320 kbps MP3 vs Original Audio CDs

[doors666]

if one is listening to music with the intension of finding faults, he will find it. I personally don't find any difference between a high quality mp3 and a audio cd.

Beyond a decent stereo setup, say within 50k all components included, the benefit of someone buying expensive stuff is only to the high end equipment making company who thrive on a audiophile's fault finding missions.

The intention is not to find fault with the music, but to hear the music as it was intended by the artist.

try wav files and mp3 on an ipod, with decent headphones, not the free ones (what u pay is what u get, well, mostly) and you probably will be able to make out the difference.

and of course the guy who buys the system.
extending your logic, why spend 50k, when a 15k mini compo system can give so many features and decent sound quality.

 

[ranojoy]

why spend 50k, when a 15k mini compo system can give so many features and decent sound quality.

..... and hide the imperfections in mp3 much better than the 50k system....:yahoo:

 

[madbullram]

Guys, lets not loose dfocus here, I am comparing this in my Car Environment not in a 2 channel setup.

My entire take of 320 and CDA sounding same was in a car environment, which was proved wrong for me. please keep that in mind environment

 

[sachin_k5]

Maybe "fault finding" was a harsh term i used. I am saying that if a significant level of clarity is achieved, we should be listening to enjoy rather than listening to note differences which could be very minor.

 

[rams1977]

It may have to do with quality of ACD as well. Try the same with 'Sony BMG' like 'Vaaranam Ayiram' and 'Kandasamy'.

PS: you said you want an audition. any updates?

 

[Shuvc]

I am saying that if a significant level of clarity is achieved, we should be listening to enjoy rather than listening to note differences which could be very minor.

Fully subscribe to this point of view wrt music - personally.

Butttttt ... I do respect the fact that priorities are different for different people for different things in life. Many of us have this urge for perfection in other areas of life.

- Some people just won't drink a cup of tea unless it is absolutely made to their expectations. For others, just tea would do
- I've personally seen a person who would refuse to have his fried egg, unless it was perfectly round, sunny side up and no a speck of 'brown' on the egg white. Many of us enjoy any anda fry at road-side shops.
- For some, every noise, niggle in their car is an issue. They are always on the lookout for such things while others enjoy their cars with some minor imperfections.

... the list goes on.

So, each one of us probably have our areas of no/minimum-compromise - which is absolutely fine.

 

[allajunaki]

My entire take of 320 and CDA sounding same was in a car environment, which was proved wrong for me. please keep that in mind environment

Is because you like this song and listen to it often enough to notice subtle differences? Perhaps u didnt notice it earlier because the earlier one was one of those tracks you werent very familiar with.

 

[thevortex]

Well, I was hearing this song called Nenje Nenje, where in there is a nice soothing echo of the singer, this was hardly audible in the mp3 but soothing and clear in CDA, also the instruments were more crisp and bass was tight.

I know technically it shouldn't but I cant deny what I am hearing and experiencing right?

Well, I have the same song, Ram and it sounds exactly the same in MP3 as well as FLAC format. As long as its a 320 Kbps rip, I dont think there is too much of a difference.

I have listened to high quality MP3 rips of Delhi 6 many, many times and do not find much difference when compared to the original WAV file.

 

[venkatcr]

Ram, one of the best articles (in my opinion) has been written by John Atkinson on this. Please read Stereophile: MP3 vs AAC vs FLAC vs CD for a comparison of MP3 vs FLAC vs Audio CD. He starts by summarily dismissing MP3 and then goes to prove why he does that.

Cheers

 

[madbullram]

Hi Venkat,
Thats a very nice one. But the thing is, i thought we wont hear the difference in a car environment. It was an eye opener for me, even my wife was able to tell the difference between the 320 kbps and cda

 

[madbullram]

Well, I have the same song, Ram and it sounds exactly the same in MP3 as well as FLAC format. As long as its a 320 Kbps rip, I dont think there is too much of a difference.

I have listened to high quality MP3 rips of Delhi 6 many, many times and do not find much difference when compared to the original WAV file.

Did u listen in a car? Can you hear "Vizhi mudidum" song from Ayan?

