

I have had my moments. Mostly through phones. I have had iPods (last being touch 3rd gen). But to my ears Samsung Galaxy Note easily surpasses the iPod quality. Samsung Galaxy Note sings like a seasoned vocalist. Apple iPod, in the comparison, sounds like a little baby making noise trying to sing.

The kind of functionality smart-phones are including these day, and at the prices, they are the best thing to happen to mankind since telephone, TV. Good for not-so-fussy music lovers.
 
Samsung Galaxy Note easily surpasses the iPod quality. Samsung Galaxy Note sings like a seasoned vocalist. Apple iPod, in the comparison, sounds like a little baby making noise trying to sing.
Understandable, given all the variables at play when listening to them on earphones.
I suspect though that if wired to a device that can extract digital signals from them, all will sound equally good.
 
Understandable, given all the variables at play when listening to them on earphones.
I suspect though that if wired to a device that can extract digital signals from them, all will sound equally good.

They should, under ideal circumstances. But a lot depends on the electrical environment inside the box, complexity of signal path, as well as availability of processor time to deliver jitter-free output.

Headphone out wise Note is clearly superior. I also tried HDMI out through MHL cable, and quality was surprisingly good for a phone. Too bad I never came across any place selling its "dock". Otherwise I could do a head-on comparison of their digital out. Another option is to extract the digital out from its HDMI out, but that would too complex a thing to do with a phone, whose whole agenda is to offer a simple no-nonsense solution to day-to-day needs.
 
Another option is to extract the digital out from its HDMI out, but that would too complex a thing to do with a phone, whose whole agenda is to offer a simple no-nonsense solution to day-to-day needs.
I agree. It is easy to do this for Apple devices, funnily enough, the made for iPod/iPhone USB sockets on many CDPs/amps makes it so. It is strange that these amps are not able to do that for non Apple devices. Apple after all is the closed environment, it should be easier with others, in theory.
 
Gsmarena.com, as part of their phone (and possibly tablet) reviews carry out a detailed audio test. Definitely worth a look see.
 
I can certainly hear improvement in SQ when I connect my IPOD through USB input of Marantz 6004 as well as my Onkyo NR5009. I agree Nexus 4 sounds bad on its own. But when I connect it through Onkyo App to the receiver by WiFi it sounds fantastic.
 
I agree. It is easy to do this for Apple devices, funnily enough, the made for iPod/iPhone USB sockets on many CDPs/amps makes it so. It is strange that these amps are not able to do that for non Apple devices. Apple after all is the closed environment, it should be easier with others, in theory.

Contrary to the popular belief, popular USB implementation of iPhone/iPod on most devices is not digital extraction, even as it yields better results. Due to closed nature of Apple's policy, very few manufacturers have been able to implement "true digital extraction" from iPod. Wadia for example.
 
Contrary to the popular belief, popular USB implementation of iPhone/iPod on most devices is not digital extraction, even as it yields better results. Due to closed nature of Apple's policy, very few manufacturers have been able to implement "true digital extraction" from iPod. Wadia for example.
How would you then react to Marantz saying in their spec sheet that the iPod socket on their SACDP for example, uses its on board DAC to convert digital signals from a I device wired to the socket?
 
How would you then react to Marantz saying in their spec sheet that the iPod socket on their SACDP for example, uses its on board DAC to convert digital signals from a I device wired to the socket?

I don't know enough about Marantz's implementation to comment on it.
 
I have said it time and again the quality of portable audio equipment is improving by leaps and bounds. Some people who are too much in to stereotypes find it tough to believe, however, the improvement is there for one and all to experience.

I have had my moments. Mostly through phones. I have had iPods (last being touch 3rd gen). But to my ears Samsung Galaxy Note easily surpasses the iPod quality. Samsung Galaxy Note sings like a seasoned vocalist. Apple iPod, in the comparison, sounds like a little baby making noise trying to sing.

