Suggestion regarding Bookshelves for LCR

Wharfedale Speakers

NadirT

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Hello everyone.
I have posted a non refined version of this post in the Speaker section. It didn’t get much response but in last two days, few kind FMs guided me a little which let to the creation of this post.
Earlier, I was confused about the centre channel. Various designs and their synergy with Fronts. What I understood going through various posts on internet, having an identical set of speakers will give the best result. But as space is a major constraint, centre channel is designed horizontally for easy placement as not all of us have acoustically transparent projector screen/TV. Due to this I never even considered going for an identical LCR. And my hunt was on the similar line. Centre and Front from same series. But @elangoas point of using identical speakers for LCR and Rear was always on my mind. And yesterday while interacting with @AmK and @DB1989 on my different post, this suggestion again came up. But this time, instead of just making assumptions about space availability, I used numbers to guide me. And what an eye opening guidance it was.

I have attached the room picture with markings which will help you understand my points easily. My living room is ~240sqft.
1. My Tv is 3 inches above my ear level (the maroon line).
2. Between my Tv and entertainment unit, there is 18.1” of space. This gives me flexibility of adding any BS which is less that 18” (the big ones with 6.5” driver in my budget are max 15”).
3. The Front speakers will be wall mounted. This limits my option to BS with front port designs.
4. The three green bars are the speaker placement markers.


The speaker usage is 70% movie and web-series over OTT, 25% gaming, and 5% music. As per the aforementioned conditions, I narrowed down to following three speakers. I know I will be left with one BS but i can manage with that if the overall effects are better than using the traditional centre speaker.
1. Polk RtiA3. (MRP- ₹32,000/pair, will get some discount)
2. Wharfedale diamond 11.2 (₹34,850/pair Hifimart, MRP- ₹41,000)
3. Elac debut 2.0 B6.2 (₹31,365/pair on Hifimart, MRP- ₹36,990)

All these speakers have 6.5” drivers and max height of 15”. I am more inclined towards Polk because of the cherry finish which will match the rest of furniture in my living room. Same goes with Wharfedale in walnut finish. Heard a lot about Elac2.0, goes upto 33khz.

Right now, I have YHT1840. So these speakers will be powered by HTR2071. In future, I will upgrade to an atmos AVR thus these speakers are my final future purchase. Will be buying an active SW in few days, most probably Yamaha NSW300 or BICF12 (if I get better rate). This will lower down the load on my AVR giving it at least some extra juice.

Few of my confusions are:
1. Is using a BS for centre instead of traditional centre speaker is really a good idea?
2. Is 6.5” driver necessary enough for 240sqft room? Or I can go with 5.25” versions of these speakers which will save me 15-20k. I will be anyway using the 5.25” versions for my surround, as these series don’t make any smaller size drivers.


I hope I have made my points clear to you all. Looking forwards to your advices. Do point out if I am missing anything or fail to convey my thoughts properly.

Thank you in advance. E75FC970-B4EC-410D-8E71-E8834D1CBC65.jpeg
 
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avtar2008

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I never saw anyone using a bookshelf as center channel, since both are optimised for diff purposes.

Better get a center channel.
 
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drkrack

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Hello everyone.
I have posted a non refined version of this post in the Speaker section. It didn’t get much response but in last two days, few kind FMs guided me a little which let to the creation of this post.
Earlier, I was confused about the centre channel. Various designs and their synergy with Fronts. What I understood going through various posts on internet, having an identical set of speakers will give the best result. But as space is a major constraint, centre channel is designed horizontally for easy placement as not all of us have acoustically transparent projector screen/TV. Due to this I never even considered going for an identical LCR. And my hunt was on the similar line. Centre and Front from same series. But @elangoas point of using identical speakers for LCR and Rear was always on my mind. And yesterday while interacting with @AmK and @DB1989 on my different post, this suggestion again came up. But this time, instead of just making assumptions about space availability, I used numbers to guide me. And what an eye opening guidance it was.

I have attached the room picture with markings which will help you understand my points easily. My living room is ~240sqft.
1. My Tv is 3 inches above my ear level (the maroon line).
2. Between my Tv and entertainment unit, there is 18.1” of space. This gives me flexibility of adding any BS which is less that 18” (the big ones with 6.5” driver in my budget are max 15”).
3. The Front speakers will be wall mounted. This limits my option to BS with front port designs.
4. The three green bars are the speaker placement markers.


