Suggestions Needed for Music Listening !

[Jhononweed]

Hello every one !

After reading so much content on this wonderful yet resourceful forum made me conscious about what we listen or see should not be forced on us rather chosen by us. Being a avid music listener all my life(although I am still young ) with listening taste varying from Trance to Dance to Rock but without a good sets of speakers are turning my music to cry aloud for some upgrade and I am getting terrible burning desire inside of me to get something good that can bring energy to songs that my setup currently lacks .But I am being creped by thinking what speakers should I buy or make( First timer if I chose DIY route).

My mind is totally out of sync regarding what type or what kind off speakers should I get for music that I listen well cutting long story into short one, I need good speakers with following description and hope I do get some valuable advice :

1. Room Size 25 x 20 ft.

2. Type of Music Trance / Electronica / Dance / Rock.

I listen 90% Trance and I am fond of Good Bass( Not Boom Boom kind off..but good tight Bass )

3. Source of music PC

4. Type of Music File format - .mp3 files with 256/320 Bit Rate

5. Type of Speakers - Well I like BS type due to its small size but do not know if they
can produce Bass of my taste.


Budget Not a problem and can extend upto 100K or sobut if I get something good in less amount say like 30-40K ,then choice is obvious. I saw and heard Polk BS speakers and that was my first contact with that kind off equipment and sadly I dont remember the name but it sounded good and was in price range of something about 450 $ in Hongkong.
Ideal choice of price would be upto 50K Rs and will spend on rest plus dont want to get kicked out of home( My mom will go crazy if she comes to know I am trying to spend that much on just speakers:lol: )


Ok now about my ideal setup will be like this :

PC ( Sound Card )- > Speakers

Or

PC ( Sound Card )- > Amplifier- > speakers.


Now my query is :-

1.Do BS without SubW help to deliver my kind of sound that I crave or do I need SubW along with BS pairs.?
2.Will an Amplifier be needed considering I am going to get Asus STX or ST card.?
3.Which manufacturer and what kind of BS should I go for.considering this will be my first real speakers.?
4.If I try to make my own speakers.by help of DIY threads of this forumwill it justify effort put on DIY speakers against Branded ones?
5.Where to get DIY Kit( I know about Peerless / Ahuja drivers ) and carpenter + electrician to solder things in New Delhi.

Ohh one more thing .i need something that doesnt get me heavy electricity bills .So do kindly suggest me something GREENER.

Hope by above details I can land a decent set of speakers.

Cheers !

 

[SatSon]

Hi,
#1 - IMHO I've seen ENERGY, SONY bookshelves doing neat job with tight bass with out sub.
#2 - You will definitely need an amplifier even if you get a sound card for your PC, as the signal from the sound card will be of line-level only. But you won't need an amp if you are going for Active speakers something like studio monitors(they have built in amp).

Better the experts here throw light on your other queries...

 

[aashish351]

Both 50K and 100K can get you a satisfying setup. Goes without saying that in absolute terms 100K setup will be much better than a 50K one. if you are a first timer, my advice would be to start from 50K budget and enjoy upgrading as your appreciation for high fidelity grows. One school of thought would be to invest into a good setup in the first time itself - this part you need to decide for yourself.

Nevertheless, for 100K setup - look at NAD C356BEE (50K) + Polk RTiA7 (50K). Personally, I don't recomment a Subwoofer for pure music setup. But if you feel that the bass out of RTiA7 (although big enough) does not satisfy you, a subwoofer can always be added later.

For 50K, NAD C326 + Polk TSi400 could be an option.

 

[Jhononweed]

Both 50K and 100K can get you a satisfying setup. Goes without saying that in absolute terms 100K setup will be much better than a 50K one. if you are a first timer, my advice would be to start from 50K budget and enjoy upgrading as your appreciation for high fidelity grows. One school of thought would be to invest into a good setup in the first time itself - this part you need to decide for yourself.

Nevertheless, for 100K setup - look at NAD C356BEE (50K) + Polk RTiA7 (50K). Personally, I don't recomment a Subwoofer for pure music setup. But if you feel that the bass out of RTiA7 (although big enough) does not satisfy you, a subwoofer can always be added later.

