Generic PC Configuration Discussion

[Kushanava]

This thread is intended to start a general Discussion on PC Hardware & Software Usage for Audio ..There are some threads about optimization and some scattered information on Configuration which mostly answers a specific buyers requirement.

So the discussion can be for 3 staged requirements with upgradable options.

Stage 1 -PC configuration to support an Entry Level Stereo System .
Stage 2 -PC configuration to support a Mid Fi Level Stereo System.
Stage 3 -PC configuration to support an Audiophile Level Stereo System

The discussion may consider Mac as well as Windows PC and other alternatives but should focus on 2 channel audio (Not Video nor Gaming).
We are not going to discuss on Sound cards vs external Dacs and would like to focus on PC as a transport only.

Topics:
1. Budget (Stage 1/ Stage 2/Stage 3)
2.A combination of MBO , Processor,RAM, Drives,Power Supply, Cabinet within the budget for each stage.
3.FM experience on Hardware upgrades and benefits.

 

[thx911]

As the industry trends towards (or has already moved!) to SoC based hardware, to my mind, it makes sense to include Android based(ARM) systems in the list. I think its a matter of time before all audio software will be made available for ARM architecture, making it a difficult choice for conventional PC based system.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Stage 1 -PC configuration to support an Entry Level Stereo System .

Any PC --- as long as it has no major fault, as eg my nightmare with DP Latency.

Stage 2 -PC configuration to support a Mid Fi Level Stereo System.

Could be the same PC, but invest/work on physical and electrical silence. Additional budget can be invested in silent fans, cooling,etc. A power supply that actually hums is probably out even for stage 1, but additional budget can be invested in one that is as electrically quiet as possible. A good, solid cabinet is always a good investment. Cabinet and power supply can support new builds over next several years. But, if it works well, you probably won't want or need a new build until something breaks! Unless you are going for a hifi-stack machine, which must necessarily be small, try to buy a case which accommodates larger fans. Larger fans can run slower and quieter.

CPU: do not waste money on high power, it does not make better music, just more heat, which then needs more cooling.

RAM: vast amounts not needed for audio, but OS requirements seem to go up all the time!

HDD: Look for "green" models that run cooler and quieter. High speed/performance not needed: your PC will play audio from an optical CD!

SSD: Is luxury level. the high performance levels are not needed for audio, but, obviously it is totally silent in operation. Are you rich? If so... enjoy!

At the next level of luxury... there are some lovely passive-cooled designs/models available, giving the possibility of a PC that makes as little physical noise as your amplifier. For a PC to add to your hifi stack I can't imagine a nicer idea.

At this stage, you have probably done it all and...

Stage 3 -PC configuration to support an Audiophile Level Stereo System

...any further improvement will be in Audio Land, outside the PC case: spend on you DAC/Interface to your heart's content (ear's content!) and your purse's possibility.

PCs are not like amplifiers, CD players, Speakers. You will not get better sound out of them by spending additional cash, assuming that they work correctly in the first place. There is no sound inside your PC case. Sound happens at the DAC and continues into your other audio components.

I am, as you asked, talking about PC as transport, and ignoring other aspects such as software.

Lastly, beware of moving on to

Stage 4 -PC configuration to support an Audiophool Level Stereo System

PC-land is not audio land. If, for instance, you are into trying different cables, then keep that pass-time outside of the PC case. On the other hand, if you want to get into stuff like changing SATA cables, there are companies who will take your money --- but it is nothing but madness.

Keep your audio PC straightforward, simple, and low cost. Spend your money where it counts.

 

[hydra]

...
So the discussion can be for 3 staged requirements with upgradable options.

Stage 1 -PC configuration to support an Entry Level Stereo System .
Stage 2 -PC configuration to support a Mid Fi Level Stereo System.
Stage 3 -PC configuration to support an Audiophile Level Stereo System

...

Well, I personally think the same PC will do for all 3 levels of associated equipment, it it's done right from the beginning.

Since we're taking about PCs here, we can also easily upgrade what we have on hand, if we need to bump up any of the specs (will most likely not be needed for quite a while, I think).

Basic requirements (IMHO)
===================
- Fanless Motherboard or motherboard with silent fan (Intel Atom or AMD E350/E450)
- 4GB RAM
- 2.5" HDD
- Good quality SMPS (as silent as possible)
- Good quality (non-resonant) cabinet that's as airy as practical.

