My first venture into Pre-Pro – Pointers welcome

[ssf]

My Marantz 7010 gave up on me during the lockdown. Right now, it is in Bangalore with the service guys quoting a 30000.00 repair bill for a blown HDMI board.

My two channel setup right now is Quad S2 being powered by Topping TP60. While I don’t have any complaints of this setup for music, it falls short for Movies. Also, on Sundays my family tunes into online church service during which time they increase the volume which makes me worry that the amp might clip and hurt my speakers.

So, I ordered the Crown XLS2502 power amp seeing that is not an expensive amp and also that it is quite popular in this forum. I plan to use this as a power amp for the front two channels once my Marantz comes back from repair. Maybe, I will buy another Crown and bridge it for centre channel.

In the meantime, I wanted a pre for this which again did not cost me a lot. Browsing through HiFiMart, I came across FX Audio DP-02 Tube pre amp which was priced quite reasonably and I thought it would suffice for my first time entry into Tube pre. I also ordered Jan 5654 W tubes which I though was quite expensive when compared to the cost of the tube amp itself. Will use it with the original Chinese tubes for a while and once am used to the sound of the new setup, I will change the tubes to see how much of a difference the GE’s make. I found it amazing that the sound of the amp could be changed just by changing the tubes !!!

The tube pre has a level out of 1.9Vrms which should work with the Crown with its input sensitivity set to 1.4Vrms. I will try the .775Vrms too and if it works better, I will use that. I don’t anticipate any hiss from the speakers as the Quads have a sensitivity of 87 Db.

Eagerly awaiting the arrival of the Pre and Pro which I should receive sometime this week.

Anything else that I need to be aware of ? Pointer for better tuning most welcome.

Edit:
I just noticed something. The 440 Watts @ 8 Ohms of Crown is at 0.5% THD, 1KHZ.
Emotiva XPA 5 Gen 3 is 300 watts RMS/channel; 20 Hz – 20 kHz; THD<0.1%; 8 Ohms; one channel driven.

Nonetheless, both should have enough power for most home applications.

 

[kapvin]

I just noticed something. The 440 Watts @ 8 Ohms of Crown is at 0.5% THD, 1KHZ.
Emotiva XPA 5 Gen 3 is 300 watts RMS/channel; 20 Hz – 20 kHz; THD<0.1%; 8 Ohms; one channel driven.

Nonetheless, both should have enough power for most home applications.

I have the Crown XLS2502, XLS1500 and also the Emotiva XPA-7 (Gen3) (apart from other assorted emotivas & toppings)

SQ-wise - there is a distinct difference between the crown and emotiva. In favour of the emotiva. the price of Crown has gone down in recent times compared to when I purchased it (and emotiva has gone up), but even today, I would consider it a no brainer to buy emotiva vs. crown.,

where the crown excels is in its ability to handle a low impedance loads without blushing. It makes a great subwoofer amp if you are not chasing the deepest sub 20hz bass.

 

[ssf]

If I had the funds, I would probably have preferred the Emotiva. But at the price the Crown is selling I would not mind if it sounded like Schiit. (pun intended) I recollect reading somewhere that the Crown is quite flat in the frequency response. If that were true, I would probable prefer it that way. Maybe I can play with the pre to get the sound that I like.

All an excited layman's views who is playing with a pre and power for the first time.

 

[ssf]

Received my Crowns. Waiting for the tube pre.

Just out of curiosity, could I connect my phone headphone output to the power amp, if i am really careful with the volume and gain on both respectively ?

 

[ssf]

Received the FX Audio DP-02 Tube pre amp too and was listening to the setup with the Crown 2502's Bridged. Absolutely no regrets with the purchase. The Crown can definitely be used in most home HiFi setups. They will be a delight in a HT setup. The Crowns with the DP-02, it should not be paired with laid back speakers. They will sound dull like with my Quad 12L2's. I love the pairing with the Quad S2's. It's tamed the treble just a bit and made the mid range appear just a bit fuller.

Of course, for stereo listening, you don't need two in a bridged configuration. One has more than enough power. I set it up because I had two and my Receiver is still at the repairs. So, wanted to see what insane power will do to the music (1550 Watts @ 8 Ohms). The difference is that, in my earlier setup with the Topping TP60, I was reaching to reduce the volume. With the Crowns, I am reaching to increase the volume. I have the gain at the 9 O'clock position in both the amps.