For 50K, NAD C326 + Polk TSi400 could be an option.

Thanks for suggestion !

My music listening capacity or should i say capability of listening is not of an " Audiophile Grade " so i can easily live without getting into nitty gritty of "Hey that was better then this ....kind off thinking "....got my point Sir ? ....

My Source will be PC and that is what i am going to stick with as initial setup.
Real aim is to get a good set of speakers that can provide me good listening experience that i have been missing and then look for any upgrade in near future.

100K Rs is for speakers only minus every other things as first thing i took notice from this forum is that " Get good speakers first then look for rest " and the budget of mine is at its max though i don't think i would hit that range for purchase but just to be on better side.

Looking for more options in both DIY / Branded category.

@Satson

Thanks , i will take that into consideration.

Cheers !

 

[ab79]

what about jbl es100.which cost around 70k with better bass and sensitivity?

 

[square_wave]

Buy these Bro.

Crest CA 2.
Crest CA 2 Stereo Power Amplifier

Speaker:
http://www.cerwinvega.com/home-audio/floorstanding-speakers/xls-215.html

 

[ranjeetrain]

Jhononweed, mate it's not as straightforward as it may seem. You have got 2-3 things to take care of.

First of them is your listening room. Does that happen to be a basement? 25x20 feet. Now that's a sure shot way to get unwanted echo, a messed up stereo image, sound reflecting from everywhere to everywhere. The most challenging part in your way to nirvana is your listening room. At the very least you need to heavily drape your room, or stuff it arbitrarily with object of various shapes, sizes and weight.

Next is SPL. For the room that size, and the genres you listen to, you need speakers that can go loud. As such any speaker can go loud, but being at ease while doing so, maintaining full composure, is something not every speaker can manage. I will suggest you a JBL 4428. Its a speaker I would like to buy if I had a space like yours.

With the above speaker, your need for the amp will be pretty simple. You can buy a Behringer A500 amp. It will drive them nicely.

If you want something more conventional, buy an Marantz/Onkyo/Harman Kardon amp and a pair of Klipsch RF series floorstanders.

 

[Jhononweed]

Morning all.

ab79

Those look a bit bigger....will add to audition list.
Thanks for recommendation.Do you own them or have you listen them?

Buy these Bro.

Crest CA 2.
Crest CA 2 Stereo Power Amplifier

Speaker:
XLS 215 CERWIN VEGA Floorstanding Tower Speaker

Hmmm..!! Big Amplifier though i am completely noob regarding Amplifiers

Wow Speakers look good in specifications( Then again i have absolutely no idea about what those data in spec's are all about :lol: )
Its so heavy, ....are they available in India(Grey market is also prefered) if not then can it be found in Bangkok or Hongkong ?Well shipping charges from USA will kill the deal because of its weight.

ranjeetrain

Jhononweed, mate it's not as straightforward as it may seem. You have got 2-3 things to take care of.

First of them is your listening room. Does that happen to be a basement? 25x20 feet. Now that's a sure shot way to get unwanted echo, a messed up stereo image, sound reflecting from everywhere to everywhere. The most challenging part in your way to nirvana is your listening room. At the very least you need to heavily drape your room, or stuff it arbitrarily with object of various shapes, sizes and weight.

Next is SPL. For the room that size, and the genres you listen to, you need speakers that can go loud. As such any speaker can go loud, but being at ease while doing so, maintaining full composure, is something not every speaker can manage. I will suggest you a JBL 4428. Its a speaker I would like to buy if I had a space like yours.

With the above speaker, your need for the amp will be pretty simple. You can buy a Behringer A500 amp. It will drive them nicely.

If you want something more conventional, buy an Marantz/Onkyo/Harman Kardon amp and a pair of Klipsch RF series floorstanders.

I live in a apartment with my room being closed room with a big window on side and rest all r sealed with one door though dimensions are given in my first post are of my dining room which is next to my room which more kind of media room as i have recently placed a 46" LED with an HTPC which will be used as source for music too.
Yes i know HTPC and music source doesn't go together well but this HTPC will be more like a video platform for TV without any multi channel audio( thinking to get a sound bar ) & Music listening with sound card + Amplifier. I am leaning towards BS because that fit into my Media table...want to keep the room as clean as possible.