The speaker usage is 70% movie and web-series over OTT, 25% gaming, and 5% music. As per the aforementioned conditions, I narrowed down to following three speakers. I know I will be left with one BS but i can manage with that if the overall effects are better than using the traditional centre speaker.
1. Polk RtiA3. (MRP- ₹32,000/pair, will get some discount)
2. Wharfedale diamond 11.2 (₹34,850/pair Hifimart, MRP- ₹41,000)
3. Elac debut 2.0 B6.2 (₹31,365/pair on Hifimart, MRP- ₹36,990)

All these speakers have 6.5” drivers and max height of 15”. I am more inclined towards Polk because of the cherry finish which will match the rest of furniture in my living room. Same goes with Wharfedale in walnut finish. Heard a lot about Elac2.0, goes upto 33khz.

Right now, I have YHT1840. So these speakers will be powered by HTR2071. In future, I will upgrade to an atmos AVR thus these speakers are my final future purchase. Will be buying an active SW in few days, most probably Yamaha NSW300 or BICF12 (if I get better rate). This will lower down the load on my AVR giving it at least some extra juice.

Few of my confusions are:
1. Is using a BS for centre instead of traditional centre speaker is really a good idea?
2. Is 6.5” driver necessary enough for 240sqft room? Or I can go with 5.25” versions of these speakers which will save me 15-20k. I will be anyway using the 5.25” versions for my surround, as these series don’t make any smaller size drivers.


I hope I have made my points clear to you all. Looking forwards to your advices. Do point out if I am missing anything or fail to convey my thoughts properly.

Thank you in advance. View attachment 48273

Had a similar requirements as yours but mainly I didn't want the HT speaker boxes to interfere with my stereo listening. So went on to get the most economic on wall LCR to complement my MA Mass Atmos setup. If you can wait for couple of days, I can update you with the first impressions of these speakers as well. Check out if this works out for you.

 
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NadirT

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I never saw anyone using a bookshelf as center channel, since both are optimised for diff purposes.

Better get a center channel.

This blog has been referred on various centre channel discussion posts over the internet.


And it says exactly what I have read over and over. Due to space constraint, the centre channel is designed horizontally.

To quote from the blog:
In an ideal world we would have three (3) identical speakers with a vertical arrangement of drivers for the front left, front right and center speakers; hence the term “matching LCR’s”
.
“Mounting a speaker horizontally, like nearly all center channel speakers, almost always sacrifices performance for convenience. Our ears are more sensitive to the acoustical interference caused by horizontal lobing errors than they are to vertical lobing errors of multiple drivers being physically separated while sharing the same signal and bandwidth of operation.”


One cannot get away by ignoring Physics. What I am eager to know is how much of the difference will be felt in real life scenarios. Take phantom centre for example. If you have a wider seating area the person sitting on the corner will not experience the phantom centre as the one in the middle.

I am not trying to start a debate or demean anyone’s experience. These are my genuine queries and I am more than eager to learn and change my view based on valid facts and results. Technology changes with time and new methods are developed to overcame the constraints of past.
It’s just that few people can place identical speakers at ear level without obstructing their TV viewing experience, and I happen to be one of them. So i just thought of putting my dilemma out for others to guide me.

No disrespect to anyone. For all I know, I am the least knowledgeable and experienced amongst you all.
 
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NadirT

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Had a similar requirements as yours but mainly I didn't want the HT speaker boxes to interfere with my stereo listening. So went on to get the most economic on wall LCR to complement my MA Mass Atmos setup. If you can wait for couple of days, I can update you with the first impressions of these speakers as well. Check out if this works out for you.

This is really a nice option. Let’s see if I can get some reviews of it.
Thank you for suggesting this.
 
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elangoas

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It’s just that few people can place identical speakers at ear level without obstructing their TV viewing experience, and I happen to be one of them.

If you like the idea of 3 or more identical speakers, go for it.. It is unique one, not many many weigh this option.. No dealer place will show you this demo..

I have 5 identical speakers (bed channels) at the moment all at ear level.. I would say this has been the better expereince to.me so far with an Acoustic Transperant screen.. (L-C-R behind screen)..

When the scene moves left to right or vice versa, you can easily feel it..

If I had the liberty of dedicated space, I would look at 11 or more identical speakers..

