Recording live concerts

[sivasarjun]

Hi all,
Would like to record some of the live concerts I go to.Carnatic and Hindusthani classical.Need to get better quality recordings than what can be achieved with mobile phones etc.
Any experiences?Suggestions?

 

[bhagwan]

Hi all,
Would like to record some of the live concerts I go to.Carnatic and Hindusthani classical.Need to get better quality recordings than what can be achieved with mobile phones etc.
Any experiences?Suggestions?

This should not be very difficult.

a]
Do you have axcess to artists ?
b]
Will they allow you to record ?

If this is possible - all you need is 2 mics & 1 digital recorder;
These can be 'purchased' or 'rented'
Here 'budget' will play an important part.
I like Nagra 'D' & B / K Mics [my dream to use & create / record Indian Classical - Hindustani]

Then comes the difficult part - mic placement [very difficult]
This is a trial & error game.
Keep on working on it. You will only improve.

If you want to do it seriously, just invest in the gear - record & transfer to the computer & then you can do the rest from there - lots of You Tubes will show you what can be done & how you can do it...

All the Best !

 

[sivasarjun]

Thanks for the reply.What I had in mind was slightly more discreet and a bit more humble which will give listenable quality.

Although the artists will give permission it may not be possible to set the mic up at the venue.
Is there a way to record off the speakers at the venue.
@Bhagwan,sir have you recorded any live concert yourself and how was the quality?

 

[bhagwan]

Thanks for the reply.What I had in mind was slightly more discreet and a bit more humble which will give listenable quality.
Although the artists will give permission it may not be possible to set the mic up at the venue.
Is there a way to record off the speakers at the venue.
@Bhagwan,sir have you recorded any live concert yourself and how was the quality?

Sir,
Few things;
a]
I have not recorded anything.
I do not have axcess to any artists.
b]
If I got the artist - the audio gear for recording is 'easy' to arrange [at a price]
c]
The 'difficulty' is the location. I want to record in a Church & in a Jain Temple & a Muslim Tomb etc. Permissions are very very difficult to get.
d]
Music can never [re repeat] never be recorded off a 'speaker' this is the worst thing you can ever do. 100 % NO NO !

All the Best !
I do hope you can do some recordings & if you succeed - put the video - via mobile - on you tube - so we all can see.

:clapping:

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Search for "portable recorders" on any of the gear supply sites, eg this one from Thomann.

There are similar machines from Zoom, Tascam, Sony, and perhaps other manufacturers too. Set your budget, read reviews, especially those relevant to your specific purpose --- and make your purchase!

I have seen AIR technicians with Nagra digital recorders. They had a table full of about US$10,000 of kit, and no need to be "discrete."

In my music-student days I used to make very good recordings with a UK100 Sony stereo mic and a mini-disk machine. The pocket recorders have changed all that now.

I have often been tempted to buy something from Tascam, partly out of sheer gadget love . But the fact is that recording concerts, even where I know it is tolerated, makes me uncomfortable; I can't be bothered to fiddle with the equipment; and... I have so much music already that mostly never gets listened to. So, with mixed feelings, I take concerts as a transient experience of the moment.

 

[Nishanth]

Even I would suggest you to look at portable recorders, usually they are called as voice recorders in the local market. Sony has a good range of voice recorders, check them out at Sony India website. Reviews and recordings for most Sony voice recorders are available online on Youtube, this should give you an idea about the quality of recordings.

Quality of audio recording has improved a lot in some phones like the HTC One and in some Nokia phones like Lumia 720. So if your planning to go in for a new phone you can check them out too.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Voice recorders were originally just that, dictation machines, and many of them still are. Those are not the best thing to record music, even though some of them might be quite expensive. Sticking to the studio/music equipment dealers, at least for selection, helps to ensure appropriate equipment.

Quality of audio recording has improved a lot in some phones...

Really a lot! Surprisingly so. Seldom (as mentioned) a concert recorder, I turned my phone on to record a mic-less concert --- and the result that I got was better, in some ways, that the "official" copy (the concert was miced for recording, not for amplification)

 

[asliarun]

Investing in a top of the line lumia might get you significantly better results as nishanth also suggested. Note that only a few models have this tech. I saw a few demos a while ago and the results were quite dramatically good.

IIRC, HTC copied this tech illegally in the HTC one and Nokia sued them.

A new direction in audio recording with Lumia 1520 – : the official Nokia blog

Another thing people are doing nowadays is to get a microphone that fits onto a smart phone. It would not be as discreet as a phone itself but probably not too bad either. A lot of serious bloggers and even journalists are using this technique.

 

[sivasarjun]

Thanks for the pointers.Will have to do some research.Tascam dr 100 seems out of my budget.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I was at a concert this evening. The mridangist was recording it with a Zoom recorder placed in front of the stage monitor. I don't know what model.

Tascam dr 100 seems out of my budget.

These things are rapidly achieving studio-in-the-pocket, with ever increasing specs and functionality, so there is a wide variety of prices --- not to mention (although we have already ) the high-end stuff. What is your realistic budget?

