Invest more on good DAC or amps?

[rohitmusic]

Hi,
Seems the source quality matters a lot.
Hear it myself! So wondering if I should spend more and get a good DAC instead of spending more on the amplification.
I have two options:

1. Invest more on good amplification (possibly pre-power combo)
2. Invest more on excellent DAC and get decent pre-power amps

Thanks to my over stretched budget I cant get best of both worlds right now. So need to choose between the two and make a calculated trade off for best results!

 

[koushik]

I reckon it is close to 40:60 DAC to Amp.
40% of budget to DAC and 60% to Amp

A 20K DAC deserve atleast a 30K Amp or more.

 

[anm]

depends on what you have got right now. Maybe you should spend more on speakers first. What is your source? If it is disk spinner, get a used CDP for 10-15k. If you are using laptop get a good usb dac - maybe hrt streamer II, or if desktop then a good sound card would take you to a good level up there, from where upgrade will be like 50-100k on DAC.

Good speaker and synergistic amp will give you much more benefit. If you are fine on the speaker front, then go for amp, and then for DAC. Till then work with a decent CDP.
BTW, what budget are you looking at - that is going to be important.

 

[rohitmusic]

depends on what you have got right now. Maybe you should spend more on speakers first. What is your source? If it is disk spinner, get a used CDP for 10-15k. If you are using laptop get a good usb dac - maybe hrt streamer II, or if desktop then a good sound card would take you to a good level up there, from where upgrade will be like 50-100k on DAC.

Good speaker and synergistic amp will give you much more benefit. If you are fine on the speaker front, then go for amp, and then for DAC. Till then work with a decent CDP.
BTW, what budget are you looking at - that is going to be important.

Thanks for the actionable inputs.

The total budget around 80k. (that seems minimum required to do justice to the system.)
40k spent on speakers. Remains 40k.
I am taking a long term plan to build my system. Dont want to compromise on SQ too much.

Have Paradigm Monitor 7 speakers.
Will be playing mostly through laptop. Need to arrange a CDP. Your info is very actionable that for it. I will check the details for them.

I am currently in Amplification stage:
I was earlier going for an Marantz PM7004. But I can to know of the Passive Preamp and heard it gives very detailed and clean sound. I like clean and details as I listen to lot of classical, semiclassical, instrumentals.
This is where the pre-power amplifier combo comes into picture. So I can get a decent power amp (norge,emotiva,etc) and use the passive pre (PASS B1) and pair it with a decent DAC like the caiman or like.
Another options is get an pre-owned integrated with high wattage and use it like a power amp later.

This is my current status.

Thanks again for insightful and actionable inputs. Now I have something to work on!

 

[ruenigma]

Your overall audio setup is as strong as its weakest link.

That means it'll be unwise to spend excessive on one equipment and skimp on the other. Balance is the key. Ideally you should consider a 30:30:30:10 ratio.

That means if your audio setup costs 100Rs then the source, amp and speaker should cost 30 Rs each with 10 left for cables/ICs connectors etc.

 

[Santy]

Amp's limitation usually becomes more prominent at higher volumes, whereas DAC's benefit is evident at even lower volumes.

Like Koushik said, to appreciate a good DAC, you must have spent more on the amplifier by 1.5x or more. Ultimately I believe, the speakers are most important link in the music chain. Though I am not experienced, my take on ratios: 40:20:30:10 spk:dac:amp:ICs/cables.

In your case, with 40k left for source and amp, you may not be able to justify your speaker's capability. For now, instead of spending on cheap pre-power combination, you could look at a good integrated amp. You can also start with pre-owned ones, if you have time, patience and luck in finding a good piece. For 20k, you will find some attractive deals.

Though DAC is very important, keep it as last option- just in case you end up spending all money on amp, you could atleast start listening- vice versa will put you in great agony. hyeah:

 

[GeorgeO]

I am not a great believer in high cost DACs-but that's my personal opinion-concentrate on building up your basic building blocks first-and if you can, go the separates route.

