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spirovious

spirovious

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Hi I am starting this thread where we can post short reviews OR audition experiences with new av stuff at showrooms.In short if you go for audition ,write your thoughts about new systems.What you like & what not.

To begin with I will write my short experience with Denon 1910,Dali lektor towers,Panasonic BD30 & marantz 5001.
I know there is no comparision in them,still I dare.

Yesterday I was @ CST Boomrang & took audition.Many of you know Denon1910 as gr8 movie performer & so I will write something about music.
1st I listened Denon 1910 connected Pany BD30 via HDMI to Dali lektor.
I listened instrumental CD & reginal CD(Vaishali Samant)

The Sound-Soundstage was good enough,not very big.Instruments were well clear & seperated.Vocals clear & detailed.More or less in centre(not comparing with stereo amp)I could heer a weight in sound.Overall little lively sound.

Then I connected Marantz 5001 vis analoge to Denon 1910.
I was expecting better sound with CDp.But not actually.
I found 5001 was good,but warmth was lesss than earlier.Instruments were not as cleared as 1st setup.Even vocals not as clean as earlier.

So now final comparison will be with Denon Analog Devices 24-bit/192-kHz ADAU1328 with cs4392 in marantz-
Denon AVR-1910 Reviews | ProductWiki
CD5001 - Marantz Europe

AD was having good warmth than CS.AD was cleaner than CS.
With proper system matching(stereo amp) 5001 can be the top performer,but with current settup,its not.5001 is the choice of those who like soft/laidback sound & not sharper.

Coming to Dali,lektor sound is good & speakers are musical.

So in short I enjoyed Denon 1910 with Pany BD30.
Thanks to Boomrang.

Cheers.
 
Hi friends,

Today I took audition of Yamah467 & Denon 1311.
Yamaha was connected to Jamo Sat/Sub system & Klipsh tower in stereo mode.
A 102 HCS 6 Home Cinema Systems - Description
A 102 HCS 6 Home Cinema Systems - Description

Denon 1311 connected to Jamo towers & wharfedale towers.
C 805 Floorstanding Speaker - Description


So 1st I took demo of 467 & immediately found that sound was very clean/detailed.
Surround effect was on the spot.Dialoges were clear,but somewhat thin.May be it was connected to small speakers.

Then I checked klipsh with 467.Sound was very good,detailed.Instruments were perfect.Violin sounding good.Background noice was absent.Vocals impressive.

Now time for Denon.Started with Jamo pack(towers)& what was different-the sound type.Sound was big loud enough than Yamaha467.Dialouges has weight.Seperations fine.
But I can hear some background noice,which is not accepted.Comparing to Yamaha,background music was also pleasent & easily noticable.
Not with Denon.Power was good,but overall sound was not better than Yamaha.Soundstage of Denon was big,but Yamaha has better width.
Coming to stereo with Wharfedale,sound has same signature & I enjoyed Yamaha more.

So my votes-
Yamaha 467 - 8/10
Denon 1311 - 7/10
Remember I am comparing Budget AVRs.

Thanks to Beats99 (opp.R mall,next to Sumaria, Mulund-w)
http://www.beats99.com/
 
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Nice concise points mate.....pretty much what i have noticed so far about the sound signature.Can u plz elaborate on the BG noise part as in what sorta noise where u experiencing? Was it a hiss or similar ?? coz poor speaker cables can easily induce such BG noise into the channel.
 
Good going Spirovious. Is Marantz SR5005 also in your demo list? Interested to get feedback on this.
 
@Imran-Noice means something unwanted feeling.I dont say there should be the actual noice,but background should be quiet.When I listen to xoar/D2X,I always feel the silence.
Its what one can feel if volume is increased(of amp) without playing disc.

@Amit-marantz is not on demo.I even asked Boomrang,they dont have anything for Demo.
 
A friend and I auditioned some speakers at ARN a couple of weeks ago:

1. The massive Usher Be-20 DMD. Usher Audio > Dancer Series Loudspeaker > Be-20 Diamond DMD

2. The exquisite Emerald Physics CS3.
CS3

The source was an Ayon CDP while power was supplied by the remarkable Symphonic Line amps.

Quick notes:

1. The Ushers are COLOSSAL speakers! They are much taller than most people and their finish is excellent. While the sound was great, I think they needed a much, much larger room to truly shine. However, Sridhar did give us a small teaser of what these speakers are capable of by turning the volume knob up to 11 o'clock. The feedback was almost physical in nature. Then again, you wouldn't expect anything lesser from speakers that cost as much as a luxury sedan.

