Home Demonstrations

[sandeepmohan]

Hi Fi is something you just can't close your eyes and buy. We do as we don't have a choice. This needs to change. I had to do a blind buy for several components in my rig. The Cambridge Cd Player and Rega RP1. 25K to most folks maybe peanuts money. Not for me. It took months of saving and planning to buy that Hi Fi component I always wanted.

When your in the market for quality Hi Fi a home demonstration is a must. How can you possibly buy something before you know how it sounds? How do you know if it will pair well with your equipment? The Hi Fi market is not really new to India anymore. Its been there for a while. Why are we not offered home demonstration? I do understand that equipment abuse is one of the prime reasons dealer's/distributor's don't provide home demonstration. At the same time how do you expect someone to plonk 50K on a DAC before knowing how it sound's? What do I do with that DAC if it does not pair well with my equipment? Its easy to say "sell". Why can't I get a demonstration of the equipment in the comfort of my home?

I know 2 dealers/distributors in Bangalore who offer home demonstrations.

ARN Systems & The German Hi Fi Connection. I hope this list increases. I am tired of someone telling me that its a sealed box and hence we can't offer a demonstration. You have a better chance of selling a product by offering home demonstrations.

Pro Fx did loan a previous generation Kef IQ9 for a friend. When I approached them for a home demonstration for the Denon DP300F, they said no and even if they have to, they will send someone along. This is not what I want. You need to spend a certain amount of time before you take a call on if that DAC, Amplifier, etc sounds right. Not judge everything based on a few minutes listening. A horn loaded speaker sounded perfectly alright for me during extended listening session's but need not necessarily be the case for someone else.

So who else is out there offering home demonstration?

 

[odyssey]

Hi Sandeep

A very valid question but my feeling is that the answer lies in your post. If I were to flip the question around and ask the following -

How many customers would pay full value as deposit, take the equipment home and then have the choice to keep it for say a week or bring it back in the same "new" condition for a full refund? A dealer asks - if you are serious about the possibility of a purchase - why not pay for it upfront with the no questions asked refund policy? Sadly many customers would not take this option. The answer ultimately lies in the nature of the customer-retailer relationship.

We have encouraged doing such home demos only in the last few years, before that I was told that there have been a few bad experiences :sad: at ARN including broken speakers, while this can still happen now, IME, the positives outweigh the risk - from a dealer perspective.

In the west, I have seen policies anywhere from what I have mentioned above to small restocking fees. Very very few dealers give out their equipment unconditionally (without any sort of deposit) and that too its likely to be to a referred prospective client.

I would be curious what others have to say ...

cheers

 

[Bluu]

Sridhar,

I am willing to put down a retainer (Rs 10,000?) for a Rs 50,000 DAC. If I buy it, I'll pay the remaining 40K else I will return it. If there is any damage, the retainer can be pocketed by the dealer. It's in my best interest to be careful.

Sound fair?

Fine me anyone apart from yourself willing to do this. Especially for the Rega DAC.

 

[sidvee]

My experience over in the US, specifically in the midwest area where I lived for about 15 years has been that - a brick and mortar audio store would only allow home demos of higher end equipment (approx. $2k above) for regular clients. If you were a new client then you would have to leave a 5%-10% deposit on your credit card. Some had restocking fees, others did not, so it depended. Some stores would let you have a store demo piece for home demos without any restocking, but almost all needed some kind of deposit. Once you became a regular, then things were great and I have had many a high end piece of equipment in my home, one time or the other, but on the same token I spent a large amount of money as well at the dealer.
In India, I have had great service from Sridhar at ARN, and a few other dealers in Mumbai, specifically Marbin in Mumbai and a few others. I do not think the scene is too bad in India where Audio Hi-end is in its infancy, I am sure it will get better down the road. I think one will have to develop a relationship with the dealer first which is true of any high end retail product I suppose.
Cheers
Sid

 

[Bluu]

Sid, agreed but it has to run both ways. Plus, I really need that DAC I hope the "down the road" is not too far!

 

[sidvee]

Sid, agreed but it has to run both ways.

Bluu - I think that is where the dealers in India are seriously lacking - other than ARN and a few others, some of the dealers I contacted recently when I wanted to spend upto 4 lacs on a pair of speakers, did not even have the model on display in the showroom let alone audition at home. They basically told me I have to buy the speaker blind and pay the price 100% upfront. Regardless as I stated in my earlier post hi-end retailing is in its infancy here and it will change. Simple example look at the car dealers. For higher end they chase you to make a sale and even come to your office/home to demo.
Cheers
Sid

 

[odyssey]

Sridhar,

I am willing to put down a retainer (Rs 10,000?) for a Rs 50,000 DAC. If I buy it, I'll pay the remaining 40K else I will return it. If there is any damage, the retainer can be pocketed by the dealer. It's in my best interest to be careful.

Sound fair?

Fine me anyone apart from yourself willing to do this. Especially for the Rega DAC.

