A different take on hifi

[venkatcr]

Guys,

A few day ago I posted a note on DACs in the thread on Wadia iTransport. It is interesting reading.

Please go through posting number 9 in the following thread.

http://www.hifivision.com/mp3-mp4-wma-players-accessories/1508-wadia-itransport.html

I am not arguing for or against anything. It is just my view point. Just to give an example.

As part of auditioning, I once heard a Wadia CD Transport connected to a Wadia pre amp, and a Wadia poweramp. These were connected to the diminutive B&W 303, through cables that were heavier than the speaker !! I played Shankar Mahadevan's Breathless, and Kitaro's Kojiki. The sound was so good, the demo guy tried to steal my CDs !! This was in an AV exhibition.

More recently, I spent a whole afternoon auditioning the Wharfedale 9.6 speakers. These were connected by 32 gauge cables to a power amplifier (Pulz 250) from a company called R&S Electronics in Mumbai. The source was a ordinary Yamaha CD player connected to the power amp through Pulz's Pulz 100 pre amp.

I used this system for over 5 hours without any fatigue. Believe me, the speakers disappeared completely, and the sound from the singer and the instruments were floating in the air. I was playing a carnatic CD with a singer, a veena, a mridungam, and a tampura. I was shocked once, when I heard the veena playing next to my left ear. I was sitting some 10 feet away from the system.

My conclusion? very simply this. Just specs may not have much value. It is the careful mixing of source, amplification, and speakers that have some chance of taking you to audio nirvana. Some really inexpensive systems can provide music as good as the multi-thousand dollar ones.

 

[naveenkumar]

Hi,

Does anyone know the Price and availability in India?

Naveen

 

[non conformist]

If you liked the system 1000 than you'll def find the 1200 to be better in every respect.
But the best tannoy or may be the best spk that i've ever heard is the tannoy system 215. Infact with my choice of music, I prefer them over the tannoy westministers, B&W 800/801/802 or AvantGarde Duo's. Which I feel though very exp are still real world spks & beyond which things just keep on getting insane.

As for MC2. I??ve had the amp only for a few days & so it??s still being broken in. But my initial impression is that it is extremely neutral & has awesome power (300 @ 8ohms). The sound goes through a major change & displays the character of the pre/ source & cables etc.

The pre that I??m looking at is the quad, primare, krell, or if I kill myself the gamut.

I??ve not yet fig out the cables but I??ll mostly go for some transparent.

As for the DAC I??m thinking Apogee mini, as it??s the only reasonably priced stuff available in India.
Cheers

Best of luck on your quest for audio nirvana. I've heard good things about the Apogee mini, although I would still advise you pursue the benchmark DAC or Grace Audio Dacs (as they perform similarly to the benchmarks but feature a remote control). Both DAC's also function as pres

I am personally looking at the Tannoy Ellipse 10iDP which has recently been reviewed very well in Sound on Sound as a possible upgrade path from my current setup (a few yrs from now). The Blue Sky Big Blue system and higher end Genelecs are also quite interesting as upgrades, both are pricey but are supposed to be awesome. Adam Audio also has some really good systems, which are admittedly pricey.

Alternatively, also take a look at Limpinski speakers which have reviewed very well on stereophile, supposed to be at par with Wilson Watt Puppies in terms of sound quality (minus some of the bass weight). Again not cheap, but supposedly very high quality.

 

[neo]

Thanks! NC. why do you imply for the bechmark etc against the apogee??

I've heard the Ellipse (not the IdP version)they are good.

As we are on studio Monitors & the active ones there is another good option.
Compared below with M-audio along with pricing in INR:-

Specs of M-Audio:
Drivers- 6? X 2 Woofer with 1? Titanium Dome Tweeter

36htz to 21khz response
115 db max output
Built in DAC's
Built in analogue volume controls
Lots of connectivity (SPDIF, AES, Balanced, TRS)
Room tuning features

Power- 200Watts Total (Less than 0.1% at 50Watts)

11.1 Kgs

Rs. 92,000 retail


Specs of Tannoy Reveal 8D:

Drivers- 8? X 1 treated paper pulp woofer with 1? Titanium dome SuperTweeter

45Hz to 51kHz response

118 dB max output

No built-in DAC

Built in analogue volume control

Lots of connectivity (SPDIF RCA, XLR/Jack)

Room tuning features at its best

Free Room tuning PC based software name ?? ACTIVE assist

Power- LF 120W + HF- 60W

Distortion- less than 0.4% (Full Power)

16 Kgs

Rs. 72,000 retail


On that front sadly tannoy now has stopped making studio monitiors with more than 10" drivers.