2. The EPs sounded much sweeter to my ears. These are open-baffle speakers with an external crossover. The reproduction of music is stunning and must be experienced by anyone who can find time to visit ARN. The bigger brothers of the CS3 were also available but I could not find time to audition them. I plan to visit ARN again in a couple of weeks' time to finalise a deal for my stereo system. Hopefully, I'll get to listen to the CS2.3 speakers then.

Sorry if you were expecting a very professional sounding review but I'm not a very technical kind of person. My review is more about what emotion the speakers (and associated components) evoke rather than the width of the soundstage and liquidity of the mid-range.
 
I will add my short stereo review which is with Yamaha 496 stereo amp + Yamaha CDp + klipsh Towers.
Now I will say this does not sound like a good stereo amp.I think Yamaha CDp is the culprit as I have heard Yamaha amp with wharfedale 9.2 in past & sound was very good.
This set up has the power,but not even sounded as good as Yamaha AVR467(considering clean delivery)
 
Hi,

Yesterday was another day of Demo.I got a chance to set my Tannoy F1 5ch(without Sub) with Yamaha RX-667.I had read online that Yamaha cant match well with Tannoys.I was wondering why?If mission can then why cant Tannoy when they dont use aluminium OR similar tweeter.

I connected my desktop with Yamaha 667 & Hd 5570 card showed 667 in CP.But sound option was not showing any support for HD-audio.So we had to connect 667 in 2 ways-
(I did not have much time to set)

1.5.1 analoge out from my D2X to multich in of AVR.
2.Coaxial digital out to digital in.

We played some Demo & music files.
DVD files -Batman darknight 1st scene(Bank), X-men 2(plain scene),Iceage 1(starting scene),Killbill,master & commander canon shot
BD files-Kingkong
Music-can we forget eagles,hindi flacs

Now the 1st setup-

We started with multich & immediate impression was Bright sound.Then serious listening started to compare 667 with Onkyo 330.
The good thing was the centre.Dialoges were very clean & well loud.Surround were on lower side & so we increased leve from CP.Still we felt something was missing.Then I decided to keep fronts little far from eachother.Earlier they were 6ft & after 8ft.
Yes now we can get better seperation & true surround.
What I notised was soundstage of xonar is huge & big.Clearity is superb.I must say 667 amp is damn good to output minor details which I always missed with basic Onkyo AVR.
I can here background details even from surrounds well from Kingkong fight scene.

Now the music,very bright with xonar.Clearity was good,but harshness to ears.Rest was good keeping in mind that its AVR.

Now setup2-
Now we made 667 to decode & immediately we observed that sound became sweat.The harshness gone.But one thing I can say that soundstage was not as big as xonar.I can say that xonar can even suit to large hall.One thing I will admitt that we didnt set amp properly & run auto setup.Surround effect wa perfect.Dialoges were sweat without harshness.One thing I notised was with xonar we kept volume "-12" & with yamaha decoding "-10 or 9" ie we had to increase volume.The max volume setting was +16 & lowest I think "-70".So we needed more power to run F1.Now is may it be due to low powersupply(400w).

Music equally impressive & better than setup1.Harshness reduced further.Dts neo also sounded better.We even tried straight & sound was clean with good soundstage(not bigger than xonar)

Summery- 667 is very good AVR with good surround performance.Sound is sweat not very forward sounding OR very laidback.It has enough power for medium sized room
(15 X 18ft).May it even sound better with different speakers.
Coming to Tannoys,they can match well with this AVR.Multich was very bright.667 processing was better.Overall Tannoy matches 9/10 with Onkyo & 8/10 with Yamaha.May some tweaks helps to improve sound.Even adding sub can make it sound complete.Comparing to Onkyo Bass from fronts was less.Onkyo sounds better without harshness.With Yamaha you get further details.

Finally,after running setup for 2hrs I touched Yamaha top & to my surprised I hardly could felt warmth(forget HOT).With Onkyo,15 min run you can feel the heat.
 
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It was my pleasure to be with Spirovious for this Demo. This is a really wonderful and accurate description of the audition, thank you spiro for being so helpful and patient in explaining all the pros and cons in the setup and demo. The Tannoy speakers are gr8 and do blend well with the Yamaha....
 
Thanks Milton for allowing me & was really fun playing the AVR.Only thing we cldnt output HD-audio from HTPC due to time & then wld have compared the sound quality.
 
Today I did comparison between Denon 1311 & Yamaha 367 entry level AVR.Speakers were Tannoy F1 centre & fronts.Kilpsh towers for comparison.

