AVR setting Small vs Large

[corElement]

I dont know if this may apply to avr's across the board but...

In most manuals I find avr's saying if you have a sub you may wish to set the fronts to small even though you have large and crossover to 40hz. Some avrs have the option to allow them to remain large but still send lf to sub through preout.

I was always a bit confused about this but I didnt know what the confusion was... now I do.

When I set my fronts to small, I find it gives better clarity, clarity in terms of music because there are so many instruments playing in the med and high ranges, the lows being sent to the sub it allows the speakers to handle mid and highs slightly more clearly.

HOWEVER, when I kept using the same setting in movies, I felt it was a bit weird. Scenes where the orchestra worked up didnt seem full in movies. then it occurred to me why not change it to large and lets see if it makes any difference.

Voila! shock factor was back into orchestra scenes of movies.

So My suggestion is for people with large fronts, if you have them set to small, you might find it better for music, however in case of movies it makes a world of difference having towers set to large with full frequency dedicated to them as well as the preout giving lows to the sub.

 

[sud98]

Small and Large settings in AVR are not to do with the size of the speakers but with the dynamic range of the speakers.

When you set the fronts to large, it implies they are full range speakers and can handle from 20hz to 20khz. So the AVR will pump all the sound to those.
IF you do not have full range speakers so you would be better off setting them to small and getting the sub to work at 80hz or the crossover frequencies that work well in your combination.

 

[corElement]

Yes, I understand the technicality of it however I did not understand the practical audible application of it till now as I always found greater clarity in setting them to small.

Thats why I made this thread so others could get an idea of how the small/large to crossover relation works. Even more so because many like me may pefer setting them to small to bring out greater mid range focus rather than simply give it the "technical' bandwidth.

On a different note it may not refer to physical size, however I also believe physical size and dynamic range cannot be separated from each other.

Eitherways what I basically wanted to say for someone who dosn't want to simply go with a technical setting, if one has towers which do lows mids and highs the setting small may give better clarity for music vs large which makes movies a little more enticing.

 

[spirovious]

Yes, I understand the technicality of it however I did not understand the practical audible application of it till now as I always found greater clarity in setting them to small.

Large/Small is fixed at fixed freq & is useful if you dont want to go in deep settings.
As said above,if frt spk can handle full range,then large is good opt.
With sat,one need to keep it small to protect them from blowing them.
Further as you know,Sub CO can be adjusted to get perfect sound.
If frnt are not so Dynamic,it can sound odd than you expect as it can not handle defferences in Hi & Low freq when set as Large.Even AVR can have a load handling all freq while amplification.

So you can get clear sound with small settings.

 

[trittya]

Agree with all thats been said but I have a thing against AVRs. Them things dunno what they do. Too much for me to take. I sold my Marantz to a FM here & resolved never to buy one again. I use analog outputs on my oppo to get 5.1 sound. Much simpler, more satisfying & no hassles.
Just my INR 0.02, though.

 

[2chFreak]

Small and Large settings in AVR are not to do with the size of the speakers but with the dynamic range of the speakers.

When you set the fronts to large, it implies they are full range speakers and can handle from 20hz to 20khz. So the AVR will pump all the sound to those.
IF you do not have full range speakers so you would be better off setting them to small and getting the sub to work at 80hz or the crossover frequencies that work well in your combination.

+ 1 ... spot on ...

Subs take over 80Hz & below ...

 

[manoj.p]

Here is the gist of it.

Large: Meaning the speakers are full range. AVR won't do any bass management and will send full range signal from the channels to speakers. Now, for 5.1 tracks, there is a dedicated LFE channel upto 120 Hz. If you have selected "Yes" on the subwoofer settings, then this LFE channel is sent to subs even when the speakers are set to large. if you have set the subwoofer setting to No, then this LFE channel is sent to fronts.

Small: This is simple. AVR does the bass management. For all the channels, it sends below crossover + LFE channel to subwoofer. If using this - make sure LFE crossover is set to its max - 120 Hz.

