Schiit Audio Loki DSD Dedicated DAC @ $149

[thx911]

have been following this DAC since its launch in September - there were virtually not great reviews so far but for the one below published yesterday. Looks like we will still need some good in-depth review of Loki, in the meanwhile, thought of sharing with FMs who are in the market for a DSD DAC.

Good luck

DAC Reviews | AudioStream

 

[Santy]

Lets make hay while the sun shines.
This is what the guys at Shiit seem to have decided.

Firstly, if we are going to take analog straight out of it, a DSD 'DAC' at $149 sounds like an oxymoron. Coz the DSD conversion itself is quite expensive so one would wonder how much $$$ did go into the DAC section?

Secondly, if we consider it as a DSD to PCM 'converter', then at $149 is quite expensive for a "paper weight".

Check this out Schiit Audio Loki DSD Dedicated DAC | AudioStream

So DSD as of now, seem to be for those who want to listen to DSD rather than their favourite music.

(running away from DSD fans)

 

[thx911]

Coz the DSD conversion itself is quite expensive so one would wonder how much $$$ did go into the DAC section?

Secondly, if we consider it as a DSD to PCM 'converter', then at $149 is quite expensive for a "paper weight"

what conversion are you talking about? and why would you consider it as a DSD to PCM Converter? its a pure DSD DAC - it does not do PCM.

what makes you say that DSD conversion is expensive? (converted to what? guessing you meant to analog)

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

That's a terrific review from Audiostream. I aprticularly loved the bits about OCD, Grandmas, and kittens! :lol:

At the moment, I feel that DSD is a format not for me, but for the next generation to think about. But who knows, in a couple of years I might look back at laugh at myself for saying that.

Whatever, whenever I decide to change my mind, I can now, thanks to Schiit, afford it --- which is quite something! Hats off to Schiit!

:yahoo: :clapping: :yahoo:

 

[Santy]

Well it looks like I got the description wrong. My mistake.

Now, you can add DSD to any DAC for only $149.

Which made me to think that it can make our existing DAC, DSD compatible and it (existing DAC) will continue to do the duty of digital to analog conversion.

But I continue to wonder which will be better in terms of SQ
A non DSD DAC like say Shiit Bifrost (retailing for USD 449) playing PCM or
Shiit Loki playing DSD (USD 149)

It will be interesting to compare. If Biforst scores better, then what's the point of playing DSD format which is supposed to deliver superior quality than PCM?
I hope I am able to put my point across meaningfully.

 

[sidvee]

It will be interesting to compare. If Biforst scores better, then what's the point of playing DSD format which is supposed to deliver superior quality than PCM?
I hope I am able to put my point across meaningfully.

I have been researching a bit on DSD as well, and it seems as usual there are 2 camps out there, "DSD is great" - "why bother".
As I understand one can add Loki for a mere $149 to see if they can hear any difference before going on yet another upgrade binge. I myself have upgraded my DAC 4-5 times in as many years and recently when I was upgrading to my current Skylla and waiting for it to arrive, I added my 5 year old Musical Fidelity XDACv3, and found it sounding superb. So needless to say I will consider Loki first as DSD becomes available before I jump to upgrade.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[esanthosh]

As for DSD vs PCM, I found this: Archimago's Musings: MEASUREMENTS: PCM to DSD Upsampling Effects (JRiver MC19 Beta).

I can't help but wonder if what's happening here is like tube amps and analogue playback (eg. vinyl). Objectively the DSD conversion adds distortion but the anomalies are not perceived as objectionable and in some material, the added noise and imprecision actually makes it sound less "sterile", "clinical", more "real" (conversely being in an anechoic chamber is disturbingly unreal due to the profound silence). It would make sense to me that some people could prefer DSD64 over DSD128 upconversion since DSD64 will give you more of that distortion. Even though the noise is ultrasonic in nature as measured off the DAC, nonlinearities in the playback system like your headphones and speakers (perhaps certain amps as well) could create audible intermodulation. Maybe for certain music, this could be especially beneficial.

 

[ravi_d]

But I continue to wonder which will be better in terms of SQ
A non DSD DAC like say Shiit Bifrost (retailing for USD 449) playing PCM or
Shiit Loki playing DSD (USD 149).

Loki DSD Dac is comparable to the $99 Modi dac design wise. Both has similar components C-Media CM6631A as USB receiver chip and AKM4396 as the D/A chip.

Now what makes the $99 Modi get the DSD playback capability and get rid of PCM for additional $50 is

1. Modi D/A chip is configured to work on PCM only and Loki on DSD only
2. the output stage (the stage after the D/A chip) is different for DSD and PCM as the output stage designed for PCM can't work for DSD and vice versa unless it is intelligent enough to configure itself to work on DSD and PCM.
   If you look at the spec the Analog part for Modi and Loki were given as
   Modi - Analog Summing, Active Filtering: Based on AD8616 with precision thin-film resistors and film caps.
   Loki - Analog Topology: based on AD8616 with DSD-specific filtering

Modi pit against Loki will be fair to get an idea on what DSD can do better over PCM.

 

[thx911]

Now what makes the $99 Modi get the DSD playback capability and get rid of PCM for additional $50 is

one more important step if i may add - the extra processing needed by Loki to handle DoP protocol - which i hope should not have any impact on D/A &(or) Analog stages

Modi pit against Loki will be fair to get an idea on what DSD can do better over PCM.

+1

 

[thx911]

As for DSD vs PCM, I found this:

here are the measurements for Loki Schiit Loki - affordable DSD DAC - Blogs - Computer Audiophile

the combo filter used for noise reduction by Loki though not as sophisticated as TEAC UD501, still shows good measurements