To start with I played Demo DVD (Ps3)to Denon 1311.The sound coming from speakers was solid & sounding bigger.Surround effect was accurate,but not the Best.Dialoged were good & thicker.Main thing I found was Treble was not detailed.So I shifted to Klipsh & now I can here details.This could be due to warm sounding AVR paired with warm sounding speakers.Treble sounded really rolled of as read online before.

Now we played Bluray-kingkong.Sound was big enough & I can hear kingkong coming from my back side with thick/heavy sound.Jungle sceen had good details & overall better but less detailed sound with Tannoy F1.

Now comes music.Rock solid,but upper freqencies soft.Soundstage good & with one song I even found that as if surr were on(it was stereo mode).So perhaps feeling of speakers disappearing.Bad was vocals,not as clear as I needed.Bass was good with klipsh towers.

Now I used Yamaha 367 which has no HD decoding.So used co-ax.Immediate difference was details.I can get better sound now.The soundstage was perfect with F1.Now I can feel that movie is presented in front of me.Amazing details without Harshness.Dialoges clean.With same kingkong BD with regular 5.1 audio,sound was best with all fequency departments.

Now comes music,same tracks & again music came alive.Treble sweet without edgy,vocals the best & bass was not poor.Very impressive.

Now coming to comparision,Yamaha wins again with much better & sweat sound.The fact was that may Tannoy is not the best match,but still Yamaha is better as it goes well with Tannoy & Klipsh too.Swadesh theme sounded so clean & detailed that it was missed in Denon 1311.It can be the good effect of Burrbrown DAC vs AK chip in Denon.Some may not like a little thin vocals,but odd thick sound is not better either.

Yamaha 367: 9/10
Denon 1311: 7.5/10
 
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Shootout between Onkyo, Marantz & Denon paired with Tannoy F1-

Yesterday we got the chance to compare Onkyo HT-S3400,Marantz SR5005 & Denon AVR2310 played from F1.

1.We started with Onkyo HT-S3400.



One of the members gave this opportunity.We played some Demos like Hero,iRobot, Master & commander,Killbill clips with onkyo speakers.Also played some music.We asked to listen the sound to a member & later compare with Tannoy.

1st impression with Onkyo 3400 is a powerful HTib system.I can say its better sounding system than past few models.Sound was clean & Bass very good.Initially it was heavy,then we turn down level & changed the port direction.Now much better.

We connected Tannoy now & started irobot & I can here the background music well with out any noice.In action scene ,amp was powering speakers well & no sign of strain.
Dialoges were clear & with some weight.Surround effect was spot on.
We played some music & yes the member agreeded that he can now here better details than with original Onkyo speakers.Music was good with clean highs without brightness.
Midrange was little sharp,but with movies,no issue.

2.Later we got a chance to Demo Marantz SR5005.



Now everything changed.Sound was more neutral & instruments were sounding close to natural whether its tabala or guitar.
We could agree both on this.But one thing which I found is that although everthing was sounding perfect,I could not enjoy movie better than Onkyo.Yes marantz was doing its best to output all,even the details,but overall sound was not as you get in good Theatre.
Onkyo can go close to it.Center had detail,sharpnes,but vocals were not rounded like actual.I dont say its bad,but compared with Onkyo + F1 combo,its HT experience was analytical.Music was a big plus though.

3.Now comes Denon AVR2310 which is award winner.



Yes denon sounded better & equally powerful to Onkyo.Dialogues good,surround steering was equally good.With Tannoy,I missed some details compared to marantz. Overall better AVR if paired with matching speakers.

Now comes final verdict-
What is the best ?No one can have unique answer.Again it depends on speaker matching.
I can still vote for Onkyo for powerful,but clear HT sound effect.
Marantz for music & Denon mostly for movies, still music better than onkyo.

Lastly who are we?We are 2 members with me, Denom & Cherian.
Lastly to improve Bass from Onkyo sub,we kept it horizontal with Sub Driver facing us(like front firing SW)with port facing upwards.What it improves?It reduces booming & gives Bass little tighter which makes music more enjoyable.
 
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Today was another day to complete my AVR comparison.They are Onkyo 609,Denon 1912 & Yamaha 467.Speakers used were Tannoy F1 mercury.

We joined around 11:30am & started the task.

Source player was Dune & Panasonic BDp(later)

I had some clips mixed files of VOB,MKV.We could compare Onkyo 609 & Denon 1912 side by side as there was a splitter.

To begin with we started playing clips from Pen drive connected to Dune & it was outputting bitstream to AVR via splitter.

We turn on Onkyo TX-SR 609 & started playing some mkvs say "I am the Legend".



