Upgrading Dac or improving streamer

[renjith lal]

A ddc is basically a reclocker with better clocks inside. Generally i would say that a good dac, a good external clock and a good streamer is adequate and enough. A DDC is a flexible option for those who dont want to get expensive external clocks, those who play from pc or laptop, and those whose dacs dont accept external clocks. Mind that clocks are present everywhere in a digital system. Sotm sms200 ultra neo is a streamer and can accept external clocks also. I would say to start with a dac and then streamer. As time goes by, can experimemt with ddc and external clocks

Ok, I got your point.
Thanks.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Thanks for sharing your journey in getting the perfect amp. Happy to know that are very happy with the purchase.
In my case most of the time I never get fully satisfied.
Products sold directly by Designers are good value in most of the cases for sure.
I agree with you on cost part, distributor, duties, dealer and logistic costs may add up to more than 50%



That's true, good clock costs a lot. If you look at brands like DCS their DACs are expensive and many users say if you add good external clock it
improves audio performance. DACs which accepts external clock input will be a good option.

Strength of the chain depends on the strength of weakest link, hence everything in the chain should be good to get best out of the system.

Do we need a DDC when we have a good streamer and DAC?
Most streamers dont give I2S output I guess, are you suggesting good DDC due to this reason?

I've read that when compared to direct usb output from a pc or mac mini, adding a DDC has given significant gains. There is one schiit model for not much money, called the schiit eitr which gets some very positive reviews. Considering the price, it might be worth a try

 

[renjith lal]

I've read that when compared to direct usb output from a pc or mac mini, adding a DDC has given significant gains. There is one schiit model for not much money, called the schiit eitr which gets some very positive reviews. Considering the price, it might be worth a try

In my case I have a dedicated server and I use it as Roon core. Hence I use ethernet output to pi2aes streamer.
Basically I don't have Usb output from music server. DDC need USB output from server or computer. That is one issue .

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

In my case I have a dedicated server and I use it as Roon core. Hence I use ethernet output to pi2aes streamer.
Basically I don't have Usb output from music server. DDC need USB output from server or computer. That is one issue .

That is exactly how I was running my chain when I was still using it

A Intel NUC as core, music library on a NAS, and a metrum ambre as roon end point via Ethernet. It did sound great, but too many bloody LPSU's in the chain

One for the network switch, one for the nuc, one for the Nas. The chain was so long it started at the door, and ended behind the dac

So put everything back under the bed, till have a bigger room, so I don't trip over the bloody things, and loose my front teeth

Anyways if you are not using usb, then I would hazard a guess that a external DDC might not really improve on the sound. But Iam not sure either.

 

[firearm12]

In my case I have a dedicated server and I use it as Roon core. Hence I use ethernet output to pi2aes streamer.
Basically I don't have Usb output from music server. DDC need USB output from server or computer. That is one issue .

Not always the case, high end ones do come with coax inputs as well but really that should not be a concern. Decide on a dac first.

So put everything back under the bed, till have a bigger room, so I don't trip over the bloody things, and loose my front teeth

I am thinking of same but i dont have space under my bed also. I want to see a clean room with max two equipments. Age does make a person wise

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Not always the case, high end ones do come with coax inputs as well but really that should not be a concern. Decide on a dac first.



I am thinking of same but i dont have space under my bed also. I want to see a clean room with max two equipments. Age does make a person wise

You can always send over to me....for err...safe keeping

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

I won't be back home for sometime more, but thought I'd just add that I have a m2tech Hiface evo usb to spdif converter, and their matching external clock to try these vacations. As my dac sounds better via coaxial than usb. Iam planning on running audirvana on a upscale audio modified mac mini with a LPSU. Just to give it one last shot with a slightly shorter chain. Now if anyone says, that the m2tech also perform better with a LPSU driving them. Then I will hang up my boots on digital steaming and stick with local CD and vinyl playback

 

[firearm12]

Now if anyone says, that the m2tech also perform better with a LPSU driving them. Then I will hang up my boots on digital steaming and stick with local CD and vinyl playback

Actually a good psu will help no matter digital or analog.


PS:- imo psu can matter more than the chips and components used for processing sound. This is especially true of very low voltage devices such as reclockers, dacs. So remember all that matters is psu. Its the secret of audio.

 

[renjith lal]

That is exactly how I was running my chain when I was still using it

A Intel NUC as core, music library on a NAS, and a metrum ambre as roon end point via Ethernet. It did sound great, but too many bloody LPSU's in the chain

One for the network switch, one for the nuc, one for the Nas. The chain was so long it started at the door, and ended behind the dac

So put everything back under the bed, till have a bigger room, so I don't trip over the bloody things, and loose my front teeth

Anyways if you are not using usb, then I would hazard a guess that a external DDC might not really improve on the sound. But Iam not sure either.

True, issue is too many boxes and lps. I also hate too many boxes.
Now if you want a single box solution you may need to pay too much.

Actually a good psu will help no matter digital or analog.


PS:- imo psu can matter more than the chips and components used for processing sound. This is especially true of very low voltage devices such as reclockers, dacs. So remember all that matters is psu. Its the secret of audio.

Quality of power play a major role.
Can you suggest some high value lpsu?

