LFE signal to Floor stands - Will it impect in long run

[pupupuchi28]

Hi,

I have a pair of Yamaha NS8390 floor stands. Specification - 3 way, @ 70w nominal, 220 w max @ 8 ohms. Woofer is specified to go till 35hz. I have tested if it take on those low signals and found it does pretty well. I do not have a sub.

I have recently pruchased a yamaha RX V371 and connected it to the FS. Since I do not have a sub therefore I have configured the sub to 'No' (in AVR), as a result all the LFEs are sourced to floor stands.

1 - Although the speakers are strong enough to respond to the low frequescies, however will it harm the speakers in long run?
2 - What happens to ths signals below 35hz which, the floor stands would not be able to reproduce. Would they still hit the speakers and since it cannot response, the frequescies will harm the speaker?

** Read 'impact' in the thread title.

 

[Krish82]

Nothing to worry thats not going to harm your speakers. Frequencies below 35 hz will not be heard nor played by your speakers. If your quality of speakers are good and amp has ample power it will produce or try producing 35 hz as good it can, but not better than a sub.

The 35hz to 20k khz ratings are like cars maximum speed, it can hit 180 km.hr, but in real world situation it would be difficult to hit 180. There are some specific test tones that are below 30 hz which you should be aware of not playing loudly in the speakers as it may damage them.

 

[Bluu]

^ Very aptly put Krish. Very good analogy as well.

 

[doors666]

if these are ported, chances of damage are more. while running full range, the power handling capacity of a speaker comes down drastically. dont feed it high power signal at lower frequencies. try to stay away from movies that have strong below 30hz content.

 

[Shivam]

Make sure that your amp has enough power to run these speakers. Clipping can fry your tweeters faster than you can press the button on the remote to reduce the volume.

You can choose your setup to 'Subwoofer - yes/present' and set the crossover to somewhere around 35-40Hz. Choose the front channels also to play the subwoofer signal.

 

[pupupuchi28]

Thank you Guys but my doubt seems to be getting stronger.

"Frequencies below 35 hz will not be heard nor played by your speakers." Technically how does the amp judge that the speaker can handle only till 35hz. How is the signal below 35hz neglected by FS. Or is it that the speaker would be forced to produce the sound below 35hz, however it will not deliver and fry out over a long term. The FS has two crossovers for splitting mid and highs but there is no crossover for the 'low end' of LFEs.

"You can choose your setup to 'Subwoofer - yes/present' and set the crossover to somewhere around 35-40Hz." - As far as I understand, the sub crossover (in the amp) is used to limit the LFEs to the subs. Meaning if I mark the sub crossover at 60hz, then anything below 60hz would be input to sub and the floorstands or other speakers will play above those frequencies. If that is true then the fact that I have marked the sub as 'None' (in the amp), the signals that the sub should play would now be forwarded to to the floorstands (FS). And since there is no crossover for LFE in FS therefore the FS would be forced to produce the sound.

"if these are ported, chances of damage are more." - What is the relation of a ported speaker to the frequency it produces. Rather I would assume that a ported speaker would benifit, when low frequencies are played. The speaker cone will have free air for rebound and manage the air displacement created as a result of playing low frequencies.

Am I badly overlooking something or there is a lack of technically 'sound' answer to it?

 

[Shivam]

Thank you Guys but my doubt seems to be getting stronger.

"Frequencies below 35 hz will not be heard nor played by your speakers." Technically how does the amp judge that the speaker can handle only till 35hz. How is the signal below 35hz neglected by FS. Or is it that the speaker would be forced to produce the sound below 35hz, however it will not deliver and fry out over a long term. The FS has two crossovers for splitting mid and highs but there is no crossover for the 'low end' of LFEs.

"You can choose your setup to 'Subwoofer - yes/present' and set the crossover to somewhere around 35-40Hz." - As far as I understand, the sub crossover (in the amp) is used to limit the LFEs to the subs. Meaning if I mark the sub crossover at 60hz, then anything below 60hz would be input to sub and the floorstands or other speakers will play above those frequencies. If that is true then the fact that I have marked the sub as 'None' (in the amp), the signals that the sub should play would now be forwarded to to the floorstands (FS). And since there is no crossover for LFE in FS therefore the FS would be forced to produce the sound.

"if these are ported, chances of damage are more." - What is the relation of a ported speaker to the frequency it produces. Rather I would assume that a ported speaker would benifit, when low frequencies are played. The speaker cone will have free air for rebound and manage the air displacement created as a result of playing low frequencies.

