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Make Room For Acoustics

Wharfedale Diamond 11.1 & 11.2 Speakers

vinay

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Pranab, this new article on acoustics could help you.
 
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vinay

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Soundsgreat & Rikhav, did you read the article on acoustics?
 

rikhav

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Soundsgreat & Rikhav, did you read the article on acoustics?


Hi Vinay
Just went through the 2 pages you have scanned and posted. I will get the May issue of AVMAX and read it fully.

Thanx for the information
 

soundsgreat

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Hi,

Vinay I get the Avmax ( been reading it from the pre-view issue and the first issue !! still have all the issues intact) and what hi-fi every month !! I did read that article ! but some of the quotes there are bit contrary to my belief and also some of the passages didn't make much sense to me !!

This is my personal opinion and not necessary that someone should agree or disagree !!

Anyway thanks for posting it Vinay !!

Regards.
 

vinay

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Hi,

Vinay I get the Avmax ( been reading it from the pre-view issue and the first issue !! still have all the issues intact) and what hi-fi every month !! I did read that article ! but some of the quotes there are bit contrary to my belief and also some of the passages didn't make much sense to me !!

This is my personal opinion and not necessary that someone should agree or disagree !!

Anyway thanks for posting it Vinay !!

Regards.

I think it is a great idea to have all the issues as a library of these 2 magazines, i have been throwing away these magazines after reading them, now even i will store them.

For my academic knowledge please tell me which are the points which you do not agree about the sound proofing article in this av max magazine.

I am also interested to write your writing about the sound proofing errors, etc, to the av max guys, and see how they respond, i think they will reply me because i know one or two guys there quite well, and moreover as you know that they have covered a full 4 page article of my home theatre.

Thank you very much.

Vinay
 
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soundsgreat

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Hi,

Vinay I never indulge into point wise disagreeing or say pick out the bad things in a nit-picking way!! So generally I made the comment!! But since you asked me to tell you and also since you say it??s for your knowledge I will surely tell you, but let me also tell you that I don't want to cause a pandemonium by reiterating my statements about the Sound proofing which was duly elaborated in the Pranbs thread !!

First and foremost the Article in totality is fine and very useful except for the following:

1. In the opening statement the Author says Quote:
Room acoustics is the easiest way to get the best out of your music system!!

My Views:
Now what this implies to is, no matter how bad your system is or the source material is just by doing the acoustics it starts to sound perfect!! Now is that the actual case??

If that was the case then the studio??s in which these recordings take place which is 10 times more carefully treated then any best of class home theater, they wouldn??t have produced such crappy recordings now? Would they, because it should??ve made them hear that exact sound with the treatment and they would??ve come to know the shortcomings in the recording and corrected it then and there!!

The point is just by treating a room you cannot make the system to sound 100% different and 100% perfect! It can just enhance the sound by aiding it to reach your ears in much more calibrated or profound way then the same reaching your ears with this treatment!!

So what he should??ve said is, if you have a proper set-up with the proper source then the treatment will enhance the sound further! This would??ve made more sense!!

Secondly the Absorption panels and their placements!

Quote:
The absorption panel placed in the center of the front and back wall helps in controlling the reflected mid-high frequencies and allows the listener to hear direct sound!

My Views:

Agreed that it does help in masking the reflected sound from reaching the listener, but how do you ascertain the amount of mid-high frequency to be tamed?? Coz by simply using a panel of some thickness or some measurement, it not only absorbs the reflected sound but also the certain amount of direct sound! So for Ex. If my system is bit upfront and forward sounding then this will help tame it and the result might be fruitful! What if my system is already bit sober and backward or flat sounding?? Then without knowing the exact amount of absorption needed if I just use the said thickness and said measurement, Am I not killing the sound further by absorbing the mids-highs which is already flat??

Next is the similar story with the diffuser and the rear.

One Important thing here is what he says about the seating position,

Quote:
Finding the Optimum listening position is very crucial and placement in a specific position is a must!
Under this, the seating Area:
The Listening position should be 38% of the room length placed from the rear wall!

My Views:

Again this is not 100% follow able because even in a dedicated room there might not be a chance to do it!

For Ex. Vinay in your mini theater if Am not mistaken the seating is not at all as said is it?? Please correct me if Am wrong!