 

[non conformist]

Thanks! NC. why do you imply for the bechmark etc against the apogee??

I've heard the Ellipse (not the IdP version)they are good.

As we are on studio Monitors & the active ones there is another good option.
Compared below with M-audio along with pricing in INR:-

Specs of M-Audio:
Drivers- 6? X 2 Woofer with 1? Titanium Dome Tweeter

36htz to 21khz response
115 db max output
Built in DAC's
Built in analogue volume controls
Lots of connectivity (SPDIF, AES, Balanced, TRS)
Room tuning features

Power- 200Watts Total (Less than 0.1% at 50Watts)

11.1 Kgs

Rs. 92,000 retail


Specs of Tannoy Reveal 8D:

Drivers- 8? X 1 treated paper pulp woofer with 1? Titanium dome SuperTweeter

45Hz to 51kHz response

118 dB max output

No built-in DAC

Built in analogue volume control

Lots of connectivity (SPDIF RCA, XLR/Jack)

Room tuning features at its best

Free Room tuning PC based software name ?? ACTIVE assist

Power- LF 120W + HF- 60W

Distortion- less than 0.4% (Full Power)

16 Kgs

Rs. 72,000 retail


On that front sadly tannoy now has stopped making studio monitiors with more than 10" drivers.

hi, I recommend the benchmarks as they also have a pre built in and have been reviewed fantastically by every pro mag that I know of, as well as several consumer mags. Never heard either of them to be honest, you might be able to judge better if you have heard them in action. Another alternative is the Bel Canto DAC3 which retails for approx. 2,500USD and comes with a remote. Its supposed to have a sweeter presentation than the Benchmark and is supposed to be really good.

Its funny that I seriously considered the Reveal 8D but opted for the M Audios for 1 reason: I read a review that indicated that mixes travel better from the Tannoys to other systems as opposed to the other way round. In other words, it can be extremely harsh and critical of recordings as a playback system whereas the M Audios came across as a friendlier playback system.

 

[neo]

Guys,

A few day ago I posted a note on DACs in the thread on Wadia iTransport. It is interesting reading.

Please go through posting number 9 in the following thread.

http://www.hifivision.com/mp3-mp4-wma-players-accessories/1508-wadia-itransport.html

I am not arguing for or against anything. It is just my view point. Just to give an example.

As part of auditioning, I once heard a Wadia CD Transport connected to a Wadia pre amp, and a Wadia poweramp. These were connected to the diminutive B&W 303, through cables that were heavier than the speaker !! I played Shankar Mahadevan's Breathless, and Kitaro's Kojiki. The sound was so good, the demo guy tried to steal my CDs !! This was in an AV exhibition.

More recently, I spent a whole afternoon auditioning the Wharfedale 9.6 speakers. These were connected by 32 gauge cables to a power amplifier (Pulz 250) from a company called R&S Electronics in Mumbai. The source was a ordinary Yamaha CD player connected to the power amp through Pulz's Pulz 100 pre amp.

I used this system for over 5 hours without any fatigue. Believe me, the speakers disappeared completely, and the sound from the singer and the instruments were floating in the air. I was playing a carnatic CD with a singer, a veena, a mridungam, and a tampura. I was shocked once, when I heard the veena playing next to my left ear. I was sitting some 10 feet away from the system.

My conclusion? very simply this. Just specs may not have much value. It is the careful mixing of source, amplification, and speakers that have some chance of taking you to audio nirvana. Some really inexpensive systems can provide music as good as the multi-thousand dollar ones.

