Few thoughts on music and live performance.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Second-hand information, but, from what I see on the net, Bangalore Carnatic music and lecdem frequency has increased in recent years

 

[Nikhil]

I attend live music concerts regularly and quite frankly the standards of live music performances in India is very basic. Lots of room for improvement. In western music bands usually the drums are so loud the mic volumes are turned up so that the vocals or other instruments can be heard leading to feedback and other issues. Still waiting for some sense to make an appearance in many of these concerts. In that vein performances of Indian classical music is much more simple due to a simple arrangement of mic systems for playback.

I'm not saying that there are no good setups. It's just that the majority of performances are poorly setup. The performances come through very flawed equipment which are sometimes wrong for the type of music. However there is improvement taking place. We do have the opportunity to listen to some great performances now and then. Many of our city performance halls and auditoriums are being used and abused for all kinds of multi purpose functions. The acoustics of many venues need to be improved greatly.

Having said all that a live performance is a different experience altogether. There are mistakes made and improvisations done on the fly that either enhance and spoil the performance. Venue acoustics affect the sound in interesting ways. Recordings are never meant to duplicate the live performance. People who remember the old "MTV Unplugged" series can appreciate this. When you are "live" you can't fool the audience. Today's recorded music have some sounds that are synthesized and can. Never be duplicated in a real concert setting. Is it better or worse? Hard to tell. They are just differrent.

 

[himadri]

HI
My 2 cents based on personal experience.By far the best sound that I have heard were unamplified concerts at home or at small mehfil settings ( for indian music).My home stereo system sounds sterile in comparision.
For western jazz/rock etc I used to think that open air amplified concerts that I had heard were better than closed auditorium amplified ones , till I attended 2 concerts at St Andrews Auditorium mumbai - they sounded better than open air ones.
Cheers

 

[gobble]

I attend live music concerts regularly and quite frankly the standards of live music performances in India is very basic. Lots of room for improvement.
... It's just that the majority of performances are poorly setup. The performances come through very flawed equipment which are sometimes wrong for the type of music. However there is improvement taking place. We do have the opportunity to listen to some great performances now and then. Many of our city performance halls and auditoriums are being used and abused for all kinds of multi purpose functions. The acoustics of many venues need to be improved greatly. .

Thats part of the larger problem of lack of spaces in urban or semi urban settings in India - be it traffic free open spaces for lounging without shopping in a non-commercial setting outdoors, or playgrounds for children or sports arenas with TT/Baddy/Volley courts as is the lack of auditoriums with good acoustics for cultural events. Every square foot is captured by builders or advertising hoardings lakes are filled up to bring up high-rise buildings in colllusion with the corrupt and dirty muncipalty work culture all across India. No planning is done for urban spaces in our country.

Having been to concerts at the Music Academy and elsewhere in Chennai, I must agree with you in part.But here in Bangalore, Chowdaiah Memorial Hall isn't half as bad and there have been some good concerts there.Over and above that, I just love the open air concerts held at the Fort High School grounds during Ramanavami.

Fort high school ground unfortunately has the sound of buses in the background and the occassional marriage band baaja n the neighboring road has ruined many a moment during a performance.

--G0bble

 

[Hiten]

Thats part of the larger problem of lack of spaces in urban or semi urban settings in India - be it traffic free open spaces for lounging without shopping in a non-commercial setting outdoors, or playgrounds for children or sports arenas with TT/Baddy/Volley courts

Long back I attended Parveen Sultana programme which at that time was out of city limits and in open space. When she started singing at start there were few people moving here and there and little traffic outside which settled soon and at around midnight it was pretty quiet and I enjoyed it. I think one can't help it.
Regards

 

[Nikhil]

Thats part of the larger problem of lack of spaces in urban or semi urban settings in India - be it traffic free open spaces for lounging without shopping in a non-commercial setting outdoors, or playgrounds for children or sports arenas with TT/Badd ...

--G0bble

I don't think we can avoid these issues given the immense pressure on resources in our urban areas. However, a good place to start would be to develop proper etiquette during live performances. Too many times we have shutter bugs with their cameras clicking away right in the middle of a performance. Then there are the standard entry and exits of stage hands, venue staff, etc into the auditorium or venue area for mundane reasons - most of which are unnecessary. We have a terrible sense of proper behavior during performances.

A lot of this can be addresses with proper instructions and information about etiquette. Some of our behaviors can't be changed over night but the tendency to do some last minute "jugaad" should be curbed.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I attend live music concerts regularly and quite frankly the standards of live music performances in India is very basic. Lots of room for improvement. In western music bands usually the drums are so loud the mic volumes are turned up so that the vocals or other instruments can be heard leading to feedback and other issues. Still waiting for some sense to make an appearance in many of these concerts. In that vein performances of Indian classical music is much more simple due to a simple arrangement of mic systems for playback.

I'm not saying that there are no good setups. It's just that the majority of performances are poorly setup. The performances come through very flawed equipment which are sometimes wrong for the type of music. However there is improvement taking place. We do have the opportunity to listen to some great performances now and then. Many of our city performance halls and auditoriums are being used and abused for all kinds of multi purpose functions. The acoustics of many venues need to be improved greatly.

Having said all that a live performance is a different experience altogether. There are mistakes made and improvisations done on the fly that either enhance and spoil the performance. Venue acoustics affect the sound in interesting ways. Recordings are never meant to duplicate the live performance. People who remember the old "MTV Unplugged" series can appreciate this. When you are "live" you can't fool the audience. Today's recorded music have some sounds that are synthesized and can. Never be duplicated in a real concert setting. Is it better or worse? Hard to tell. They are just differrent.

