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Which DAC is better? Denon 2310 or oppo 93

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john_k_antony

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Hi,

I am planning to connect an oppo 93 player to my Denon 2310. My question is which one has a better DAC? This for stereo playback.

If denon DAC is better, then I connect oppo-93 to denon using HDMI and let denon do the DAC.

If oppo DAC is better, then I will have to connect oppo analog output to denon using high quality RCA. I will still connect oppo to denon using HDMi for dts true hd and other Dolby digital plus etc.

Any info on this will be really appreciated.

thanks,
John.
 

manoj.p

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Oppo 93 has better DAC than Denon. If you use analog, then make sure to use pure direct or something similar. You don't want Denon to convert ADC, process and do DAC again. That will defeat the purpose. Also, your speakers should be able to do full range in this case.
 

john_k_antony

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Oppo 93 has better DAC than Denon. If you use analog, then make sure to use pure direct or something similar. You don't want Denon to convert ADC, process and do DAC again. That will defeat the purpose. Also, your speakers should be able to do full range in this case.
Do you mean to say that if I bypass Denon DAC, I wont be able to use my subwoofer? I have KEF IQ-7 for fronts. I think they are okay speakers, but I need a subwoofer for better bass output. I am not impressed with the bass from IQ-7 alone. However Denon let me use the subwoofer even in the pure direct mode.
 

spirovious

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You can use SW when connected as analog to Denon.If you opt straight/direct,you cant.
 

anm

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if you use a crossover in denon, it would be a digital cross over. Otherwise, it would send low freq to both the sub and the main speakers.

btw, what speakers do u have?
 

kumarab

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The actual chip, Cirrus/Wolfson/AKG whatever, doesn't matter, they are all very good, and you can't really differentiate between them. What matters is the analog out implementation--just alternate the setups a few times..and see what sounds best to you.

Never use Direct/Pure direct modes on AVRs. What's the point of getting an AVR if you don't employ what is arguably the most important feature of the unit? A majority of what reaches your ears is dictated by your room, so use the room correction processing, unless you've invested heavily in acoustically treating your room of course.

If you absolutely must use Direct, then Denon's do output to SW even in those modes. You just select LFE+MAIN in your setup, while keeping the FL/FR as Large.
 

kumarab

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^^It creates filters and response curves for all individual speakers. Yes, it stays on for surround as well as stereo, except when you use Direct/PureDirect modes.
 
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Shivam

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Try both your options and choose the one that sounds better to 'you' in your present listening room setup.
 

manoj.p

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All the processing like Dolby PLII/DTS Neo/Crossover/Room EQ etc inside an AVR happens in digital domain. If the analog signal is fed to receiver, then it first does the analog to digital and then do this processing. After its done, it converts the signal to analog using its own DAC.

If OP wants to take advantage of DAC in Oppo, then he has to use Puredirect mode, otherwise its all redundant if any of the processing is used. If he wants to use any processing, then he is better off using digital out as ADC and DAC will make it worse. Choose your poison.

As for Denon sending the subwoofer signal to both FL/FR and sub in Puredirect, its called double bass. Its just sending the signal to both and even though there will be output from sub, the overall bass won't be accurate because its simply doubled. It only works out with speakers that do not have much of a bass output.
 

kumarab

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@Venkat: Yes, ideally they should be. I was just making the OP aware of an option where he can use the SW while being in Direct/Pure direct.

@manoj: People put too much faith in hi-fi claims and DACs in particular. It's been more than a decade when even the DACs in your 4K DVD players surpassed the quality thresholds of human hearing.

Not only is "redundant" a gross overstatement, the AD/DA conversions in most cases do "almost" nothing to what you hear. However, and untreated room will tyrannically dictate what you hear. Here's an exercise for you.

Get yourself the best equipment money can buy...lets say Wilson X-2s or something. Audinote Ongaku..and some of those nonsensical power/speaker/rca cables. Now, 1) play that setup in a raw room with no fitting/furnitures, 2) install a few fittings, maybe a chair or two, 3)..heavily populate the room with furniture, curtains et al.

Just for fun..here's a 4th--do the exercise in your home and simply move your setup to another room.

Then come back to me and tell me what truly made a difference.
 

manoj.p

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@Venkat: Yes, ideally they should be. I was just making the OP aware of an option where he can use the SW while being in Direct/Pure direct.

@manoj: People put too much faith in hi-fi claims and DACs in particular. It's been more than a decade when even the DACs in your 4K DVD players surpassed the quality thresholds of human hearing.

Not only is "redundant" a gross overstatement, the AD/DA conversions in most cases do "almost" nothing to what you hear. However, and untreated room will tyrannically dictate what you hear. Here's an exercise for you.

Get yourself the best equipment money can buy...lets say Wilson X-2s or something. Audinote Ongaku..and some of those nonsensical power/speaker/rca cables. Now, 1) play that setup in a raw room with no fitting/furnitures, 2) install a few fittings, maybe a chair or two, 3)..heavily populate the room with furniture, curtains et al.

Just for fun..here's a 4th--do the exercise in your home and simply move your setup to another room.

Then come back to me and tell me what truly made a difference.
Kumar,

Yes, I am well aware about those things. I am always in the non-believer camp. I always use the processing in the AVR because the room correction, level matching, phase/delays done by AVR is more important than what DAC is used by the player. I have measured my room response using an SPL meter, and used it to eq the sub in past. The raw curve is all over the place. Had to use different sub positions (I have dual subs) to get peaks and dips nullified. I also used the room treatments, but these were not enough. Had to use an external eq for subs to make it flatter. About the DAC - I have Marantz DV8400 player and I use it with Co-ax, so just the DAC is not so important for me, but the whole system and how its setup is.

I just wanted to point out to the OP what he is losing out on by choosing to use DAC in Oppo. He needs to make a choice whats important for him. Better yet, If he wants to compare the two, then he can compare it by running the setup in PureDirect vs running through co-ax.

I also believe in less conversions from analog to digital and so. Because the analog signal is prone to loss. More the signal transfers in digital domain, the better. This is true for both Audio as well as Digital.
 
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manoj.p

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So Denon is useless for anything audio?
Nope. That depends upon how you want to use it. It has lots to offer, but lets you choose how much you want to use of it. If you have things at your disposal, then always compare the two and go with what sounds best or which one you like.
 
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jlettie

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Re: Which DAC is better? Marantz SR7005 or oppo 93

Hi
I will be purchasing both items. I have read that if you connect the Oppo through HDMI the quality of sound is about the same if the player was connected through 7.1 analog out. Has anybody listened to music through either connection? Do you feel that there was no difference in the quality of the sound? Thanks
 
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