I've read the post & given my comments on it.

Can't agree more on mere specs front.

I've heard a lot of set ups where the font end is way better than the spk which makes you jump from your seat & scratch your head.

As for the mid priced set up yes vodoo does happen at times but if you compare it to a diff set up at the same moment IMO only than can one make a better judgement.

Finally the most imp aspect is to enjoy music above anything else.
Cheers

 

[neo]

Thanks again! NC.

The Bel Canto is on top of my list but again not available in india & also very expensive.

Yes the tannoy monitors are very revealing & i guess it is aslo a matter of choice. But for me i've always liked neutral & revealing sound.
Regards

 

[non conformist]

Thanks again! NC.

The Bel Canto is on top of my list but again not available in india & also very expensive.

Yes the tannoy monitors are very revealing & i guess it is aslo a matter of choice. But for me i've always liked neutral & revealing sound.
Regards

Hi Neo, I agree that if you like the sound, you should go for it

 

[non conformist]

I've read the post & given my comments on it.

Can't agree more on mere specs front.

I've heard a lot of set ups where the font end is way better than the spk which makes you jump from your seat & scratch your head.

As for the mid priced set up yes vodoo does happen at times but if you compare it to a diff set up at the same moment IMO only than can one make a better judgement.

Finally the most imp aspect is to enjoy music above anything else.
Cheers

I agree that specs dont always mean much in real world settings. What matters at the end of the day is how it all synergizes together and how it sounds. Thats one thing I like about integrated actives, you dont have to worry about system synergy

 

[arj]

As part of auditioning, I once heard a Wadia CD Transport connected to a Wadia pre amp, and a Wadia poweramp. These were connected to the diminutive B&W 303, through cables that were heavier than the speaker !!

wadia pre and power ...do you have any link to these? my understanding was they make only digital equipment (cdp/cdt/dac/adc)

 

[venkatcr]

wadia pre and power ...do you have any link to these? my understanding was they make only digital equipment (cdp/cdt/dac/adc)

This was in an Exposition and that is what I was given to understand by the exhibitor. It is possible he had amplification equipment from another company, but since it was a Wadi stall I assumed it was all their equipment. I am sorry for the error.

Cheers

 

[arj]

oh ok wadia's technology although do manage some amount of pre-amplification in the digital domain for direct driving of power amps.

 

[neetant]

Guys,

A few day ago I posted a note on DACs in the thread on Wadia iTransport. It is interesting reading.

Please go through posting number 9 in the following thread.

http://www.hifivision.com/mp3-mp4-wma-players-accessories/1508-wadia-itransport.html

I am not arguing for or against anything. It is just my view point. Just to give an example.

As part of auditioning, I once heard a Wadia CD Transport connected to a Wadia pre amp, and a Wadia poweramp. These were connected to the diminutive B&W 303, through cables that were heavier than the speaker !! I played Shankar Mahadevan's Breathless, and Kitaro's Kojiki. The sound was so good, the demo guy tried to steal my CDs !! This was in an AV exhibition.

More recently, I spent a whole afternoon auditioning the Wharfedale 9.6 speakers. These were connected by 32 gauge cables to a power amplifier (Pulz 250) from a company called R&S Electronics in Mumbai. The source was a ordinary Yamaha CD player connected to the power amp through Pulz's Pulz 100 pre amp.

I used this system for over 5 hours without any fatigue. Believe me, the speakers disappeared completely, and the sound from the singer and the instruments were floating in the air. I was playing a carnatic CD with a singer, a veena, a mridungam, and a tampura. I was shocked once, when I heard the veena playing next to my left ear. I was sitting some 10 feet away from the system.

My conclusion? very simply this. Just specs may not have much value. It is the careful mixing of source, amplification, and speakers that have some chance of taking you to audio nirvana. Some really inexpensive systems can provide music as good as the multi-thousand dollar ones.

Hi .....


I already have a nad326 and wharfedale 9.2 diamonds... I am planning to buy a CDP ...

