Observations: Paradigm Titan & 7, Quad 12L2, MA RS1, Usher V-601

[sonosphere]

Hi,
Actually I did audition the 685 on all songs, however I didn't find much to be excited about, hence didn't include it in observations. Maybe my preferences are very different from the way it sounds.

Cost answered in previous post. Got it thru Mr. Sridhar (ARN systems, Banglore)

Congrats, Can you compare usher 601 with B&W 685? How much did you pay and from which dealer did you buy?

 

[mpw]

sonosphere,

if you see the first few pics on my thread.. the Titans are muonted on a wooden shelf. The sound quality has vastly improved after i put them on stands. I get about 1 feet from the rear wall on my stands. BTW, the Titans have 2 ports - One front and One rear.

try to find a way to isolate the speakers from the shelf and i am sure you will experience much better sound. Dont know if 1 feet stands could be made .. maybe magma with his unique designs and aspproach could help. Or maybe sridhar could pitch in with some ideas. Anyways as long as it sounds good to your ears.. nothing else matters.

regards,
mpw

 

[magma]

sonsosphere

the speakers are placed currently less than ideal
however im well ( almost too well) aware of interior design considerations and more importantly wife and child considerations

as mpw says the speaker will definietly sound differnt when put on stands rather than wooden shelves/cabinets

if stands dont fit in with your room the best thing you can do is isolate the speaker from the shelf
A pedestal stand(1 foot) can be made on spikes
the pedestal needs to be quite heavy so it minimizes ill effects of the shelf
and the pedestal MUST be on spikes
you can use spike feet if you dont want to spoil your veneered shelves

the use of polished granite pedestal on spikes would not be a bad idea

 

[sonosphere]

Hi MPW and Magma,
Thanks for highlighting the issues.
I can raise the speakers above the stand, but due to interior considerations, I just can't increase the distance from rear wall, which is barely 1.25 feet behind the woofer & port face. (In case of front ported speaker, I believe this is the way to count the clear distance). I have to live with whatever best sound can come within these constraints :sad:

BTW, The distance from side wall is well over 3 feet.

Magma, is there anyway I can test the SQ improvements after giving more height to speaker, without first investing in the stands? I can think of crude temporary props like stool kept on shelf, and then speaker on the stool. Would it work?

Regds,
Sonosphere

 

[sonosphere]

Added more pics within previous post here >> http://www.hifivision.com/speakers/...uad-12l2-ma-rs1-usher-v-601-a.html#post195632

 

[Kittu]

Added more pics within previous post here >> http://www.hifivision.com/speakers/...uad-12l2-ma-rs1-usher-v-601-a.html#post195632

Very tempting .... Bad for wallet .

 

[rikhav]

I used to keep my speakers on a stool before I bought the stands from Ali. It did solve the height issues which were there when the speakers were kept on a table. The stools were quiet stable as well. I had kept cradboard packings below the legs so it did not shake.
But inspite of all this when the speakers were kept on stands the sound changed a lot for good. You can immediately find a difference in bass and imaging

 

[mpw]

sonosphere,

it is without a doubt.. stands are much much better than any temp arrangement.. in my view.. no need to experiment at all.. you could start budgeting ( if not already ) and going for stands. A speaker costing 35K odd needs the best support it can get in terms of placement and stands to get the best possible sound.. of course all this within the personal tastes of the owner and budget.

i think rikhav is saying the same thing.

regards,
mpw

 

[sonosphere]

Hi mpw,
thanks for the assurance.
I think this is one area in HiFi where I can go DIY route without the risk of getting electrocuted :lol:.

I would like to understand the technicalities of stand design before going ahead with it. I'll be searching the forum & web myself, however if you /magma/ fellow members can give me some web-links explaining the technicalities, It would help me.

Regds,
Sonosphere

sonosphere,

it is without a doubt.. stands are much much better than any temp arrangement.. in my view.. no need to experiment at all.. you could start budgeting ( if not already ) and going for stands. A speaker costing 35K odd needs the best support it can get in terms of placement and stands to get the best possible sound.. of course all this within the personal tastes of the owner and budget.

i think rikhav is saying the same thing.

regards,
mpw

 

[mpw]

sonosphere,

just saw your last pic of the complete setup.. i think when i use the word stands -please read as isolate from the shelf.

also.. it will be better if you wait for about a month or so and listen to the setup as it is and maybe if you like have a chat with magma or any of the experienced hands and look at what is possible.

Your setup looks good. If future the TV could be an LCD on the wall and the center stand where the TV is could be a place for your amp / avr etc..

Actually.. the specs of the V601 closely resemble that if the Titan Monitors except that the mid bass of the Titans is slightly bigger leading to a lower crossover of 1800 Hz as compared to the 2200 Hz for the V601. The other difference is the sensitivity. Would love to to an A to B comparo.... my Titans are fixed to the stands using Bostik semi glue and therefore i cannot get it to any audition.

regards,
mpw

 

[cooltoad]

Congrats Sonos, Nice setup and nice upgrade. Since i also have 9.2 presently, your inputs on the improvement over the wharfs should be valuable to me.