Then there is the combo where fronts are full range, set to large. The surrounds are bookshelfs and set to small. If there is no subwoofer, then AVR does bass management for speakers set to small and sends that signal along with LFE to fronts. If there is a sub, then it obviously goes to subwoofer.

There is also a setting called double. It will send same signal below cross over to subs and each speakers. I haven't understood the real thinking behind it's usage. But it is out there.

 

[Santy]

It makes sense to keep the fronts as small even for floorstanders.. I always prefer that even for movies. For a simple reason: Sub is designed for bass. It should be allowed to do its pumping job to the fullest extent and help to reduce the low frequency load on the front speakers. There is more clarity, better control and speed if the FS are not strained with below 100Hz frequencies. When you set FS to small, it is not that we loose any range of the signal, it is compensated by the sub in a better way. In other words, a 80hz signal is better reproduced in the sub than the FS. We could set a cross over such that there is a 10% overlap between the speakers and the sub, for seamless integration.

 

[utkarsh]

When i was having Aviano 2 keeping BS to LARGE on my Marantz SR5005 enhanced bass in BS and there was no lacking in clarity.

 

[Vijay_s]

In Denon 3312, default setting after audyssey auto is front speakers set to "Large" even though subwoofer recognized in calibration. This means LOW frequency will be passed onto Subwoofer as well as to front speaker(LFE+LPF). When you allow front speakers to large manual cross over settings are disabled.

In my current setup I changed Large to small and manually set crossover to 60 (+10hz above the speaker capability) as my front speakers are able to take 47Hz and above. This means any signal below 60Hz is passed onto sub.

Audyssey recommend to set speaker 80Hz & "Small" regardless of capability.

There is good article on this topic . Small vs. Large | Audyssey

 

[Ashutosh78]

I dont know if this may apply to avr's across the board but...

In most manuals I find avr's saying if you have a sub you may wish to set the fronts to small even though you have large and crossover to 40hz. Some avrs have the option to allow them to remain large but still send lf to sub through preout.

I was always a bit confused about this but I didnt know what the confusion was... now I do.

When I set my fronts to small, I find it gives better clarity, clarity in terms of music because there are so many instruments playing in the med and high ranges, the lows being sent to the sub it allows the speakers to handle mid and highs slightly more clearly.

HOWEVER, when I kept using the same setting in movies, I felt it was a bit weird. Scenes where the orchestra worked up didnt seem full in movies. then it occurred to me why not change it to large and lets see if it makes any difference.

Voila! shock factor was back into orchestra scenes of movies.

So My suggestion is for people with large fronts, if you have them set to small, you might find it better for music, however in case of movies it makes a world of difference having towers set to large with full frequency dedicated to them as well as the preout giving lows to the sub.

no matter what the size of your speakers if you have a seperate subwoofer makes sense to set your fronts and surrounds small just to tell the avr that the sub will handle all frequesncies below the crossover (normally 100hz) be played by the subwoofer.

 

[chanduwala]

Dude, Usually low frequencies handled by the sub woofer we know it right?

If you have 2.1 setup or any setup which has the sub woofer, AVR will pass the low frequencies to the sub. We can adjust up to how much low we want from sub. as part of this in amps they will give option to adjust speakers type. If you set the speakers and large all the low frequencies will go the speakers it self. If you set like this in many cases sub woofer won't even get any signal. But if you set the speakers to small you are giving some share to sub woofer. So all lows handles by sub. In fact in may receivers you can adjust frequencies. In my set up while watching movie, I will make all speakers cross over to 80HZ. When listening to music in stereo mode I will set front speakers as FULL BAND. So all frequencies will pass to my front towers. In this case, sub won't even get any signal.

 

[elangoas]

for most receivers, In general Large Vs small is the above said difference.

I own a Marantz SR5200 receiver & . It sounds the BEST when u engage the Source-direct mode both for stereo & well as multichannel mode. This is because the Marantz AVR when engaged in Source-direct mode treats the speaker as full range (LARGE). No matter if you have BS/FS/Full range speaker.

There is a difference in sound in Marantz receiver when it is set to LARGE Vs SMALL. I love it when it is set to large. The bass ouput on my diamond 9.2 is simply superb.