Interest check - ProAc Studio 140 MK2 + Dared VP 845

[john_k_antony]

Guys,

I am considering to pair Dared VP 845 tube integrated SET amp with ProAc Studio MK2 speakers. I have almost decided on the amp - Dared VP 845 as I had an extensive audition of the same amp again today at Mr Chacko's place - AnalogAudioLabs (Analog Audio Labs India | Best Valve(Vacuum Tube) Amplifiers in India | An audiophile enterprise from Cochin(Ernakulam) Kerala | High-end audio systems made-in-India) in Angamaly and I got impressed again. I have heard the amp at Bangalore audio meet last year and was not 100% convinced. But, today when I listened to the amp again at Chacko's audition room with my favorite set of music and I was totally impressed. The amp was paired with his very high efficient Klipsh speakers. I think it played most of my genres very well that included Rock, Pop, Country, Hindustani classical, Indian movie songs both old and new and few Metal tracks. There is only one drawback - 845s run extremely HOT.

Another very important thing worth mentioning is that there is absolutely NO hum from the speakers. I have heard hum with most of the other tube amps I have listened to and this one is absolutely silent and its very surprising!. I assume they don't have a SS unit under the hoods

BTW, before considering ProAc, I auditioned Harbeth speakers at Mr Prithvi's place - Absolte Phase - (Absolute Phase :: For the True Audio Connoisseur) a while back and was very impressed. It was an excellent musical evening spend with a wonderful and very knowledgeable person - Mr Prithvi. Thank you very much Sir .

However, I felt Harbeth was not 100% perfect for the Rock and Metal. Harbeth SHL5 is a splendid pair of speakers and produces a very musical and emotionally engaging music. However they are pretty polite and extremely musical. But one thing that worth a mention is the amount of quality bass they produced. I kept on asking Prithvi for the hidden sub .

Now these are the few reasons I am passing Harbeth for now

1. Heavy price tag for the model I liked and its out of my budget
2. Not an aggressive sound for Rock and Metal. For all the other genres of music I listen to, the are simply the BEST.
3. I always wanted my next AMP to be a SET Tube amp. After I got introduced to tube sound a while back, I always wanted to own one. However I was little skeptical about the Tube amps ability to play some heavy stuff and I got fully convinced with its capabilities after listening to Dared VP 845 and a DIY 300B SET. The Harbeths are easier to drive, but they are not highly efficient for being "tube friendly" and to be driven by a 35w/ch SET amp. I might be wrong here, but I am just guessing. BTW, this is not the deal breaker reason.

I kept my search on and looks like ProAc Studio 140 MK2 might fit my bill. I am planning to talk to Prithvi again after I am back in Bangalore this Sunday.

I would like to hear some comments on ProAc + Dared VP 845 combo.

BTW, I acquired a vintage Technics SL Q33 with new AT 120E cart, restored and service by Sir Kurvila Jacob . I will write a detailed review on my "new" table in a different thread after I set it up.

Thanks,
John.

 

[captrajesh]

I'm driving Cadence Arista speakers which have 88 dB sensitivity @ 8 ohms and the Dared VP845 seems to be up to it and I listen to them with the volume pot at 12 o'clock direction. I'm very happy with the results.

The Proacs seem to have 91 dB sensitivity but @ 4 ohms. Since the amp has binding post for 4 ohms speakers also, the amp should be able to drive them well.

Can't comment on the outcome though as I've not heard the Proacs.

 

[john_k_antony]

I'm driving Cadence Arista speakers which have 88 dB sensitivity @ 8 ohms and the Dared VP845 seems to be up to it and I listen to them with the volume pot at 12 o'clock direction. I'm very happy with the results.

The Proacs seem to have 91 dB sensitivity but @ 4 ohms. Since the amp has binding post for 4 ohms speakers also, the amp should be able to drive them well.

Can't comment on the outcome though as I've not heard the Proacs.

Thank you very much Captain. Mr. Chacko told me that you got VP 845 and quite happy with it. BTW, you were using another model from Chacko for a while I guess after the Chennai meet last year? May I know which one was that? Was that the KT88 push pull model? I assume VP 845 might be sounding better than that.

Thanks,
John.

 

[reignofchaos]

I'm driving Cadence Arista speakers which have 88 dB sensitivity @ 8 ohms and the Dared VP845 seems to be up to it and I listen to them with the volume pot at 12 o'clock direction. I'm very happy with the results.

The Proacs seem to have 91 dB sensitivity but @ 4 ohms. Since the amp has binding post for 4 ohms speakers also, the amp should be able to drive them well.

Can't comment on the outcome though as I've not heard the Proacs.