 

[magma]

sono
a couple things

first off
personally i find your speakers are toed in too much.
you will not a get wide soundstage like this
make them straighter a bit

Secondly ideally i would do the following
move the sub (im assuming the covered thing below the NAD amp is a sub) below the TV
Put the electronics on the shleves on which you have currently put the speakers

doing the above you have freed up some space where you can easily put correct stands

 

[sonosphere]

Hi Magma,
Thanks for the comments.

Reg Toe-in...
I have toed in speaker such that they are pointing at the central sweet spot location on the couch in front of it. BTW the It forms almost an equilateral triangle between the two speaker and the sweet spot. And that obvisously leads to a Toe-in angle of 60 degrees.

As per your suggestion I will try to angle them outwards. How many degrees would you suggest, instead of the present 60 degrees?
Reg relocating stands...
if I put the stand in the location where the NAD amp is placed presently, then it becomes extreme corner location for the Left speaker, which will lead to "bumped" up bass. Also if shift the right speaker in a similar manner, it would still be almost 7 feet away from the other corner (and will not have "bumped" bass to complement the one generated by left speaker)

For the above reason I think I am in rigid situation that leaves me no option but to keep the spkrs at some height above the Shelf. However If there is an alterntive way to counter the ill-effects of this rigid location, please let me know.

Regds,
Sonosphere

sono
a couple things

first off
personally i find your speakers are toed in too much.
you will not a get wide soundstage like this
make them straighter a bit

Secondly ideally i would do the following
move the sub (im assuming the covered thing below the NAD amp is a sub) below the TV
Put the electronics on the shleves on which you have currently put the speakers

doing the above you have freed up some space where you can easily put correct stands

 

[techgadgets4379]

Hi Magma,
Thanks for the comments.

Reg Toe-in...
I have toed in speaker such that they are pointing at the central sweet spot location on the couch in front of it. BTW the It forms almost an equilateral triangle between the two speaker and the sweet spot. And that obvisously leads to a Toe-in angle of 60 degrees.

As per your suggestion I will try to angle them outwards. How many degrees would you suggest, instead of the present 60 degrees?
Reg relocating stands...
if I put the stand in the location where the NAD amp is placed presently, then it becomes extreme corner location for the Left speaker, which will lead to "bumped" up bass. Also if shift the right speaker in a similar manner, it would still be almost 7 feet away from the other corner (and will not have "bumped" bass to complement the one generated by left speaker)

For the above reason I think I am in rigid situation that leaves me no option but to keep the spkrs at some height above the Shelf. However If there is an alterntive way to counter the ill-effects of this rigid location, please let me know.

Regds,
Sonosphere

Hi Sono,

Congrats on getting these lovely speakers, BTW did u check your NAD with wharf 9.2 before moving over to usher?

 

[sonosphere]

Hi Techgadgets,
Yes I did. Overall the details improved moderately across the whole freq spectrum with NAD, however the Norge-1000 bass was fatter and prominent, compared to leaner but more detailed bass of NAD (i.e in NAD, you could distinguish between different bass guitar sound between two different songs)

Regds,
Sonosphere

Hi Sono,

Congrats on getting these lovely speakers, BTW did u check your NAD with wharf 9.2 before moving over to usher?

 

[psychotropic]

hey sonosphere. first let me apologise for not having managed to check out the Ushers when you asked me to. I really have no excuse. Many apologies. But I am happy you got to hear them and like them and have now acquired them. Congratulations! They are truly very handsome speakers. I've only ever managed a quick listen and haven't heard them in detail. Those same drivers do duty in the X718 as well I understand.

Before you do anything elaborate, just try putting 1-inch thick granite slabs under each speaker, that goes a long way in isolating the speakers. Otherwise try putting some fat books (think telephone directory), those are a good stopgap as well.

 

[rikhav]

Hi Techgadgets,
Yes I did. Overall the details improved moderately across the whole freq spectrum with NAD, however the Norge-1000 bass was fatter and prominent, compared to leaner but more detailed bass of NAD (i.e in NAD, you could distinguish between different bass guitar sound between two different songs)

Regds,
Sonosphere

Hi
That means the NAD has better control over the bass then then Norge. With the Norge the bass is suppose to be getting loose and flabby

Also about the amp placement, I would opt to keep it on the floor (or on a slab of granite which would be on the floor) rather then keeping it on the sub and both the amps on top of each other

 

[magma]

the illefects of placing the speaker in the far corner on a stand are much less than what you will experince with the current placement

toe in should ideally be not more than 15 degrees
where did you ever read about a 60 degree toe in!
and where did you get an idea that each speaker should face the exact same spot to form an equilateral triangle?

the equilateral triangle concept is just for speaker placement not toe ins
Also an iscoles trianlge works better than an equilateral

 

[Mubeen]

Congratulations on your new speakers mate, and thanks for sharing your observations. Those Ushers look beautiful and am sure they sound the part too!

I have now got to audition some Usher speakers, since i have never had a chance to hear this brand before, and after reading your observations, i have a feeling that these are the kind of speakers that will rock my boat. So thanks once again for sharing.

 

[techgadgets4379]

Hi
That means the NAD has better control over the bass then then Norge. With the Norge the bass is suppose to be getting loose and flabby

Also about the amp placement, I would opt to keep it on the floor (or on a slab of granite which would be on the floor) rather then keeping it on the sub and both the amps on top of each other

Thanks sono for the update. what source you are using is it LGdvd?