 

[ranjeetrain]

The built-in mic in portable devices (phones/tablets/fablets/mids) have come a long way. I often record auditioning sessions on portable devices and they don't fail me. Particularly I like the recordings made on Samsung Galaxy Note and an Ainol media player. The recordings made on these devices is so detailed, retains so much from the original sound that it feels more than adequate for all non-serious work. The only serious problem with these devices is that they don't record entire audible frequency range and sound hollow. But if you forgive that, the recordings made on these non-pretentious and discreet devices is pretty decent.

I would strongly recommend trying out some similar devices you can lay your hands on prior to investing in a serious recorders such as Sony/Tascam etc.

 

[sivasarjun]

I was at a concert this evening. The mridangist was recording it with a Zoom recorder placed in front of the stage monitor. I don't know what model.

These things are rapidly achieving studio-in-the-pocket, with ever increasing specs and functionality, so there is a wide variety of prices --- not to mention (although we have already ) the high-end stuff. What is your realistic budget?

5 to 10K Rupees.

 

[Nishanth]

In that price range you will get a couple of models from Sony and few from Olympus. Sony recommends models from the SX and PCM series for music recording, SX series might fit your budget.

 

[jls001]

Zoom H4n, about Rs 20000, available from Pro Musicals, Chennai 044-28193445. One of the best flash recorders in the market today. You can use the dual in-built mics for live recordings or plug in a mic into the XLR interface. This is a pro-grade device for not too much money. One famous user is John Atkinson, Editor of Stereophile.

There are alternatives from Sony and Marantz, but in my opinion they are not as good.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Don't pay for things not needed! A recorder that is going to hide in a pocket (or sit on a chair/stage when allowed) is never going to have XLR mic inputs and mic pre-amps used. Added to which, you'd have to save up for the mics as well. Levae out the stuff you don't need then buy the best you can.

(Line-in is essential for when you can find a really friendly sound man.)

The only serious problem with these devices is that they don't record entire audible frequency range and sound hollow.

Made for voice.

5 to 10K Rupees.

I think that makes the lower-cost Zoom or Tascam models available.

An elderly friend of mine with a huge carnatic archive used to use mini-disk with Sony stereo mic (same as mine). Then he bought a low-cost Zoom. He told me that the quality was not as good, but it won on convenience.

Not so long ago the best we had was cassette. Anything beats that!

 

[Asit]

I currently use a Sony PCM D-50. You can view the product at Sony Pro website. It cost me about USD 500 a few years ago in the US. It does a great job with its built in microphones. However, it may be just a little too big to be in your pocket and may be a bit too pricey. I think it may be available in India right now. Look at the Sony India website under the pro use section.

I mostly record unamplified live music with this. It can record upto a 24 bit/96 kHz resolution.

If the sound man is not permitting you a line in, then the only option is to record live from the speakers. This is not good from the audiophile point of view, but from a musician's or a music-lover's point of view, it is acceptable. I have a few recordings like that. On one occasion, I put it up on the stage on a stand and hence it recorded partly unamplified sound and mostly from the stage monitors.

Other similar options are from Edirol (model R-09HR), from Zoom (as discussed above by Joshua), and from Olympus (model LS-10). There may be similar but newer models from these brands.

But make sure of one thing. Do not buy just a voice recorder. You will be disappointed with music recording. Also for the purpose, you do not need to go with external mic and XLR connection etc as Thad has already opined. That would be too cumbersome to use in a live concert hall.

I used to have a Sony professional WMD6 cassette recorder. With that I used external mic and a pre-amp. Two channel recording was really very good. I once recorded an Ali Akbar Khan live concert with that (obviously with permission), and the quality is better than many CDs available nowadays.

Regards.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I used to have a Sony professional WMD6 cassette recorder.

I have one of those, as discussed and pictured on another thread. It was a long wanted device, but, soon after getting it, I got minidisk and left cassette behind. The walkman pro still gets used as a deck sometimes.

This thing made all the difference to my music-student recordings:

I wonder how the pocket-machine built-in mics would compare? Better, probably, just because technology has marched on, but I bet that little Sony stereo mic would still do a good job.

 

[nshankar]

I use an Edirol R-09 placed on the stage and live with whatever SQ that it records. I am happy with it (no comparison to studio recording) but have not heard any other similar recording by another device to compare.
I purchased it new for USD 200/= in a local sale in Muscat.
It works well for unamplified performances, typically vocals with harmonium, acoustic guitar and tabla.

 

[deba]

If you are serious of Live recording then you should buy a 8 track SD card recorder with built in mixer and CD writer. They are excellent product for the price. Get yourself some dynamic microphones with stand, You can go for condenser mics if budget permits.

Most important is getting permission from the artist as most artist if you don't know them personally will not allow you to record.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

The implication I get from the original post is the requirement for discrete recording, probably without explicit permission. That is a very different thing from what amounts to a portable studio --- and a very different budget. Of course, the same results should not be expected.