 

[anm]

Passive pre has had several heart breaks in this forum AFAIK. An integrated should be fine for now, and for the given budget range. You can also look at the nad pre+power combo on sale by ashishkesarwani. But how do they pair with your speakers, someone else need to comment on.
Preamp from lyrita is also great. Not sure if anyone is willing to sell off, but maybe Viren himself knows. As his new DHT has come up, may be some of his clients are looking to upgrade.
At that budget range, if you are looking at music only - I would strongly suggest Viren's speakers + integrated. I think it has now become a little more expensive. For movies, PSB+NAD is a fantastic combo - great scale of sound. I am mesmerized every time I visit Lakozy showroom and watch a movie.

 

[rohitmusic]

Passive pre has had several heart breaks in this forum AFAIK. An integrated should be fine for now, and for the given budget range. You can also look at the nad pre+power combo on sale by ashishkesarwani. But how do they pair with your speakers, someone else need to comment on.
Preamp from lyrita is also great. Not sure if anyone is willing to sell off, but maybe Viren himself knows. As his new DHT has come up, may be some of his clients are looking to upgrade.
At that budget range, if you are looking at music only - I would strongly suggest Viren's speakers + integrated. I think it has now become a little more expensive. For movies, PSB+NAD is a fantastic combo - great scale of sound. I am mesmerized every time I visit Lakozy showroom and watch a movie.

Checked with Viren as per your earlier recommendation in some other thread. I checked for any preowned stuff on sale but he did not have any as of now.

They do have a tube pre amp though. Wonder how it will go with a SS power amp. I have heard hybrid amps Jolida 1501- it is integrated. Nice warm and fluid sound. Especially great for vocals.

Unfortunately I am not able to audition the lyrita in Pune. Would love to.

BTW: I am purely into music.

 

[anm]

some say tube pre and SS amp is best of both worlds. Pre gives the tubey tone, while SS amp gives punchy power.

 

[aashish351]

Check out the new Cambridge Audio Azur 651A. It's an integrated with USB input. Will be well within your budget too... only gripe, it's matching with Paradigm. I have used a 650A - very neutral, slightly clinical, needs to be partnered with slightly laid back speakers.

 

[ruenigma]

We've recently been through a Paradigm + CA horror story. I doubt rohit will consider the 651 or anything CA till he has those Paradigms with him

Rohit, ideally within your budget I'd say get the 326BEE or similarly priced amp of your choice and the used PM5400 of HemantWaghe on sale. Both should fit around 37k leaving 3k for ICs and speaker cables.

Continue to burn CDs of your FLACs/MP3s till you could afford a good DAC with USB + TosLink. Once you save-up enough for a power amp get that and use the 326 as a pre.

 

[BLASTO]

@Rohit,
Check ap corrson | eBay

They have a non remote pre-power combo for 55k is what captain says. Ping him for number.

 

[rohitmusic]

@Rohit,
Check ap corrson | eBay

They have a non remote pre-power combo for 55k is what captain says. Ping him for number.

Thanks!
BTW, How are Accoustic Portrait amps generally speaking?
(I am not yet aware of them as a brand)

 

[BLASTO]

Thanks!
BTW, How are Accoustic Portrait amps generally speaking?
(I am not yet aware of them as a brand)

Never heard myself too.. But the bangalore hifi meet guys were praising univocally.. Check the thread..

Capt Rajesh has a pair himself with his 1.8L Rs speakers. These are higher end to paradigms. Probably matches the paradigm signatures.

I did not pursue in this direction because my thiels are power hungry. Paradigms are very easy to drive and so quality amplification is more important than quantity.

I settled with 250w/ch musical fidelity BTW and not a morsel of repent.

 

[BLASTO]

Thanks!
BTW, How are Accoustic Portrait amps generally speaking?
(I am not yet aware of them as a brand)

Also, ping square_wave. He has the AP amp.
He adviced me to excercise caution as the thiels shine with higher amount of power.
Also heard from captain that there is return back policy if you are not satisfied.


Edit: Check this.
http://www.hifivision.com/press-release/25759-new-website-acoustic-portrait-up.html

Looks like they have started advertising heavily. Last week the page was "under construction" when I was looking..
Probably a group deal is a prospect.