So my summary:
What??s said is beyond doubt a good start-up tip and a good pointer towards having the that ultimate listening experience , but the article should??ve clearly mentioned some basic requirements for such a treatment and should??ve given a disclaimer that the article was just curtain raiser to the full blown treatment that one needs to do. Also should??ve made it very clear that one should measure (in whatever basic way he can) frequency response and start to do the suggested treatment for the best possible results!! Or one should have all the considerations of the effect that this will cause! Blindly asking someone to do these things is not healthy sign to me !!

Vinay I think I??ve replied Point to Point! Now how one takes this or finds this is beyond my level of comprehension and will not worry about it!!


Regards.
 
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vinay

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hey vinay thanx...... for the article...... for the help

Pranab, did you read the full article on accoustics?

I had given you the model name for the accoustic cieling tiles, have you noted the information?
 

vinay

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Hi,

Vinay I never indulge into point wise disagreeing or say pick out the bad things in a nit-picking way!! So generally I made the comment!! But since you asked me to tell you and also since you say it??s for your knowledge I will surely tell you, but let me also tell you that I don't want to cause a pandemonium by reiterating my statements about the Sound proofing which was duly elaborated in the Pranbs thread !!

First and foremost the Article in totality is fine and very useful except for the following:

1. In the opening statement the Author says Quote:
Room acoustics is the easiest way to get the best out of your music system!!

My Views:
Now what this implies to is, no matter how bad your system is or the source material is just by doing the acoustics it starts to sound perfect!! Now is that the actual case??

If that was the case then the studio??s in which these recordings take place which is 10 times more carefully treated then any best of class home theater, they wouldn??t have produced such crappy recordings now? Would they, because it should??ve made them hear that exact sound with the treatment and they would??ve come to know the shortcomings in the recording and corrected it then and there!!

The point is just by treating a room you cannot make the system to sound 100% different and 100% perfect! It can just enhance the sound by aiding it to reach your ears in much more calibrated or profound way then the same reaching your ears with this treatment!!

So what he should??ve said is, if you have a proper set-up with the proper source then the treatment will enhance the sound further! This would??ve made more sense!!

Secondly the Absorption panels and their placements!

Quote:
The absorption panel placed in the center of the front and back wall helps in controlling the reflected mid-high frequencies and allows the listener to hear direct sound!

My Views:

Agreed that it does help in masking the reflected sound from reaching the listener, but how do you ascertain the amount of mid-high frequency to be tamed?? Coz by simply using a panel of some thickness or some measurement, it not only absorbs the reflected sound but also the certain amount of direct sound! So for Ex. If my system is bit upfront and forward sounding then this will help tame it and the result might be fruitful! What if my system is already bit sober and backward or flat sounding?? Then without knowing the exact amount of absorption needed if I just use the said thickness and said measurement, Am I not killing the sound further by absorbing the mids-highs which is already flat??

Next is the similar story with the diffuser and the rear.

One Important thing here is what he says about the seating position,

Quote:
Finding the Optimum listening position is very crucial and placement in a specific position is a must!
Under this, the seating Area:
The Listening position should be 38% of the room length placed from the rear wall!

My Views:

Again this is not 100% follow able because even in a dedicated room there might not be a chance to do it!

For Ex. Vinay in your mini theater if Am not mistaken the seating is not at all as said is it?? Please correct me if Am wrong!

So my summary:
What??s said is beyond doubt a good start-up tip and a good pointer towards having the that ultimate listening experience , but the article should??ve clearly mentioned some basic requirements for such a treatment and should??ve given a disclaimer that the article was just curtain raiser to the full blown treatment that one needs to do. Also should??ve made it very clear that one should measure (in whatever basic way he can) frequency response and start to do the suggested treatment for the best possible results!! Or one should have all the considerations of the effect that this will cause! Blindly asking someone to do these things is not healthy sign to me !!

Vinay I think I??ve replied Point to Point! Now how one takes this or finds this is beyond my level of comprehension and will not worry about it!!


Regards.

Hello,

I believe in debate point wise, good, bad or ugly, i try to be with the point direct or in-direct with more specific to direct, and never evasive with replies, when it comes to nit picking, it should be on all fronts.

I do not think there is any sort of pandemonium, etc, it is just a counter, etc, to what one says. I greatly appreciate the detail at which you have explained.

For me the meaning was correct, the author just says that with room acoustics is the easiest way, means what ever is the best with your system, it will come out with the acoustics, so what the author says that if your system is not good enough than for sure you will not get the prime results with acoustic treatment.