A somewhat more "Audio-Grade" PC" (IMHO)
=================================
- Fanless motherboard (or an aftermarket heatsink that can eliminate a fan to cool the processor)
- 4GB RAM
- 60GB SSD (boot drive)
- picoPSU with external power brick
- Good quality (non-resonant) cabinet (with no fans) that's as airy as possible.

- Media storage is ideally to be on a NAS installed in another room.
- Gigabit Ethernet wiring.
- JRMC installed as media player
- Nothing to be installed on the computer, except the OS and the player.


My Music PC is like this:
==================
Cabinet: Silverstone GD04-B
PSU: Silverstone ST50F-ES 500W
Mobo: Asus E350-M1 M (AMD Fusion Board, Fanless)
RAM: Corsair 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3
SSD (OS): OCZ Vector 3 64GB
HDD (Storage): WD Green 3TB
Optical Drive: Samsung DVD Writer
Sound Card (for digital Coaxial output): Asus Xonar Essence STX
KB+Mouse: Lenovo N5901 wireless multimedia keyboard+trackball combo
Monitor: TV acts as monitor.
OS: Windows 7 Home Basic 32 Bit
Media Player: JRMC V18.

I've disabled the cabinet fans, so except for the PSU's fan, there are no fans in this setup. Except for the HDD there are no moving parts. I have nothing installed, except the OS and JRMC. The network adapter is disabled.

If I could change something in this setup, I'd change to a picoPSU, and get a NAS for storage. That would make the Music PC completely silent. Not that I can hear the PC at all now, but this is just for uh, the happiness I'd get out of the sense of having made a completely silent PC Since I know this is mostly silly, I haven't spent any money along these lines yet heh, heh.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

the happiness I'd get out of the sense of having made a completely silent PC

It would be no bad thing for a general-purpose PC! Some are amazingly noisy, and it is a background stress even when not listening to music.

Good quality (non-resonant) cabinet

I just reached out and tapped my PC, and, I'm glad to say, the sound was very dull

I do not think that this is an "audiophool" requirement. It is nothing to do with the PC as transport, but anything in our rooms that resonates, whether it is speaker cabinet or ornament, is going to add unwanted content to our sound. So I'm all for adding it to the list of requirements

Spend your money where it counts.

Just thought to add that that can. of course, include cosmetics. The look of a PC is one of the things that has slowed its acceptance in serious audiophile country. An audio-dedicated PC, for placing with other hifi components, can look the part too.

 

[hydra]

Thad, a loosely/badly built cabinet, or one with very thin metal somehow adds to any kind of sound/vibration from within by just vibrating/shaking along sympathetically. For some reason, I'm very sensitive to this kind of noise, and it drives me nuts!

My Dad once had such a cabinet (a BIG one at that) about 15 or 20 years ago, and it was a real noisy nightmare, till one day he placed a few books on top of it. Somehow the hum of the fans and the hard-disks seemed to just die down! Since then we figured out that all panels needed to shut tightly, and ideally, the metal of the cabinet itself needed to be heavy.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Thad, a loosely/badly built cabinet, or one with very thin metal somehow adds to any kind of sound/vibration from within by just vibrating/shaking along sympathetically. For some reason, I'm very sensitive to this kind of noise, and it drives me nuts!

I'm with you on that. I'd never thought of it before, but it is a very good point. That sort of noise could have contributed to some of racket of some of noisiest home/office PCs I've encountered.

Even, after your post, I was contemplating that I have some bells hung in the room!

 

[mowgli80]

IMHO, an audiophile PC is definitely not a high spec PC, so you can skip the first two stages. An ideal system would have a low end processor which can comfortably decode the files (almost all modern proccessors) and which does not generate an awful lot of heat and consequently, does not require awful lot of cooling. 2G ram should be sufficient but if you are interested in audio cum HTPC, 4G is recommended. Go for a integrated display card, which should be capable of accelerating HD movies in case you want to use it as a HTPC. Instead of SSD, go for a 5400 rpm high capacity laptop drive. For 12K-15K + software licensing cost, you get a fantastic audio system. A faster processor, disk or display all generate more heat and noise so keeep away from them. A intel atom based notebook with an external USB DAC would be my choice.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

My first audio PC had its panels lined with sound-deadening material from Quiet PC. As this was over ten years ago, now, I can't swear to how effective it was, but it did no harm, and, sure, we all like to try that stuff. I might have tried that recently too, if I was still in UK, but here I had to content myself with trying about three generations of fans.