Sir what is SPL ?
Jbl 4428 looks perfect for the size i am looking for .....but why can't i see them in JBL site , are they discontinued model or not for sale here in India.?

My main aim right now is to get Speakers first then i will look for compatible Amplifiers for them.
I intend to place speakers on media table or near by them as my source will be PC(HTPC)....so BS fits in them but i guess if i need good sound i should consider Floor Standers speakers too....

I am really spoiled by the options i am getting right now for Speakers.hyeah:

Thanks for suggestion and not in hurry to buy so look forward for few more before i dig in.

Cheers !

 

[ranjeetrain]

Sir what is SPL ?

Sound Pressure Level. Higher the SPL value, louder the sound.

Jbl 4428 looks perfect for the size i am looking for .....but why can't i see them in JBL site , are they discontinued model or not for sale here in India.?

Sorry, may be they are Japan Only product. I had seen them at a store in US. I didn't think about availability in India.

I also saw a pair of Wharfedale monitors playing at a mall in Delhi. I assume they are available locally. Looked like they had 15 inch woofers and sound was relatively clean, effortless and with good tonal balance. Given the fact that they were playing in virtually open air, and were doing good, I would say they were worth a look.

My main aim right now is to get Speakers first then i will look for compatible Amplifiers for them.

Good to go.

I intend to place speakers on media table or near by them as my source will be PC(HTPC)....so BS fits in them but i guess if i need good sound i should consider Floor Standers speakers too....!

Aesthetics and decoration is a personal choice and what you want you are the best to tell, but for your needs you need floor-standers or monitors with large woofers. For the genres you listen to you need big dynamics. Bookshelves with 5/6.5 inch drivers, unless expensive and very well designed, will not deliver.

 

[Jhononweed]

Sound Pressure Level. Higher the SPL value, louder the sound.



Sorry, may be they are Japan Only product. I had seen them at a store in US. I didn't think about availability in India.

I also saw a pair of Wharfedale monitors playing at a mall in Delhi. I assume they are available locally. Looked like they had 15 inch woofers and sound was relatively clean, effortless and with good tonal balance. Given the fact that they were playing in virtually open air, and were doing good, I would say they were worth a look.



Good to go.



Aesthetics and decoration is a personal choice and what you want you are the best to tell, but for your needs you need floor-standers or monitors with large woofers. For the genres you listen to you need big dynamics. Bookshelves with 5/6.5 inch drivers, unless expensive and very well designed, will not deliver.

Thanks for educating me.
So JBL 4428 is almost extinct to even look for:sad:.
Wharf's has many model and i was just reading few group deals on this forum by Hi-Fivision, Wharf's Vardus 300.They look well within the price, is it worth it and precisely where can i request for audition as i am being told " buy only what you hear ...not what you see "

Wharf's monitor speakers ..ohh dear another category of things to puzzle me
Hmmmm my intention is still to get BS but i guess Floor Standers will be cheap and better going by your and other post.I seriously don't wanna get too powerful or high energy consumption speakers....

Ranjeetrain ,can you give some suggestions about DIY speakers too?....ohh i love your signature.....:clapping:


Folks how about some Polk's/Quad's/Usher's recommendations?.....though i still have no understanding about them either but wanna grow the list:lol::lol:

 

[ranjeetrain]

So JBL 4428 is almost extinct to even look for:sad:.
Wharf's has many model and i was just reading few group deals on this forum by Hi-Fivision, Wharf's Vardus 300.They look well within the price, is it worth it and precisely where can i request for audition as i am being told " buy only what you hear ...not what you see "

Wharf's monitor speakers ..ohh dear another category of things to puzzle me

That JBL is out of list then. Try finding a dealer for Wharfys. They are very popular at entry level. Oh yes, always audition before buying. Sound is extremely subjective.

I seriously don't wanna get too powerful or high energy consumption speakers....