If you can't fit a single BS flas center, then the other better option would be to look for 3-way center channel speaker.. But, however good it may be, nothing would sound better than 3 identical L-C-R..

Few of my confusions are:
1. Is using a BS for centre instead of traditional centre speaker is really a good idea?
2. Is 6.5” driver necessary enough for 240sqft room? Or I can go with 5.25” versions of these speakers which will save me 15-20k. I will be anyway using the 5.25” versions for my surround, as these series don’t make any smaller size drivers.

Between the 6.5 inch and 5.25 inch versions, the 6.5 inch driver may be able to dig more deeper than 5.25 inch.. But usually, once we have HT setup done, we are often recommended to use 80Hz crossover point to subwoofer for most speakers.. This is for the sub tonhandke to lows.. So this function negates the purpose of a bigger driver to dig deeper.. A single 5.25 inch driver should be more than enough IMO..

I have heard some.of the Yamaha floorstanders are sold as single piece.. Since you have space to accomodate below your TV, you can as well consider 3 FS as L-C-R..

If you can and are willing, just go beyond the usual..
 
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NadirT

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I hope using BS won’t subdue the midrange (dialogues especially).


I have heard some.of the Yamaha floorstanders are sold as single piece.. Since you have space to accomodate below your TV, you can as well consider 3 FS as L-C-R..

If you can and are willing, just go beyond the usual..

The 18” is all I get. No permission to move the entertainment unit. Also, I am more inclined towards BS,
 
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elangoas

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I hope using BS won’t subdue the midrange (dialogues especially).

I have read more articles / recommendations on using BS as center as it is the best form of center channel use..

The 18” is all I get. No permission to move the entertainment unit. Also, I am more inclined towards BS,

Ok.. Then BS it is, choose one according to the space you have and your budget..
 
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NadirT

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I have read more articles / recommendations on using BS as center as it is the best form of center channel use..



Ok.. Then BS it is, choose one according to the space you have and your budget..

@drkrack suggested FYN Audio F300LCR. The size is apt to mount vertically. Will wait for his review. In the mean time, will keep on looking for options and guidance.
 
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sathtom

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In an ideal world we would have three (3) identical speakers with a vertical arrangement of drivers for the front left, front right and center speakers; hence the term “matching LCR’s”

I had the same doubt why Center Channel has to be a horizontally designed one apart from the obvious Aesthetic reasons. Thanks to @drkrack & @elangoas for reaffiming this fact.
 
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DB1989

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Had a similar requirements as yours but mainly I didn't want the HT speaker boxes to interfere with my stereo listening. So went on to get the most economic on wall LCR to complement my MA Mass Atmos setup. If you can wait for couple of days, I can update you with the first impressions of these speakers as well. Check out if this works out for you.

Looks interesting. Eagerly awaiting your impressions.
 
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NadirT

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Had a similar requirements as yours but mainly I didn't want the HT speaker boxes to interfere with my stereo listening. So went on to get the most economic on wall LCR to complement my MA Mass Atmos setup. If you can wait for couple of days, I can update you with the first impressions of these speakers as well. Check out if this works out for you.

Still waiting for the Review :)
 
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drkrack

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Still waiting for the Review :)
I Got the Speakers installed today, they're Compact, very good build quality so on a heavier side. First impression is they're highly resolving, but sharp, can get pretty loud easily, Midrange is very very good , Treble bit on the brighter side (absolutely not harsh) & bass is adequate yet average. In my experience, Treble eventually smoothens with some burn in. As far as HT with subwoofer support is concerned ; they are a perfect fit. I am liking the amazing resolution a lot.

IMG_20200813_181622_compress41.jpg
IMG_20200814_210812_crop_31__01.jpg
 
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viewsony

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@drkrack suggested FYN Audio F300LCR. The size is apt to mount vertically. Will wait for his review. In the mean time, will keep on looking for options and guidance.
Can I use Taga Azure 40 BS as centre Channel, I dont have place it vertical, so is it okay if i place it horizontal??
 
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NadirT

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Can I use Taga Azure 40 BS as centre Channel, I dont have place it vertical, so is it okay if i place it horizontal??
I don’t think any BS is designed to be placed horizontally, unless stated otherwise by the manufacturer.
If you already own Taga Azure, try placing it vertically in the centre at the same height as your Fronts. And see if that works.
 
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