I was listening to some live YouTube concerts from Santana and Crossroads and one thing the stood out was the sound of the guitar. It was sounding absolutely lovely. Guess tons of power on reserve helps.

The tube pre-amp gets quite hot. The Crowns stay absolutely cool. I must admit, am not pushing them enough to get them hot.

Bridging does bring a small hum / hiss into the speakers which if you place your ear close to the speakers you can hear. It's not audible from a feet away. In stereo mode, there is no hiss.

Definitely not just a sub-woofer amp. Members looking into a pre-power combination should definitely give the Crown a listen.

 

[maxsumit]

I have just now bought FX audio DP-02 preamplifier from Hifimart to add in my audio setup chain which goes as
Source youtube - Fx preamp - Allo volt + amp - Diy philips hi fi q speakers 8 inch
Before adding preamp the sound was way good just harshness of full rangers but after adding preamp the loundness of sound is reduced.
Dose the preamp requires break in time ?

 

[ssf]

Tubes require to be warm before they sound their best.

DP-02 has a level out of 1.9Vrms which should work with most power amps.

 

[ssf]

Received my GE Jan 5654 W tubes today. I was wearing gloves while removing the stock tubes and when it finally came off, it flew from my hands. Luckily, it landed on my plant which was just behind it and its broad leaves saved my tubes. Now you know why plants are a must inside the house.

First impressions, no day and night difference. I had read that the 5654 was a bit treble heavy, American tube and all which I was a bit worried about but no such thing. Sounds quite similar to my stock. But what I noticed was that there was definitely a bit of increase in gain. I am listening to music at lower levels than I was listening to earlier.

 

[drkrack]

Crown with its input sensitivity set to 1.4Vrms

That Works best with active Preamplifiers, The hiss won't be heard with this input sensitivity.

had read that the 5654 was a bit treble heavy,

Give them few Hours, you'll love them. I tried Vishkod, few others, but JAN 5654 was the best amongst all others.
Also if you could get LPSU to The FX tube Preamplifier it'll improve the SQ a lot, otherwise ifi power adapter could work better I think.

The Crowns stay absolutely cool

That's the best part of Crown amp.
Also try High Pass setting at 30hz ( in general setting of 10hz less than lowest freq your speakers are capable of) on Crown XLS, I found it to improve the overall tonality to more meaty one.
Get the Thickest ( higher awg) Power Cable for Crown or DIY power Cables using Finolex 4sqmm x 3 will improve it much further. Buy the thicker speaker cables if possible.

 

[ssf]

Also try High Pass setting at 30hz

Although I would have loved to do this, I have a small problem here. My sub-woofer is connected through speaker out from Crown. So, won't any High Pass settings set in the Crown be passed to the sub-woofer too ?

 

[SwaroopKS]

That Works best with active Preamplifiers, The hiss won't be heard with this input sensitivity.

Did you try the crown with Acoustic portrait tube pre? I have replaced the Linn Classik as pre with AP. The highs and mids have improved a lot but the lows became tight and lean. Checking what tweaks can add more weight to the lows

 

[maxsumit]

Received my GE Jan 5654 W tubes today. I was wearing gloves while removing the stock tubes and when it finally came off, it flew from my hands. Luckily, it landed on my plant which was just behind it and its broad leaves saved my tubes. Now you know why plants are a must inside the house.

First impressions, no day and night difference. I had read that the 5654 was a bit treble heavy, American tube and all which I was a bit worried about but no such thing. Sounds quite similar to my stock. But what I noticed was that there was definitely a bit of increase in gain. I am listening to music at lower levels than I was listening to earlier.

Where did you get the GE Jan 5654W from?

 

[ssf]

Where did you get the GE Jan 5654W from?

Riverstone Audio - Matched Pair (2 Tubes) JAN 5654W Fully-Tested Vacuum Tubes 6J1 / 5654 /6AK5/ EF95 / 6AK5 Tube Replacement : Amazon.in: Electronics

Riverstone Audio - Matched Pair (2 Tubes) JAN 5654W Fully-Tested Vacuum Tubes 6J1 / 5654 /6AK5/ EF95 / 6AK5 Tube Replacement : Amazon.in: Electronics

www.amazon.in

Expensive. Got it after 20 days nicely packed by Riverstone Audio.