Need your help and pov on the following

1) is a CDP better than a DAC ..if yes... then which will go with the my current combo

2) i have auditioned the marantz CD 6003 and Azur 550...with wharfedale diamonds and nad amp..


the cds used were (Nusrat with Micheal Brooks and Dire Straits)
the following are the key differences...

Marantz

1) Marantz sounds thinner compared to the azur 550 (less depth in vocals)

2) Display is much better as compared to azur

3) USB and Phono availiable in marantz

4) cost vth bill rs.23000/ and vthout bill rs.20000/-


Cambridge

1) Fuller and warm sound... good vocals more roomier i would say

2) display not so great

3) no usb or phono..

4) cost rs. 25000/-

finally cambridge dacmagic wasnt availible (would be avl in 2-3 days) and will audition that also..(cost of dac magic rs.23000 approx)..

kindly suggest and helping me .. in deciding whether a cdp will do or the DAC will do .. and vch should be my preffered choice(budget till rs. 25 k).. my music more new age and fusion and ghazals....(I am currently using a philips dvd/cd player)

posting my question in the right forum as mentioned by mr.madbullram

Regards

Neetant

 

[gobble]

Just to give you a quick reference -
Marantz CD6002 is 14.5K in Dubai and HK. It has been available for 18k in India.
Paying 10K extra fro a marginal improvement over the 6002 is not worth it.

The Marantz does have a full bodied sound with good tonality. Are you sure you are not confusing depth of sound stage for body and tone? In fact the CA 640cV2 has always been described as thinner and drier that the Marantz series. Otherwise what you say about instruments having more room in CA tallies with what I heard, compared to Marantz.

If you are scouting and researching check out pairing a Buffalo Sabre32 DAC with a standalone transport .. hows that for temptation? :licklips:

Regards

 

[neetant]

Just to give you a quick reference -
Marantz CD6002 is 14.5K in Dubai and HK. It has been available for 18k in India.
Paying 10K extra fro a marginal improvement over the 6002 is not worth it.

The Marantz does have a full bodied sound with good tonality. Are you sure you are not confusing depth of sound stage for body and tone? In fact the CA 640cV2 has always been described as thinner and drier that the Marantz series. Otherwise what you say about instruments having more room in CA tallies with what I heard, compared to Marantz.

If you are scouting and researching check out pairing a Buffalo Sabre32 DAC with a standalone transport .. hows that for temptation? :licklips:

Regards

Thanks Gobble...

Marantz 6002 not in stock but dealers claim to sell it for Rs.15800/-...

when i heard the marantz.. the vocals were suppressive ..not open/roomier... but in cambridge they were not suppressive.. they were open and more warmer...infact i would say the vocals were much better in the cambridge....

the temptation looks good.. will have to find a dealer in mumbai for the same... do u know ne....

regards

Neetant

 

[gobble]

Thanks Gobble...

Marantz 6002 not in stock but dealers claim to sell it for Rs.15800/-...

when i heard the marantz.. the vocals were suppressive ..not open/roomier... but in cambridge they were not suppressive.. they were open and more warmer...infact i would say the vocals were much better in the cambridge....

the temptation looks good.. will have to find a dealer in mumbai for the same... do u know ne....

regards

Neetant

Was the IC different with marantz from what was used on CA?
I did speak to a distie in Mumbai he was offering at 18K, then I decided on picking the same from Coimbatore dealer. Refex Pro Chennai distie might ship it to Mumbai. You dont really need local pickup.

Regards

 

[neetant]

Was the IC different with marantz from what was used on CA?
I did speak to a distie in Mumbai he was offering at 18K, then I decided on picking the same from Coimbatore dealer. Refex Pro Chennai distie might ship it to Mumbai. You dont really need local pickup.

Regards

Hi..i havent understood the ic bit in ur question.. and the last bit... not clear..

 

[gobble]

Hi..i havent understood the ic bit in ur question.. and the last bit... not clear..

IC==inter-connect cable.

Courier it from chennai is what I meant.

Regards

 

[neetant]

IC==inter-connect cable.

Courier it from chennai is what I meant.

Regards

Got it chief.... :lol:


it was the same cable..... for the cdps...

regards

Neetant