I've heard the Cadence Arista with the Cadence VA-1 earlier and it absolutely doesn't work for hard rock and heavy metal - all the sound is there but there's absolutely no soul. Its like asking Pavarotti or Domingo to sing Symphony of Destruction. No doubt the Cadence Arista/Avita are absolutely fantastic speakers for Jazz or Classical but they just don't float my boat for Rock.

I've heard the Proac Studio 140 too with all Audio Research gear and it didn't work either - however it was not as bad as the Cadence.

If you must have an all rounder that does rock/classical/jazz/soul, get an ATC - don't even think about looking anywhere else. It is hands down my favorite in that price range. If you can stretch, get an active ATC. You don't have to worry about amp matching either.

 

[arj]

Triggered by reignofchaos post.. What is your budget ?

 

[john_k_antony]

I can stretch to a max budget of 3.5L for integrated or power amp + pair of speakers. I am building a pass B1 pre amp and I think if I get a good power amp, I will use it with my pass B1 build for now. But if a good integrated comes in my budget, I am open for that as well.

The original option - ProAc + Dared I was looking for was falling within my budget.

reignofchaos -> I don't think I have the budget for ATC active . Now if I look for ATC passive, then I will have to invest heavily on the amp for driving them. I fear that will cross my budget by a significant margin.

Thanks,
John.

 

[arj]

Thats a healthy budget with lots of options...should not get boxed into just Proac
Why dont you go to ARN systems and listen to the emerald physics with an Odyssey ?
I presume you have already heard the Blumenhofer and presume that is out ?
Magnaplanar is another option..maybe with Odyssey amps ?

 

[john_k_antony]

Thanks Arj,

I am yet to make an appointment with Jochen to listen to Blumenhofer. I am not auditioning them now as I feel they are above my budget . The one I was looking for was Big Fun 17 and the speaker itself will cost around 3.2L now!

I listened to Harbeth at Prithvi and liked them for the midrange and sweet highs. Howeve, it kind of made Rock music sound "polite" . I like the Rock music to sound heavy. Again the Harbeth model I liked was way above my budget. So have to pass it.

EP CS 2.3 was in my radar for a while and giving it a pass now again because of budget constraints.

See with 3.5L budget, I will have to spend close to 1-1.5L on the amplification and then I am left with only 2-2.5L for speakers.

BTW, I am not in a big hurry as I have my KEF iQ7s doing a decent job with Acoustic Portrait power amp in my dedicated room now. However, I want to move my KEF iQ7 to my living room setup and wanted to get a "bigger" sounding speaker for my main listening room that is around 375 sft (24' x 15.6').

And I always wanted to own a tube amplification. And I really really liked the Dared VP 845 and is falling within my budget. Now I am shortlisting high sensitivity speakers based on its ability to be driven by a low wattage tube amp.

Thanks,
John.

 

[arj]

Have you heard the Rethm speakers ?
Prithvi has them for demo.. At least used to. Sounds amazing with an SET and can really rock where needed

 

[john_k_antony]

Prithvi only has Thrisha and I wanted to listen to Maarga. For Maarga, I have to visit Jacob George at Kochi. Last time, I was in Kochi, he was not ready with his studio. I might listen to them next time I visit Kochi.

However, I was keeping Rethms to the end of my audition list as I heard mixed response about its sound signature. I wanted "bigger" and "hefty" sound and heard Rethm to be more refined and detailed and are not hefty. Saadhana is way above my budget.

One of the speakers I loved that could create a hefty sound stage is Zu Audio. Again I have to pass Zu for now because of budget constraints.

I might even drop the idea of an upgrade now and start saving some bucks and get back later for better options.

However here is no problem hunting and if I come across something that is cheaper and fits my bill, I wouldn't mind

Thanks,
John.

 

[captrajesh]

BTW, you were using another model from Chacko for a while I guess after the Chennai meet last year? May I know which one was that? Was that the KT88 push pull model? I assume VP 845 might be sounding better than that.

Yes it was on loaner from Byju Chacko which I wanted to compare with the Cayin TA30 I was having at that time. I don't exactly remember but I think it was 6550 tubes in PP configuration. The VP845 has far greater resolution than that amp.

I've heard the Cadence Arista with the Cadence VA-1 earlier and it absolutely doesn't work for hard rock and heavy metal - all the sound is there but there's absolutely no soul.

The VA1 is quite underpowered to drive these speakers. IMO Hard Rock and Heavy Metal may sound polite through these speakers but for me it is OK, they take away all the harshness and grunge. This is because, of the limited dynamics of the ESL panels of these speakers. Even Western Classical, which has wide dynamic range, sounds flatter compared to conventional speakers. These speakers make music more listenable in a fatigue free manner.