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

Actually a good psu will help no matter digital or analog.


PS:- imo psu can matter more than the chips and components used for processing sound. This is especially true of very low voltage devices such as reclockers, dacs. So remember all that matters is psu. Its the secret of audio.

I fully agree....I've found immense improvements with linear power supplies...more clarity and blacker back grounds. Its only when we add a LPSU do we realize the amount of noise being added by a switchmode powersupply.

There is a gentleman in Poland, who is making a living on making LPSU's for the blue sound node 2i. And everyone using them in the UK, are full of praise at the improvements.

Quality of power play a major role.
Can you suggest some high value lpsu?

There are tons of them out there renjith...for value...the teradak from China via aliexpress comes to mind. It has multiple choosable output voltages via a dail in the back. And a lot of folks have been running their complete digital chains out of it, as it has multiple outputs of various voltages to power everything.

The OP has the wharfedales, so yes it will be quite a revelation so to speak. Probably the Brits got used to the warm laid back stuff or maybe it's some French-Brit thing. I was also quite sceptical about all this Focal brightness, but they are not bright. Very clear, detailed, transparent, musical, hefty.

Take Klipsch for example, especially their mid/low end gear, that's bright. Not the Aria series. I was grinning even when I heard them just out of the box.

I also have some not so old Monitor Audio gear in my HT. They are brilliant like the focals. Lots of similarities.

Thanks for sharing that mayank

As I've mentioned before, I've heard neither. But glad you could clear the air, about the apprehensions about focals brightness , and also monitor audios

 

[firearm12]

Quality of power play a major role.
Can you suggest some high value lpsu?

Psu market in india is hopeless. Perhaps should ask our DIYer friends on the forum to build good psus especially for rpi based products and low voltage dc based devices. In my experience there is no single best lpsu. All will sound different. Its just a matter of taste. They say allo shanti is very good, although clean but it sounds thin to me and less meaty. You never know what will suit. You cannot say this one is best of them all.

 

[Yelamanchili manohar]

One can Google Paul hynes or sean jacobs....not cheap but

 

[sidvee]

Renjith,
If you have the time see if you can listen to these Acqua Acoustic DAC's at Davidmichaelaudio in Royal Oak. They seem to have good pricing on these demos. I used to frequent this store a lot, and that is where I heard the Harbeth brand first, back in 2005.

SPECIALS | davidmichaelaudio

www.davidmichaelaudio.com

Cheers,
Sid

 

[renjith lal]

Psu market in india is hopeless. Perhaps should ask our DIYer friends on the forum to build good psus especially for rpi based products and low voltage dc based devices. In my experience there is no single best lpsu. All will sound different. Its just a matter of taste. They say allo shanti is very good, although clean but it sounds thin to me and less meaty. You never know what will suit. You cannot say this one is best of them all.

I am using Allo Shanti to power pi2aes raspberry pie hat. I have not used other lpsu, didn't know that it sounds thin.
Will try some other brand and check how it compares.

I fully agree....I've found immense improvements with linear power supplies...more clarity and blacker back grounds. Its only when we add a LPSU do we realize the amount of noise being added by a switchmode powersupply.

There is a gentleman in Poland, who is making a living on making LPSU's for the blue sound node 2i. And everyone using them in the UK, are full of praise at the improvements.


There are tons of them out there renjith...for value...the teradak from China via aliexpress comes to mind. It has multiple choosable output voltages via a dail in the back. And a lot of folks have been running their complete digital chains out of it, as it has multiple outputs of various voltages to power everything.


Thanks for sharing that mayank

As I've mentioned before, I've heard neither. But glad you could clear the air, about the apprehensions about focals brightness , and also monitor audios

Will try those, thanks.

Renjith,
If you have the time see if you can listen to these Acqua Acoustic DAC's at Davidmichaelaudio in Royal Oak. They seem to have good pricing on these demos. I used to frequent this store a lot, and that is where I heard the Harbeth brand first, back in 2005.

SPECIALS | davidmichaelaudio

www.davidmichaelaudio.com

Cheers,
Sid

Sidvee,

I know David he is a nice guy. I got Luxman from him.
He still deals with Harbeth. He deal with many good brands including Nagra.
I will check with him.

Thanks

 

[sydney]

This seems one of the top streamers today better than DCS & lumin. However i have heard none

MU1 - Grimm Audio

The MU1 is the ultimate digital music source. Combined with the LS1, it forms a peerlessly elegant High-End audio system. We wanted to develop the most accurate audio source we could imagine. In our experience, the human hearing system shows an incredible sensitivity to anomalies. Even...

www.grimmaudio.com

 

[renjith lal]

This seems one of the top streamers today better than DCS & lumin. However i have heard none

MU1 - Grimm Audio

The MU1 is the ultimate digital music source. Combined with the LS1, it forms a peerlessly elegant High-End audio system. We wanted to develop the most accurate audio source we could imagine. In our experience, the human hearing system shows an incredible sensitivity to anomalies. Even...

www.grimmaudio.com

Looks very good but super expensive.

 

[bloredude]

Looks very good but super expensive.

In a recent review the kind of words Hans Beekhuyzen used for this, one would think they are worth the asking price. Specially considering how many boxes it eliminates. But yes, it does seem to be on the expensive side.