What we immediately found was the power.Onkyo is really mighty.We started enjoying the scene & also found it has a lot details to express.Soundstage was big & its good enough to be used in larger rooms.

Then we played hindi mkv from wanted.Again impressive with power & surround effect.Bullets were coming from all sides.Dialogues were easy & fuller.We just thought of shifting to Denon AVR-1912 & we did.



Sudden change in sound.Sound was a bit laid back.Sound field little wide.Background music was sounding pleasant.Overall sound was enjoyable with fine dialogues.Gun shots were nicely presented.We could feel the warmth.

We tried som Divx clip & this was going better as well.Denon was really sounding powerful with Divx 5.1 clip.We were enjoying Denon,but thought of shifting to Onkyo.We were stunned & just looking at each other.

How can we get such good sound from a clip which has average 5.1 sound?
Micro details were spot on.I could hear a background sound of water flowing in clip from "Fantastic Four".Again we turned to Denon,yes Denon was trying hard,but micro details were missing.
Then we realized that Denon & Tannoy ,both are warm sounding stuffs & so surely we were not getting fine details which Onkyo was presenting easily in front of us.In terms of power Onkyo is a step ahead,but Denon was not far behind.New AVR from Denon is really better than older one.(I have written in some earlier posts in the same thread)

Then we tried some music like wma,wav,mp3.Some acoustic guitar.
We played Onkyo first.Well music is the dull part of it.Vocals really non realistic.Vocals are confusing.They are poor.Guitar sounding very good with good Bass.But CDs not too good.
We shifted ti Denon with same & Denon really shines with all kind of music.Vocals were good.So we didnt play with Onkyo again.

Finally we played a Bluray King kong.Played scene no.34.Again Both AVR were good,but Onkyo really was mighty with powerful centre.Denon was not perfect match with Tannoy but doing well including music.With LPCM sent from Dune,Onkyo was doing equally best not loosing anythig.

After that we went to check Yamaha RX-V467-



Played from Panasonic we could only play DVD,BD & CD as Mkv was not supported by it.

Setup Yamaha & started Bluray with same scene.The 1st impression-huge & wide soundstage.Very clean sound delivery.Dialogues clean with great details.Surrounds were fuller & overall sound was enveloping.We couldnt believe that a lower end model of Yamaha can sound such a big?
Sound was free flow from fronts to surround & it can sound very wide in small rooms too.Power was not short still less as compared to Onkyo.This yamaha is not pumping same output as Onkyo as it has powersupply with less consumption.King kong was just in front of us.

Then saw some DVDs & equally impressive.

Finally played audio & many can admit that Yamaha is better with music too.Clean vocals,Sweat trebles & wide sound.I remember Yamaha 667 was sounding still better as it has more power.Vocals were not bad at all.

Final Thoughts-
If I compare all three,I can say Yamaha is the AVR which many will love.Its impressive with movies & music too.Even we played lower model,no hitch of weakness.
Then comes Onkyo in mind if you consider only movies as priority.Onkyo really gives theater like experience with great details.Only one con is occasionally it can sound bright with little more 5-10k frequencies.Output is not as clean as Yamaha.

Denon is another all in one solution if paired with correct speaker.Its music was powerful that Yamaha,but clearity is Yamaha's pride.Denon still is musical & not sounding noisy like Onkyo.

Its really confusing to write final verdict,still I dare -
To me
Onkyo 609
8/10 (movies)
6.5/10 (music)

Denon
7.5/10 (movies,may be 8 if paired with bright speaker)
8/10 (music)

Yamaha
9/10 (movies,considering it has lower power)
8.5/10 (music)

Finally,who are we- Darshan Joshi, TheCoolestOne & Me :)
 
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It was a day well sopent with Spiro and Darshan Joshi. Spiro came well equipped with his Tannoy fronts and centre and some good audio - video material to rip out the AVR's to their full potential. We spent a good 3 hrs auditioning the AVR's.

The icing of the cake indeed was the Yamaha which had us mesmerized. Spiro's review encapsulates our findings beautifully so there is nothing much more for me to say. Though I am relatively new to this AV world, for me there were 2 surprise packages,

(1) The Denon's ability to play Music files as well as it did justice to the Viedeos we fed it. As rightly pointed out by Spiro the Denon was a bit more laid back but soothing to the ears and went well with the Tannoy which are warm speakers. The Denon did seem slightly underpowered as compared to the Onkyo and it had to be cranked up a bit to get the best out of it. The onkyo played video files better than music and I was actually expecting it to be the other way around. But in some scenes of thr Blue Ray of King Kong that we played the onkyo caught the background sounds a bit better than the Denon but all in all the Denon seemed to be a good all rounder.