Equally, stuff can be done in the studio that can't be done on the stage, so I do think that recorded music has a real and vital part to play in the creative process.

So far as Indian classical music is concerned, I can assure you that I've seen it screwed up in London plenty of times. Whilst the usual culprit might be the guys/equipment whose musical sense doesn't really extend beyond belching out distorted film songs at weddings and parties, it also happens in classical concert halls with trained engineers and expensive gear. How it is that these people can fail to handle a mere three or four musicians on the stage has always baffled me.

I've seen programmes from classical to rock reduced to nothing but pain by the sound guys, in London and Chennai. One of the worst experiences I ever had was one guy plus guitar in a London pub. He was related to my girlfriend, too, and it was not political that I absolutely hated the entire evening!

 

[Hari Iyer]

I don't think we can avoid these issues given the immense pressure on resources in our urban areas. However, a good place to start would be to develop proper etiquette during live performances. Too many times we have shutter bugs with their cameras clicking away right in the middle of a performance. Then there are the standard entry and exits of stage hands, venue staff, etc into the auditorium or venue area for mundane reasons - most of which are unnecessary. We have a terrible sense of proper behavior during performances.

A lot of this can be addresses with proper instructions and information about etiquette. Some of our behaviors can't be changed over night but the tendency to do some last minute "jugaad" should be curbed.

I think this is because most of the audience do not respect the performer. Most of them are some times free pass holders and come for live performance only for time pass. Only a few would be serious music lovers. I personally believe that when listening to someone performing on a stage or even at the comfort of our home listening on a CD player we should respect the performer and not allow ourselves to get distracted. I do not believe in having the music at the background with other task like reading a novel / newspaper. If you are doing that you are not respecting the performer and taking that to be very casual. Imagine you are talking to some one and he is looking at the other side and reading a book. How would you feel being ignored. I usually also see the music and hear them for connecting with the emotions of the performer.

 

[Nikhil]

I personally believe that when listening to someone performing on a stage or even at the comfort of our home listening on a CD player we should respect the performer and not allow ourselves to get distracted. I do not believe in having the music at the background with other task like reading a novel / newspaper. If you are doing that you are not respecting the performer and taking that to be very casual.

Hari, I believe you are referring to Critical Listening as opposed to Casual listening. This is one of the results of getting more involved in your music. If music is important to you then you automatically spend more on your gear and so on. This leads to giving your music importance because you are "invested" in it.

The key of course is at what point does that change take place. I think casual listening brings many to the world of audio. Many may not bother to go past the basics. Some may take the first steps. But for that to take place some stimulus or education is needed. The Performing Arts needs to be given more importance. Given the huge money involved in movies and entertainment India is a fertile ground for this.

 

[Ashenden]

@Hiten It's an old thread, unfortunately the images are missing from your post. If you don't mind, could you please post them again (assuming you still have them ).

Incidentally, my best concert experience too had been a Pandit Shiv Kumar Sharma concert in Madras, a long while back. The venue (IIT central lecture theatre) had decent acoustics, gear and thankfully the audience had maintained the much needed decorum. We do have annual concerts in our city (Carnatic music) which I attend regularly, entry is free and all it costs is to drive to the location and grab your seat for a priceless experience

 

[Deleted member 15865]

With so many points loaded in favour of live performance, let’s also look at some of the positives of listening to recorded music at home:

• Seating comfort - your own sofa usually in the sweet spot
• Listening when the mood beckons; Replays and repeats at will
• No disturbance from other audience
• Access to lyrics, inlays, reviews etc while listening adding to the experience

I’d say recorded music should be enjoyed as itself... not compared with the live performance. Don’t we enjoy documentaries of places we can’t visit/haven’t visited? Or photographs? There’s so much that can be altered/corrected/embellished during mastering and mixing, including the effects and stereo staging, that recorded music can be considered an art piece of its own.

 

[Ashenden]

With so many points loaded in favour of live performance, let’s also look at some of the positives of listening to recorded music at home:

• Seating comfort - your own sofa usually in the sweet spot
• Listening when the mood beckons; Replays and repeats at will
• No disturbance from other audience
• Access to lyrics, inlays, reviews etc while listening adding to the experience

I’d say recorded music should be enjoyed as itself... not compared with the live performance. Don’t we enjoy documentaries of places we can’t visit/haven’t visited? Or photographs? There’s so much that can be altered/corrected/embellished during mastering and mixing, including the effects and stereo staging, that recorded music can be considered an art piece of its own.

Hi Sachin, agree one all the points. Each is different and unique, like theatre performance and watching a movie, but the blemishes you mentioned are what adds to the charm of the live event, IMO.
Hiten had mentioned about the future of classical music in India, which is valid. The concerts which I attend here have around a third of it's audience being non-Indians and their count keeps increasing every year.
Another area in which these events have helped me was in sticking to my gear, with very less modifications. In the 80-90s it used to be a National tape deck, then a Sony CD hifi which lasted for more than 12 years, till 2012. That's when I stumbled across this forum and got my gear (and became an "Accidental audiophile" ) and not changed much other than replace broken components since I know that it is impossible with my cheapskate mindset to experience music at home similar to a live event

 

[Hiten]

@Hiten It's an old thread, unfortunately the images are missing from your post. If you don't mind, could you please post them again (assuming you still have them ).

Old pics are long gone. I have new one clicked (rather 'pressed' (on mobile) ).
Regards