Am I badly overlooking something or there is a lack of technically 'sound' answer to it?

The amp will not know that the speaker can't handle below 35Hz and the signal will still be sent to the speakers. Most of the speakers produce sounds well below their rated frequencies but with less intensity. The harmonics are however produced normally.

Some people let the speakers produce these low frequencies too. The harmonics along with the low intensity reproduction of the low frequency can sometimes mimic a flat curve extending way below the marked frequencies and can make some musical pieces more bodied and full. Organs, Cellos, some low piano notes create this.

Some other people restrict the lower end using an external crossover and this helps the speakers by reducing distortion and improving vocals (midrange).

When you set the crossover for subwoofer in your receiver to 35-40, the frequencies below it will go to the sub channel. Make sure to select the subwoofer to be present in the system even if it is not. Some AVRs can be set manually and some detect the speakers automatically. I am not sure about the working of your AVR.

Even I was wondering about the relation between chances of damage and ported design but could not find any information till now. I'll have to search more. Why don't you send a pm to doors666 (the person saying that) in the meanwhile? If you get a suitable answer please do let me know too.

 

[pupupuchi28]

"The amp will not know that the speaker can't handle below 35Hz and the signal will still be sent to the speakers. Most of the speakers produce sounds well below their rated frequencies but with less intensity. The harmonics are however produced normally.

Some people let the speakers produce these low frequencies too. The harmonics along with the low intensity reproduction of the low frequency can sometimes mimic a flat curve extending way below the marked frequencies and can make some musical pieces more bodied and full. Organs, Cellos, some low piano notes create this.

Some other people restrict the lower end using an external crossover and this helps the speakers by reducing distortion and improving vocals (midrange).
" - So in short, the speaker would still be input with the low frequencies and in long term (if played loud or tracks which have 'serious' low frequencies) may damage them.

"When you set the crossover for subwoofer in your receiver to 35-40, the frequencies below it will go to the sub channel. Make sure to select the subwoofer to be present in the system even if it is not. Some AVRs can be set manually and some detect the speakers automatically. I am not sure about the working of your AVR." - Mine does not detect automatically. That being the case the lows would then be forced to play by the FS. Not a good thing for the FS I guess.


"Even I was wondering about the relation between chances of damage and ported design but could not find any information till now. I'll have to search more. Why don't you send a pm to doors666 (the person saying that) in the meanwhile? If you get a suitable answer please do let me know too. " - ha ha ha so you suggested me something without understanding how it impacts? or yourself being confident on the answer by "doors666". No probs!

 

[Shivam]

"Even I was wondering about the relation between chances of damage and ported design but could not find any information till now. I'll have to search more. Why don't you send a pm to doors666 (the person saying that) in the meanwhile? If you get a suitable answer please do let me know too. " - ha ha ha so you suggested me something without understanding how it impacts? or yourself being confident on the answer by "doors666". No probs!

Did I suggest that ?

 

[Santy]

Technically how does the amp judge that the speaker can handle only till 35hz. How is the signal below 35hz neglected by FS. Or is it that the speaker would be forced to produce the sound below 35hz, however it will not deliver and fry out over a long term. The FS has two crossovers for splitting mid and highs but there is no crossover for the 'low end' of LFEs.

Signals below 35hz are not neglected by FS but they cannot produce those frequencies which need lot of cone movement and the speaker simply has limitations in moving its cone to that extent. Low frequencies do not damage the speakers unless you exert it too much by driving them at high volumes.

Damage can occur in the voice coil due to high current (thus more heat) or to the cone due to over exertion.

As far as I understand, the sub crossover (in the amp) is used to limit the LFEs to the subs. Meaning if I mark the sub crossover at 60hz, then anything below 60hz would be input to sub and the floorstands or other speakers will play above those frequencies.

If I am not wrong, even if the sub output is enabled in the amp, the FS will get all frequencies "in that channel". In other words, only the .1 "channel" will not go to the FS if sub is enabled. If it is disabled then you get the LFE channel also mixed onto the front channels.

"if these are ported, chances of damage are more." - What is the relation of a ported speaker to the frequency it produces. Rather I would assume that a ported speaker would benifit, when low frequencies are played. The speaker cone will have free air for rebound and manage the air displacement created as a result of playing low frequencies.

Yes, ported speakers allow more air movement so the cone exertion and the loudness of low frequencies will be more. Thus again if it is over exerted, the chances of damage to the cones in a ported speaker is much more.