Indeed what you have suggested the way it should have been said would have been more clear and understanding.

About the absorption panel and diffuser , my knowledge is not much, but i think you have a good point, i hope some members can throw more light on your and av max magazine's writing.

The 38% factor of listening position, is indeed practically impossible in most of the cases.

I thank you very much for your private message on this topic.

Thank you again.

Vinay.
 
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vinay

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Acoustics Via Wallpapper

Pranab & David, that just reminds me that there are imported accoustics wall pappers available in the market in various specifications.

This is being sold by the top 3 wall papper guys in Mumbai.

Vinay.
 

vinay

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critic

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Hi,

Vinay I never indulge into point wise disagreeing or say pick out the bad things in a nit-picking way!! So generally I made the comment!! But since you asked me to tell you and also since you say it??s for your knowledge I will surely tell you, but let me also tell you that I don't want to cause a pandemonium by reiterating my statements about the Sound proofing which was duly elaborated in the Pranbs thread !!

First and foremost the Article in totality is fine and very useful except for the following:

1. In the opening statement the Author says Quote:
Room acoustics is the easiest way to get the best out of your music system!!

My Views:
Now what this implies to is, no matter how bad your system is or the source material is just by doing the acoustics it starts to sound perfect!! Now is that the actual case??

If that was the case then the studio??s in which these recordings take place which is 10 times more carefully treated then any best of class home theater, they wouldn??t have produced such crappy recordings now? Would they, because it should??ve made them hear that exact sound with the treatment and they would??ve come to know the shortcomings in the recording and corrected it then and there!!

The point is just by treating a room you cannot make the system to sound 100% different and 100% perfect! It can just enhance the sound by aiding it to reach your ears in much more calibrated or profound way then the same reaching your ears with this treatment!!

So what he should??ve said is, if you have a proper set-up with the proper source then the treatment will enhance the sound further! This would??ve made more sense!!

Secondly the Absorption panels and their placements!

Quote:
The absorption panel placed in the center of the front and back wall helps in controlling the reflected mid-high frequencies and allows the listener to hear direct sound!

My Views:

Agreed that it does help in masking the reflected sound from reaching the listener, but how do you ascertain the amount of mid-high frequency to be tamed?? Coz by simply using a panel of some thickness or some measurement, it not only absorbs the reflected sound but also the certain amount of direct sound! So for Ex. If my system is bit upfront and forward sounding then this will help tame it and the result might be fruitful! What if my system is already bit sober and backward or flat sounding?? Then without knowing the exact amount of absorption needed if I just use the said thickness and said measurement, Am I not killing the sound further by absorbing the mids-highs which is already flat??

Next is the similar story with the diffuser and the rear.

One Important thing here is what he says about the seating position,

Quote:
Finding the Optimum listening position is very crucial and placement in a specific position is a must!
Under this, the seating Area:
The Listening position should be 38% of the room length placed from the rear wall!

My Views:

Again this is not 100% follow able because even in a dedicated room there might not be a chance to do it!

For Ex. Vinay in your mini theater if Am not mistaken the seating is not at all as said is it?? Please correct me if Am wrong!

So my summary:
What??s said is beyond doubt a good start-up tip and a good pointer towards having the that ultimate listening experience , but the article should??ve clearly mentioned some basic requirements for such a treatment and should??ve given a disclaimer that the article was just curtain raiser to the full blown treatment that one needs to do. Also should??ve made it very clear that one should measure (in whatever basic way he can) frequency response and start to do the suggested treatment for the best possible results!! Or one should have all the considerations of the effect that this will cause! Blindly asking someone to do these things is not healthy sign to me !!

Vinay I think I??ve replied Point to Point! Now how one takes this or finds this is beyond my level of comprehension and will not worry about it!!


Regards.

My friend,
There is a lot more to it than what your opinion about them are.... YES Ethan is right, acoustics make your system entirely different IF your room is untreated. Absorption or Diffusion is subjective to the particualr room & also a particular taste. But the Basics have to be done right, & thats what that article is all about. To add or to modify to that exhisting treatment, is entirely left to one's taste. You will not understand until you do up the Room in the specified manner, coz you do not know what you are missing till you finally Get it....
 

marsilians

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Room acoustics will make a big difference if you have taken care of the speaker positioning and your listening area is reasonable in terms of size and layout (can't have too many open spaces and crazily high ceilings).

I would have preferred some actual measurements with and without the treatments to make it an excellent reading piece.
 
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