Can I get light? You seems to be very scared of your mom. You're the first person I have come across who is so considerate of electricity consumption. You are either an environmentalist, or an obedient son. Either way you are very good :lol: :clapping:

Back to topic, energy consumption doesn't depend on speakers as much as it does on the amp. I have been suggesting you high sensitivity speakers with large cone area, because they are more efficient and less power hungry.

Ranjeetrain ,can you give some suggestions about DIY speakers too?....ohh i love your signature.....:clapping:

I really suggest you to hear some commercial speakers first. There are many Delhites on the forum and some of them are superDIYers. If you do decide to go DIY way, you will always get support. Buy DIY is not as easy to pursue as it is to desire.

Ah, thanks, my signature is the summary of 80% of what I have learnt about sound and sound reproduction in my life. I have put it out there for anyone to take bits out of it and use it. I am glad if someone finds it helpful. Glad that you liked it.

 

[Jhononweed]

That JBL is out of list then. Try finding a dealer for Wharfys. They are very popular at entry level. Oh yes, always audition before buying. Sound is extremely subjective.



Can I get light? You seems to be very scared of your mom. You're the first person I have come across who is so considerate of electricity consumption. You are either an environmentalist, or an obedient son. Either way you are very good :lol: :clapping:

Back to topic, energy consumption doesn't depend on speakers as much as it does on the amp. I have been suggesting you high sensitivity speakers with large cone area, because they are more efficient and less power hungry.



I really suggest you to hear some commercial speakers first. There are many Delhites on the forum and some of them are superDIYers. If you do decide to go DIY way, you will always get support. Buy DIY is not as easy to pursue as it is to desire.

Ah, thanks, my signature is the summary of 80% of what I have learnt about sound and sound reproduction in my life. I have put it out there for anyone to take bits out of it and use it. I am glad if someone finds it helpful. Glad that you liked it.

How about JBL ES 100 ? It is being recommended by another poster on this thread...how about it...saw it in JBL india site.

Well my spending spree that started in Pre-Diwali time which is yet to finish( doesn't look like) and has burned my pocket for full 3 months salary for 4 LED's and some light PC components ..... yet to get speakers + rest ...can make any one an obedient son:lol::lol:

Yes i am going GREEN all out this year....want to save as much as i can on power bills....

DIY in any field has always fascinated me....and i am more than up for it but due to time/parts constraints i will give it a pass for now but will still like to get some recommendations.

Yes i am gunning for auditions but as i am first timer for hi-fi speakers...i would equip myself before some sales boy puts imaginary words in my ears

Cheers and Thanks for such a speedy reply !

 

[ab79]

hi johnonweed,
actually I am also sailing on the same type of boat if not the same boat.
I started to build an stereo set up. in my bed room.I does have an pioneer vsx505-s , bose acoustimass 5 and panasonic 42st30 for ht set up.
so first started on a hunt for speakers.I want to use pioneer to power the speakers for present.later will add a stereo amp and cd player.
after googling a lot i kef q 900, polk rti a7 ,a9,and jbl as the final contenders.I audtioned theJBL es 100 besides studio190. both are worth their price. whaferdale vardus 300 as seen in hifivision deals also seems to be good vfm.
will have to decide between these.

 

[Decadent_Spectre]

I have tastes very similar to yours (OP) except for rock which I don't care for at all.

I highly suggest something like the QSC K12 or the KW152/153. I would pick the KW152 or 153 over the K12. Will likely be a bit over 100k though but it will give you what you want guaranteed, I know because I was in your shoes once. They are active and don't need an external amp. DIY can be good but needs effort and time and is easy to screw up. What I have suggested is a relatively simple and straight forward solution, DSP would be recommended to shape the sound to your tastes. If you must keep it within 100k I would suggest the K12s.

As to greener solutions, you need power to get loud. The only "cheat" is a horn/bandpass, and they are *large* and can be expensive/difficult to build.

I would also highly recommend adding a sub later on as budget permits.

 

[hifiashok]

OP, if u have the opp. and if convenient/acceptable to DS above, u must check his rig out (since u mention u move around). he is one person i know who has done his homework and is knowledgeable/well informed/equipped too. interesting that ur tastes are similar.

also/or, if u want to go DIY (actually, custom), u can look up 'kanwar' on the forum (Zypher Labs). he builds kick a** pro-audio stuff that'll do the needful for the kind of music you listen to.