 

[drkrack]

Did you try the crown with Acoustic portrait tube pre? I have replaced the Linn Classik as pre with AP. The highs and mids have improved a lot but the lows became tight and lean. Checking what tweaks can add more weight to the lows

Yes, I used the combo with Magnepen for more than 6 months, AP Swara Tube Preamp gives the needed Bass Emphasis and brings weight to otherwise thin clinical SQ signature of Crown XLS at the cost of slightly reduced resolution. Though unpopular opinion but these Cheap Cables worked much better in improvising it further, discussed here.

Crown XLS 2502 : My Review of Sorts...

It’s a Monitor Audio Silver C350. 90bd, 200 W It’s performing pretty good, but was wondering whether adding a dedicated power amp for the Center could open up the dynamics and scale further.

www.hifivision.com

 

[ssf]

My crown paired with my very reasonable priced tube pre too does not sound thin. The bass and weight is easily noticeable and enjoyable especially when listening to Jazz.(Take five simply refuses to stop playing in my head)

I have very limited listening experience with various setups though.

 

[SwaroopKS]

Yes, I used the combo with Magnepen for more than 6 months, AP Swara Tube Preamp gives the needed Bass Emphasis and brings weight to otherwise thin clinical SQ signature of Crown XLS at the cost of slightly reduced resolution. Though unpopular opinion but these Cheap Cables worked much better in improvising it further, discussed here.

Crown XLS 2502 : My Review of Sorts...

It’s a Monitor Audio Silver C350. 90bd, 200 W It’s performing pretty good, but was wondering whether adding a dedicated power amp for the Center could open up the dynamics and scale further.

www.hifivision.com

I did look at your cable suggestions in that thread. However right now getting anything from China is turning out to be risky as well as expensive affair. If you note, the shipping options on Aliexpress are not available on many products for India and even if they are, it expensive. So let me experiment with locally available options for now.

Do you no longer have the Magnepan set-up? Wanted to check if you by any chance added a subwoofer to it.

 

[SwaroopKS]

My crown paired with my very reasonable priced tube pre too does not sound thin. The bass and weight is easily noticeable and enjoyable especially when listening to Jazz.(Take five simply refuses to stop playing in my head)

I have very limited listening experience with various setups though.

My point was definitely not on Crown, its due to change of preamp in the chain.

 

[ssf]

My point was definitely not on Crown, its due to change of preamp in the chain.

And your frank opinion of the crown, if you don't mind my asking

 

[SwaroopKS]

And your frank opinion of the crown, if you don't mind my asking

I feel its absolutely brilliant value for money amp. Without it, I would have had to shell a lot of money to make maggies sing. I really don't have a relative comparison as rest of my amps I have/tried have much less power so it won't be an ideal comparison of them paired to maggie. But any upgrade on this power amp for better performance would cost in multiples is my honest opinion.

 

[ssf]

I feel its absolutely brilliant value for money amp. Without it, I would have had to shell a lot of money to make maggies sing. I really don't have a relative comparison as rest of my amps I have/tried have much less power so it won't be an ideal comparison of them paired to maggie. But any upgrade on this power amp for better performance would cost in multiples is my honest opinion.

+1.
I was casually thinking of the Emotiva Monoblocks (xpa 1) even though for my room and my speakers, it's an overkill to say the least. But I would never have bought them as good sense would have ultimately prevailed and I would not want to spend that much money just to see what power would bring to music. But the crowns, they were selling in my budget range and on one tipsy night I did an impulsive purchase. Thankfully, it worked out for me with the Fx-Audio Tube pre and the Quad S2's. I simply just love what I am hearing.

But, just out of curiosity, I connected my Quad 12L2's once again to the system today. I have read that the Crowns make laid back speakers sing. Oh my,they were not singing. They were sounding recessed, dull, lifeless. I was making a huge effort to hear all the instruments but I was not successful. In fact, I even put my ears to the tweeters to see if they were working !!! Mind you, I don't like bright speakers. But the Quad S2's have hit just the right spot.

I think I might have to blame my cost efficient tube pre for this.

The reason that I started this thread was because I wanted newbie forum members to know that they can get great sound without breaking the bank. But I now realize that this combination will not work with all speakers even though I have heard Sean (zero fidelity) say that you can pair any pre with the crowns and you will get good sound.

As usual, thanks to my short term memory, one hour down the line I have started to enjoy the Quad 12L2's and my brain forgot all about the things that I could not hear on the Quad 12L2's

Ear break in, anyone ?