I am really surprised, does this really sound fair to you? playing devils advocate here - IMO its really unfair... on the dealer that is. If you are serious about it, why not pay for it fully and then ask for a refund if it doesn't work for you - get it down on a bill if needed - in clear T & C (if you don't trust the dealer). In the end, any established dealer has more to lose by not sticking to his word.
So please look at it this way - an unknown person walks into a showroom - asks for a home demo of a Rs 50K unit by putting down 10k.
As Sidvee said, this is where relationships matter, if you are doing this for the first time with a dealer, without any common referral/relationship, good luck expecting this...

cheers

 

[sidvee]

So please look at it this way - an unknown person walks into a showroom - asks for a home demo of a Rs 50K unit by putting down 10k.
cheers

I guess that is where the credit card comes in. So the dealer can protect himself. But, with the amount of CC fraud going around, not too sure if it would be a foolproof method anyways.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[odyssey]

I don't know if the cc deposit works in India like it does in the US

Cheers

 

[sidvee]

I don't know if the cc deposit works in India like it does in the US

Cheers

I hear you - CC use is a lot more regulated and safe over in the US than here. For instance you can walk into into any hertz or Avis and rent a $30 - $40k automobile without any hassle or deposit for that matter. Your CC is assurance enough for them. Not sure if one can do that here.
Cheers
Sid

 

[Bluu]

Sridhar - I see your point and will match it. Will our dear Rega dealer provide the Rega DAC for an audition if I put down the entire 50K (with T&C) for a week (unless it is burnt-in already)? Almost certainly not.

Even better, will the Rega distributor (Pune) even answer a phone call, let alone provide an item for audition? No.

When I inquired about the rDAC in Bangalore, the answer was that a demo can't be given because the box is sealed! For a 25K-something product! Are you kidding?! Open the box, send it out for demos and then later sell it for a song as a demo piece.

Thank God you are based in Bangalore otherwise I would still be listening to music on my Altec Lansing desktop speakers.

Also, the CC method should work. Swipe for the appropriate amount and if the sale does not go through, simply revert the charge. If Harley Davidson can give you a 20L rupee bike for a test-ride based on indemnity and your CC, I think the same can be done for an entry-level audio product.

 

[sandeepmohan]

How many customers would pay full value as deposit, take the equipment home and then have the choice to keep it for say a week or bring it back in the same "new" condition for a full refund?

None. Dealers should at least provide the customer this option. I know you will and that's about it. All I am asking is more dealers to introduce this system. A retainer should also work. All this is down to how serious the customer is too.

 

[Bluu]

None. Dealers should at least provide the customer this option. I know you will and that's about it. All I am asking is more dealers to introduce this system. A retainer should also work. All this is down to how serious the customer is too.

Correct. If a customer is serious, the dealer should make this effort. I am honestly ready to put 50K in an escrow right now to be able to sample the Rega DAC. I am trying to buy a well-known and respected product in the $1000 range. However, if the dealer is not willing to meet me half-way, it's he who will lose business. Not like he is selling 10 of those a day.

Eventually, when I save up enough money, his loss will be ARN's gain :lol:

 

[olly42]

Pro FX were more than helpful in giving me home demos for RTi A9/Focal 726V - I had given a down payment of 10 K as I had shortlisted these two speakers and was going to finally pick one of them. I ended picking Polks in favor of Focals - My experience with the ProFX team has been super - I have booked AVR 3312 which has yet to arrive but they have provided me with a replacement till they can deliver. This is what customer service is all about

 

[gobble]

I don't think 10% is unfair, as even losing that money will pinch the demo'er. Maybe the dealer needs to invest in a demo piece in the knowledge that he will eventually sell it off as a used item for less margin.

--G0bble

 

[odyssey]

Gobble, what if the customer never returns with the unit How is 10% confidence inspiring...

 

[Bluu]

What if the dealer doesn't return the money?

Double-edged sword and all that. We must factor in trust somewhere. The dealer can note down particulars of the demo'er if needed and the retainer can be 20-30%. CC route is best. Or some sort of Paypal-ish escrow.

I'm all about the middle-ground today!

 

[odyssey]

For an established dealer - the keyword being established, the chances of his running away are slim - they have invested in a showroom, people etc

I know for debates sake we can argue any which way, but if you think of it from a common sense approach I am sure you will come to the conclusion that the dealer has more to lose. Imagine, one very negative post on this forum about a dealer and he is likely to lose some sales because of it - not to mention the negative publicity word of mouth from members or forum readers. I think this is not the case to argue, the real value is in providing a unit for demo - be it at full value or not as a deposit. As far as dealers not picking up calls or answering emails - clearly that problem is at a very different level than home demos

 

[gobble]

Gobble, what if the customer never returns with the unit How is 10% confidence inspiring...

Oops! You are smart!! There goes my only chance ...

--G0bble

 

[sud98]

I think its a good idea to have the deposit for the home demo. But the reputation thing cuts both ways.

There are many dealers who dont have a great reputation or are not bothered about bad feedback.

Imagine if I paid say 50k for a speaker pair and it was a damaged piece, is there any legal recourse to getting my money back unless the dealer is trustworthy?