 

[ravi_d]

Sorry OT though. For a moment I thought you are looking at gauging interest in selling the above mentioned pair. Have read the post multiple times to find the expected prices and the condition of the items but the topic seemed to be entirely different :lol:

Some international forums have IC (Interest Check) option/pre-fix to thread title to gauge the interest of buyers along with FS (For Sale) and WTD (Wanted) on their classified sections.

Good luck with the hunt.

 

[john_k_antony]

Ravi,

Thanks for pointing out the misleading title!. I think I have seen some other posts in the forum where people are seeking the opinion about some gear by putting "Interest Check" in the title.

Thanks for letting me know about the confusion. Will take care of this from next time on-wards .

Thanks,
John.

 

[john_k_antony]

Yes it was on loaner from Byju Chacko which I wanted to compare with the Cayin TA30 I was having at that time. I don't exactly remember but I think it was 6550 tubes in PP configuration. The VP845 has far greater resolution than that amp.


The VA1 is quite underpowered to drive these speakers. IMO Hard Rock and Heavy Metal may sound polite through these speakers but for me it is OK, they take away all the harshness and grunge. This is because, of the limited dynamics of the ESL panels of these speakers. Even Western Classical, which has wide dynamic range, sounds flatter compared to conventional speakers. These speakers make music more listenable in a fatigue free manner.

Thanks for the confirmation Captain. The PP amp comes with KT88. I think Mr. Chacko mentioned that you can use 6550 for a sweeter mid range. So you might have had the A150 amp - A-150 | Valve Tube Amplifiers | A-150 from Analog Audio Labs India | Cochin-Kerala | Premium valve-amplifiers made-in-India | KT-88 6550, 12AX7, JJ-Tesla, Mullard with 6550.

Thanks,
John.

 

[captrajesh]

No it is not A150. It is not listed on their site. Physically it looks like the 15WPC SET amp that is on their site. You can read about it on the thread on Chennai meet held at Hotel Savera.

 

[captrajesh]

You can read about it on the thread on Chennai meet held at Hotel Savera.

This is that amp:

It is a Dared amp with 6L6 tubes in Push-Pull mode with an output of 30 WPC.

 

[olly42]

John do give a listen to Revel they may interest you

 

[captrajesh]

One of the speakers I loved that could create a hefty sound stage is Zu Audio. Again I have to pass Zu for now because of budget constraints.

May be these would come within your budget: http://www.hifivision.com/sale-owner/45034-zu-audio-essence.html

Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with the seller. Just saw this thread while searching for something.

The VA1 is quite underpowered to drive these speakers. IMO Hard Rock and Heavy Metal may sound polite through these speakers but for me it is OK, they take away all the harshness and grunge. This is because, of the limited dynamics of the ESL panels of these speakers. Even Western Classical, which has wide dynamic range, sounds flatter compared to conventional speakers. These speakers make music more listenable in a fatigue free manner.

Other day, Thad came over for a visit and one of my acquaintances who is an avid Western Classical fan came over for a visit. We played mostly Western Classical. The speakers have proven the highlighted part of my statement above wrong. I do not listen to Western Classical much and my observation was probably based on my listening experience when the new tweeters landed from Cadence. They did take time to open up which Denom had pointed out when he visited me at that time which I now realise to be correct.

Just saw the post and wanted to put the record straight.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

If you can stretch, get an active ATC. You don't have to worry about amp matching either.

But he has room heating on the must have list! :lol:

A friendly jibe only: I very much enjoy Capt Rajesh's system. In fact, I tried hard to persuade him not to sell his Dared amp, telling him that this was a buy-once-in-a-lifetime amp, and well worth a dedicated car journey to transport to where-ever ...and so on.

It's true, though, that that amp produces a ridiculous amount of heat.

 

[jenson]

i on other hand enjoy listening to Rap/metal/pop on my cadence arista + va1 combo.

i feel they are quite underrated when it's comes to these genres. especially when listening ro radiohead/soundgarden/moloko/elbow to lets say metallica/cannibal corpse to ice cube/notorius big - what this speaker does in spades is - gives a very live feel to sound with lot of details.

would love to run these speaker thru a canasya, but then - im perfectly happy/content with what i have!

to OP, i think i like electrostat sound. got hooked on to it the moment i heard Mr. Lalwani's Maggie setup. blew me to bits. i will never forget that sound signature

if you wanna go totally bezerk do try Pulz's mini theater range with 15" speakers and horn tweeters just what metal needs! - Pulz M2 Premium High Resolution 2-way Cinema Screen Speaker System