The kind of functionality smart-phones are including these day, and at the prices, they are the best thing to happen to mankind since telephone, TV. Good for not-so-fussy music lovers.

iPods are convenient, entertainment devices, not the best for music listening. I have learned this with experience. Even with my very basic Creative EP-630 IEMs years back I could make out the difference between an iPod (touch, classic) and a Cowon player. The Cowon trumped any iDevice with consummate ease.
The 'moments' that you talk of are actually sweet, the closest that a music lover can experience to an 'epiphany'. :)
As stated I have had these with Cowon but had to settle for an iDevice because of its usability, that and the fact that I got one for free from my client. With the phone too I fear it will only be used at night, not really possible for prolonged listening due to its battery performance. Add to that the tangle of wires on the work desk.
Cowon had their offerings in Android, I am still tempted to get something which would sound divine and will be portable with the practical usability like a smartphone. This Lenovo could really be it, we shall see. As mentioned before battery remains a concern, also limited storage capacity will prove to be a hindrance in the long run I know.
 
I agree. It is easy to do this for Apple devices, funnily enough, the made for iPod/iPhone USB sockets on many CDPs/amps makes it so. It is strange that these amps are not able to do that for non Apple devices. Apple after all is the closed environment, it should be easier with others, in theory.

Could be easier for other devices, but which would gain more acceptability in the market? Of course an Apple device because of its far greater market penetration with one standard architecture.
 
This Lenovo could really be it, we shall see. As mentioned before battery remains a concern, also limited storage capacity will prove to be a hindrance in the long run I know.

(1) Keep a power bank in standby.

(2) Use an OTG cable. Practically unlimited storage at hand.

There you go. Both your problems solved. :clapping:
 
(1) Keep a power bank in standby.

(2) Use an OTG cable. Practically unlimited storage at hand.

There you go. Both your problems solved. :clapping:

Lenovo has increased my problems, I am loving it, I did not not know it could play Flacs so I just played 320 Kbps mp3s till now.
The problem is that I am divided now, I love what the Lenovo is doing, but listening to music for me at least is most convenient with laptop, right now I am a little torn between the two. Good dilemma to have.

As to your suggestions, I have thought of a power bank, that will happen.
For the second point, a little story: I once bought a 8 GB iPod touch, back then I made little money of my first job and it took considerable savings to buy that and needlessly to say I knew even little of audio back then. I had to sell the 8 gig iTouch simply because it was an irritation I could not live with. I was thoroughly bemused at the practice of picking and choosing minimal number of tracks from my library to fit in only 8 GB capacity. It physically bothers me when I can not listen to a track that I want to. Say I am walking down a crowded street, some sound or a face reminds me of a certain number, it is a pain to wait to get home. I sold it on ebay.
The biggest issue then is the lack of capacity, even with the OTG option, it is somewhat cumbersome.

I am not giving up on Lenovo for a fact, likely a hunt will begin shortly for affordable decent IEM.
 
I don't know enough about Marantz's implementation to comment on it.
Fair enough. I believe Marantz are being honest, based on a AB precise level matched blind test that I did once with a lot of rigour on a high end system, using SACDs for the comparison.
Based on that I would think the same for every other Marantz kit that has the same spec for its USB made for iPod socket. If they can do it once, it can't be expensive to replicate across the model range. The bigger cost would probably be the license fee they have to pay Apple for this.
Later I also tried this with the analog signal from the 30pin socket of the I Pod touch directly into a Quad preamp, and I could not hear any conclusive difference. But this wasn't done with as much rigour, I will admit. For casual background music it seemed perfectly adequate on the same system.
 
@shibashis - Thanks for the update.

I rarely watch any movies, play games or listen to music on my smartphones. To me its all about work - email, social media, calendar, organization, dictaphone (Dragon NaturallySpeaking has a wonderful app), etc.

That said this should as good a day as any to transfer some high bitrate MP3s and test things out. Mercifully my collection has been ripped from CDs and converted into FLAC, but don't think any of the smartphones with their 16GB internal memory are going to take over the entire music collection... unless of course we can get the 2TB microSD and a compatible phone.

Shall try/test things out over the weekend and come back with my findings too.

Going to start with the Moto X and the HTC One.
 
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