 

[Jhononweed]

ab79

hi johnonweed,
actually I am also sailing on the same type of boat if not the same boat.
I started to build an stereo set up. in my bed room.I does have an pioneer vsx505-s , bose acoustimass 5 and panasonic 42st30 for ht set up.
so first started on a hunt for speakers.I want to use pioneer to power the speakers for present.later will add a stereo amp and cd player.
after googling a lot i kef q 900, polk rti a7 ,a9,and jbl as the final contenders.I audtioned theJBL es 100 besides studio190. both are worth their price. whaferdale vardus 300 as seen in hifivision deals also seems to be good vfm.
will have to decide between these.

Where did you go for audition if you can tell me ,then that would be great help.
Wharf's Vardus 300 looks big in pictures just like rest of Floor Standing speakers...

Decadent_Spectre

I have tastes very similar to yours (OP) except for rock which I don't care for at all.

I highly suggest something like the QSC K12 or the KW152/153. I would pick the KW152 or 153 over the K12. Will likely be a bit over 100k though but it will give you what you want guaranteed, I know because I was in your shoes once. They are active and don't need an external amp. DIY can be good but needs effort and time and is easy to screw up. What I have suggested is a relatively simple and straight forward solution, DSP would be recommended to shape the sound to your tastes. If you must keep it within 100k I would suggest the K12s.

As to greener solutions, you need power to get loud. The only "cheat" is a horn/bandpass, and they are *large* and can be expensive/difficult to build.

I would also highly recommend adding a sub later on as budget permits.

Mmmm that speaker KW 152 looks so perfect ....but sadly my budget is 100K rs...can not increase more than that for speakers as keeping budget for amplifiers will be very tight.
But you said its active speakers...so i guess its costly than rest but don't active one fall a bit pale when passive speakers are used with good amplifiers?
Sorry i am still learning things.

Any other choice that you can provide me as we both have similar if not same listening taste.

hifiashok

OP, if u have the opp. and if convenient/acceptable to DS above, u must check his rig out (since u mention u move around). he is one person i know who has done his homework and is knowledgeable/well informed/equipped too. interesting that ur tastes are similar.

also/or, if u want to go DIY (actually, custom), u can look up 'kanwar' on the forum (Zypher Labs). he builds kick a** pro-audio stuff that'll do the needful for the kind of music you listen to.

Sir do you mean KW 152 or 12 recommended by Decadent_spectre ?
I don't need portable kind of equipment...its for dinning room.

I will try to hold of " Kanwar " from Zypher Labs....is he from Delhi and can make DIY stuff on order? I know i am asking just too much but DIY is what makes me itchy .....ohh about what kind of DIY speaker should i go for taking account music that i listen.
I have read DIY threads of this forum....MTM/TMT and rest type of speakers....


Lastly my listening capability is very simple - i listen trance and want tight bass to go along with.Don't crave for " Audiophile Grade " sound but anything that is ok/good to ears will be fine for me and i seriously need something that will bring me less power bills( Need a greener one - can not compromise on it ).I am not against any VFM or Mid-range speakers...just that budget is 100K rs and sadly will need to do with in that.

Hope i didn't asked to much in this post .
Thanks for all suggestions and looking for more.

Cheers !

 

[hifiashok]

Sir do you mean KW 152 or 12 recommended by Decadent_spectre ?
I don't need portable kind of equipment...its for dinning room.

i meant u will be able to arrive at the best possible fit for ur listening interests from someone like DS, since he has the knowledge, experience and exposure specifically for the genres u r interested in.