I am coming to conclusion that Pioneer is the culprit in the way it handles mp3 and CDA

 

[thevortex]

Ram, one of the best articles (in my opinion) has been written by John Atkinson on this. Please read Stereophile: MP3 vs AAC vs FLAC vs CD for a comparison of MP3 vs FLAC vs Audio CD. He starts by summarily dismissing MP3 and then goes to prove why he does that.

Cheers

I wonder why they did not consider LAME encoded MP3s at 320 Kbps for this testing. That sounds suspicious to me.

What do you think, Venkat? Is there easily discernible, audible difference between a 320 kbps MP3 rip and, say, a FLAC file?

 

[thevortex]

Did u listen in a car? Can you hear "Vizhi mudidum" song from Ayan?

I am coming to conclusion that Pioneer is the culprit in the way it handles mp3 and CDA

The Blaupunkt system that I have in my car came from the showroom and I did not bother upgrading it as I really dont do any sort of critical listening while driving. It is just simple radio or maybe a few favourites. The listening system there is far inferior to the setup I have at home.

'Vizhi Moodi' from Ayan is a good, soulful number that I have listened to a lot of times at home. I do not recall if I have listened to the MP3 version as well. I have listened to the FLAC form definitely.

 

[venkatcr]

What do you think, Venkat? Is there easily discernible, audible difference between a 320 kbps MP3 rip and, say, a FLAC file?

It will sound obnoxious if I say yes offhand. Frankly, it needs extended comparison over a fixed time period. I have never had that opportunity. Maybe a few of us could spend a few evenings together and do a comparison.

But there must be something is the concept of a lossy compression that John writes some vehemently about.

But I must say this, I have had the opportunity to listen to some FLAC files (Kitaro, Bee Gees, Enigma, Tamil Songs) in the recent past, and have been thoroughly impressed. Even on my stupid laptop they sound good. I have never felt those kind of goose pimples when I listen to an MP3.

I have stopped ripping to MP3 and am now ripping everything to FLAC.

Cheers

 

[venkatcr]

But the thing is, i thought we wont hear the difference in a car environment. It was an eye opener for me, even my wife was able to tell the difference between the 320 kbps and cda

Maybe you are lucky enough to have a very good system in your car?

Cheers

 

[suri]

Maybe you are lucky enough to have a very good system in your car?

Cheers

well, then, in absolute terms - mp3 does not cut the ice?

this is a fact, and that is why there are lossless compression codecs which aim to serve the discerning (audiophile) public

as a rider - no compression is the best = CDA

 

[nitinbose]

Well, I was hearing this song called Nenje Nenje, where in there is a nice soothing echo of the singer, this was hardly audible in the mp3 but soothing and clear in CDA, also the instruments were more crisp and bass was tight.

I know technically it shouldn't but I cant deny what I am hearing and experiencing right?

There are quite a number of factors that affect the quality of MP3 or any compressed audio/video. The software used should be of a reasonable quality type such as Nero or eejay mp3 encoder etc. Use MP3pro whenever possible. Other types of MP3 such as LAME might not be that good.
The settings should also be checked: Try to use the highest sampling rate such as 48Khz and normal Stereo, instead of joint-stereo. Joint stereo encoding makes a note of sounds common in both channels and encodes them only once, instead of being completely separate. This may make some special effects disappear!

Some hardware may also find it difficult to reproduce the MP3 VBR encoded files. The best way is to try the different options and see which suits you.

The final word: Obviously, MP3 at 320kbps would only be as good as CDA, but never equally good.

Thanks,

Nitin.

 

[alpha1]

Why do audiophiles abhor double blind tests?

 

[psychotropic]

a completely different can of worms here i think there has been quite some discussion on this in other threads.

Why do audiophiles abhor double blind tests?

 

[thevortex]

Hmm.. quite a few here probably have good hearing. Personally I find it very hard to distinguish between 320 Kbps MP3s and FLAC files. As mentioned earlier, differences are easily apparently only when the FLAC file is played through cPlay. Not otherwise.

Just out of interest, I looked through a few places exploring the same subject. Here are the links:

Poll: Audible Difference between FLAC and 320kbps MP3? - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio

ABX Test of 320kbps VS FLAC - Results - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio

What is your opinion on 320 kbps MP3 LAME vs. Lossless FLAC on your setup? - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio

Hydrogenaudio Forums > Is mp3@320kbps really transparent?