If I were building a new large-case PC today, for the fairly general plus audio purpose of my present machine, I'd go for Nofan stuff.

 

[hydra]

Thad, pottering about in QuietPC led me to this cabinet. I'm in love.

 

[reignofchaos]

Streacon cases are stunning for music PC purposes. Wish they were available in India .

 

[asliarun]

Streacon cases are stunning for music PC purposes. Wish they were available in India .

ROC, if you like the fanless Streacom aluminum cabinets, try fanlesstech.com

They have very good coverage of silent PC cabinets, motherboards, heatsinks, etc.

And some of the cabinets are utterly gorgeous.

Intel's Baytrail D motherboards are a very very good option for a fully silent audio PC. The CPU only consumes 10W of power, has Core2Duo levels of performance which should be more than adequate for audio PC purposes, and even for HTPC if needed.

The motherboards already comes with the CPU and fanless heatsink soldered. Such as this one, and this one which has a quad core CPU and still 10W. At $60 for CPU+mobo, it is a pretty good deal.

There is also the new Asus EEE Box that is fanless, comes with a Celeron (Baytrail) quadcore 10W CPU and pairs it with an nVidia 820M mobile graphics chip at 15W. Total system draw should be about 25W for a strong CPU and a strong GPU that could even do lightweight gaming at 720p.

And there are cases like this, this, this, and this. At least drool worthy

 

[reignofchaos]

Yep am aware of that site. Some gorgeous eye candy on display. Not that I require any right now but still nice to ogle at. Locally the only fanless case I could find was the antec isk 110 which I use with a D2500 atom, 4 gigs of ram and an ssd. Might replace it with a bay trail later in the year. However for music listening, this is more than enough.

Now looking for a nice dac with a good usb implementation. The ayon with m2tech hiface is good but want something better now.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Thad, pottering about in QuietPC led me to this cabinet. I'm in love.

Yes, that looks lovely. Passive heatsink cooling too. And by the time one has bought all the other components, one has left far behind the low-cost aspect of PC as hifi component! But why worry, if the result is what one wants and a criterion has been that it should look good on rack. Nice choice!

Streacon cases are stunning for music PC purposes. Wish they were available in India

QuietPC probably ship. No idea how much that adds to the price though :sad:

 

[reignofchaos]

QuietPC probably ship. No idea how much that adds to the price though :sad:

Shipping probably costs as much as the case itself :lol:

 

[thx911]

Does anybody have an idea where you can buy Asus EEE Box in india? see that it is listed on their India website.

 

[devilwearsprada]

Stage 1 -PC configuration to support an Entry Level Stereo System .

I am going to start with a little knowledge that I have. And I will be stuck with Intel because I trust it more than AMD. Along with the indicative prices that I got it for.

1. CPU - LGA 1155 G2020 Processor - Rs.3140

2. Motherboard - Any H61 motherboard around the Rs.3000 mark for the USB 2.0 boards or the B75 which will cost you around the 4500 mark for the USB 3.0 Boards.

3. RAM - You require a very basic 2GB RAM for an Audio PC because it is really not a intensive use here. A 2GB RAM will cost you around Rs.1350.

4. PSU - You should not focus on spending a hefty Power Supply because it wont be utilised without upgraded hardware. Grab the CM350 for around 1700.

5. Cabinet - CM Elite 120. Good Micro ATX cabinet for around Rs.3500.

Peripherals - WirelessDesktop 800 from Microsoft for Rs.1500

6. DVD Burner - Optional. But would need it for rips. Add in for around a 1000 bucks.

7. HDD/SDD - Get a BlueCaviar 160GB for around Rs.2400 or buy an SSD if you have an External HDD. Get the ReadyCache 32GB for the same price.

Total Cost : Around Rs.18000 for a robust all time use PC. For basic/advanced Audio Stereo needs this will suffice!

 

[reignofchaos]

4gigs of ram is useful for memory playback. Also CPU doesn't matter much even an atom will do. What matters is that it is passively cooled and that the power supply is fanless.

A 64 gig sad helps to keep mechanical disk noise away.

 

[Kushanava]

Thanks guys...
Is there some laptop models that can do the job as effectively as a noise free fanless desktop implementation. How would u rate something like a mac mini in this regard??

 

[reignofchaos]

Mac minis have fans. Actually quite whiney fans. Plus you pay apple tax. Not my cup of tea.