I will try to hold of " Kanwar " from Zypher Labs....is he from Delhi and can make DIY stuff on order? I know i am asking just too much but DIY is what makes me itchy .....ohh about what kind of DIY speaker should i go for taking account music that i listen.
I have read DIY threads of this forum....MTM/TMT and rest type of speakers....

he will guide u. he is from indore (some parts, like the cabinets, are built in punjab). he is presently building a cost_no_object AV/HT/2ch solution (speakers, amps, x-over, control console, etc.) for a friend who has pretty discerning needs. he takes his time, but the stuff is good. check out http://www.hifivision.com/speakers/23553-avepa-zyphers-z-21-active-subwoofer.html

Lastly my listening capability is very simple - i listen trance and want tight bass to go along with.Don't crave for " Audiophile Grade " sound but anything that is ok/good to ears will be fine for me and i seriously need something that will bring me less power bills( Need a greener one - can not compromise on it ).I am not against any VFM or Mid-range speakers...just that budget is 100K rs and sadly will need to do with in that.

Hope i didn't asked to much in this post .
Thanks for all suggestions and looking for more.

Cheers !

DS's thoughts are similar to yours. he too does not crave to be compartmentalised into the 'audiophile' term. he is clear at what he likes to listen to, how and what can get him (to work toward) this.

having said all of this, i am not too certain on ur budget. i could be wrong.

 

[Jhononweed]

Ohh sure will wait for " DS " to revert back with his inputs...
Is Kanwar member of this forum?...yes i am reading Zypher Z 21 thread....

What about drivers from Peerless / Ahuja...worth to build speaker from their drivers?

How is Wharf's Diamond 10 ?

 

[hifiashok]

Ohh sure will wait for " DS " to revert back with his inputs...
Is Kanwar member of this forum?

yes.

...yes i am reading Zypher Z 21 thread....

he is on that thread too.

What about drivers from Peerless / Ahuja...worth to build speaker from their drivers?

would not be able to comment. i have worked with Bolton, etc. incidentally, kanwarji has designed for ahuja!

How is Wharf's Diamond 10 ?

cannot comment, apologies.

 

[Decadent_Spectre]

Mmmm that speaker KW 152 looks so perfect ....but sadly my budget is 100K rs...can not increase more than that for speakers as keeping budget for amplifiers will be very tight.
But you said its active speakers...so i guess its costly than rest but don't active one fall a bit pale when passive speakers are used with good amplifiers?
Sorry i am still learning things.

Any other choice that you can provide me as we both have similar if not same listening taste.

I don't need portable kind of equipment...its for dinning room.

i seriously need something that will bring me less power bills( Need a greener one - can not compromise on it .

To address your concerns about power bills, let me reiterate going loud means lots of power except for horns/bandpass. They will draw certain amounts of power but nothing like that of an air conditioner. You should look at the literature provided that shows the power draw in amps to work out if it is acceptable to you. Equipment like the K12s are on the extreme lower end of power consumption in the pro field, the rated specs say 1.13A on 230V, I would not be concerned about power bills in the least.

Professional equipment is what you need, will it look pretty? No. Will it get the job done? Yes. There are certain companies that do custom veneer jobs on these types of speakers but they will not fall within 100k. If aesthetics is very important you need to expand the budget or settle for pretty consumer speakers with poor performance.

Active speakers when designed right are equal or even better than passives. I personally prefer passive but I don't see any disadvantages of an active speaker. Actives are a solution that has been designed to optimize the performance of a cabinet matching the driver and the amplifier and appropriately EQing/filtering the signal. There is really no downside to an active, further they usually have built in protection to make them more durable in the hands of amateurs which passives do not.

I would say that you should go look up some pro style dealers to get prices and have a listen to things like QSC,JBL,EV,Martin,EAW and so forth. For you I would pick the K12 because it is known to be a good performer and a VFM option which fits the budget. It won't go as loud as the KWs but will still sound good and do the job.

If you want the best you can get in budget I suggest the 4pi from pi speakers. Use the 2226 and a DE250. It is DIY though, assembled will be out of the budget. You will need to import it. Alternatively ask Kanwar what he can do for you. I would insist on a 15" for the mid/woofer. The JBL 2226 is expensive but a very solid performer. Alternatively look at 18 sound drivers, I have used some and have found them to have good results.

One last note, a speaker is usually not meant to perform that well below 60-80Hz, pushing it hard below this is a bad idea. A sub is recommended if you want the lower frequency stuff. I know this adds to the budget and power requirements but these are just the facts. You can get away using it on the lower end for low SPLs but not if you want to play loud as you will risk damage to the speaker.