(2) The second surprise was thee older series Yamaha, which was really brilliant in terms of SQ and details with reference to both Audio and Video files and even though it is from an older series it did not sound weak. More ever it did absolute justice to Spiro's Tannoy. I had auditioned the Yamaha 667 a few weeks earlier and was unsure if the 467 would come close to it but it surprised us hands down.

I personally own the Denon 1912 but yesterday I did feel the older Yamaha series had a slight edge over denon but then it does boil down to the whole setup with reference to the speakers they were paired with and the ambience of the auditioning room as the deonon and onkyo were auditioned in a room having a slightly narrower stage area and was a treated room while the yamaha was auditioned in an raw / untreated room having a wider stage area.

All the best to those who are buying / upgrading their AVR's as Spiro's review will definately help them in their quest.

And finally I would like to give a special thanks to Spiro for comming over to my new house to help plan and set up my cabling and speaker placements as the surrounds were proving to be fiddicult in terms of placement given the layput of my room and its limitations but Spiro did come up with some innovative ideas for the surround placement.
 
@spiro,

What was the model number of Klipsh which you auditioned with the Yamaha/Denon/Onkyo AVRs. You had mentioned that they were towers. I have space limitations, hence which bookshelves according to you would give justice to the above AVRs Yamaha 467 in particular, on the movie front. Plz let me know

== JAYANT
 
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Sorry Guys for the late reply.

Amazing session spent with Spiro and TheCoolestone. Spiro, you came well equipped with your collection. No hassles of different sources. Just a single source with various formats. TheCoolestone, you are really cool.

Spiro's & TheCoolestOne precisely reviewed our findings.

For Movies : Onkyo's had almost everthing which I was looking in a HT Setup. Denon's were good at Music. But in movies, Onkyo was much better to my ears.

Denon was a bit more laid back and suited well with the music in comparison. Vocals were not very clear in Onkyo's while playing music. However I still felt something was missing in Music in both the cases.

Unfortunately i could not demo Yamaha AVR. However, our choices and findings were very close while Auditioning Denon and Onkyo. So I am sure that Yamaha must have rocked.

Would be having a demo of Yamaha AVR this weekend and would post my reviews soon.
 
Today was the surprise day for Demo as it wasn't pre-planned.
What was on Demo?Some entry level sets(Budget HT systems).

So to start we auditioned Denon 1312 connected to polk HT pack RM705


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

We started with some DTS clips like Hero,i robot,Killbill.
What we found was the pace.Denon was powering satellites very will with good clarity.Treble was not harsh ,but with better appearance.Micro details were surely missing.Dialogs didnt have that weight as entry level Onkyo 3400 has.
We even tried focal sub sat,it sounded bright.We connected Polk bigger centre & now vocals were sounding better.Focal sub was not upto the average & not to be considered seriously.

Polk sub couldn't give us good thump like most of HT sub does.It couldn't go very low.though not boomy,it wasn't best.
For a change ,we tried Kef C4 sub & yes now we can feel subwoofer doing its job much better.Lower end Thump was present now.
Overall its good budget system,but not the VFM.

Then we checked Yamaha RX-V367 with Klipsh sub sat.



The immediate impression was balanced sound.Micro details present which we missed in Denon combo.We thought that it may be due to better speakers,so tried Yamaha sub sat.Yes a little change in overall sound quality,but Yamaha was delivering perfect balance with natural surround.
We tried music which was equally impressive.

So we admitted that Yamaha over all performance was much better than Denon.

Now who are we today?
Denom,Santy & Me :).

Now for a change we audioned Kef Q 300 connected to Denon CDp + Amp combo-






Played some mix tracks like Swadesh,Lagan,Eagles.
The very first impression was oh what a deep Bass?
One can thing that SW is turned on.Such a deep & accurate Bass,I hardly ever heard similar before from so called bookshelf speakers.

Treble was very accurate & not very thin.The overall great dynamic sound.Bas was not dominating treble.the best way to listen is tabla & yes it was perfect.

For 32k price its a still.Superb sound with solid punch.
We played "mehandi hai Rachanevali" song & again Bass impressed us.I cant get same level of Bass details from ATH-M50 + xonar D2X combo.

Denon & Kef Q300 is really good Hifi to consider.Midrange is very clean unlike earlier series.
Only one problem, with volume turned more ,we could hear some rattling/clutter sound.

Else more value for lesser money(In comparison)
After all it has 5 star ratings from whatshifi ,av-Max & now from US.
 
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