Why You Should Never Pay More Than $10 For HDMI Cables

[Thad E Ginathom]

Why You Should Never Pay More Than $10 For HDMI Cables

Please see the above link at LifeHacker and stop paying silly money to companies like Monster for digital cables!

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

The only thing I can see the point of, in very humid conditions, like here in Chennai, in with all sorts of pollution in the air too, leading to rust and corrosion of other metals, is gold plating contacts and other exposed metal parts --- not for any audio- or video-phile reasons, but for simple preservation and longevity.

 

[malvai]

Good article Thad...

I have a sneaking suspicion that the audio / video industry has been resorting a lot of cons when it comes to cables etc...

 

[ukjeyaraj]

Nice article. When totally appreciating the content provided in the link, it is to be noted, not to go for el' cheapo cables. Also one need to spend time in finding a cable worth VFM, irrespective of the brand names(however big it may be)

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

It is worth going for a properly made cable, with properly made terminations and strong plugs. This much is worth paying for. the point of the article is that added hype is not worth paying for, because, mostly, a digital cable will work or fail --- which is rather digital in itself, I suppose!

If it is so cheap that the plugs fall apart, or cable strands break inside, then obviously that is bad.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the audio / video industry has been resorting a lot of cons when it comes to cables etc...

And I have a sneaking suspicion that some companies sell the hype more than others. In fact, some companies specialise in it.

Shop wisely!

 

[borg]

I was thinking the same and bought a 5m cable priced rs 850 to connect my pc to tv
but every 15-20 minutes the screen goes blank with no audio
so i think the above logic is applicable for short cables (say 1m)

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

There is probably a fault with that cable.

With any consumer item there are going to be companies whose workmanship is bad, or who do not have any quality control.

Back in London, I discovered, one day, that I had spent ten years living round the corner from an electronic component shop that sold unbranded cables at a fraction of the price of my usual outlets. I even started buying cables for the office there!

 

[NetFreak]

Its true that "expensive" cables are hogwash. If cable is good with basics like termination, resistance etc, there is no need to spend any more.

mostly, a digital cable will work or fail --- which is rather digital in itself, I suppose!

Definition of "work" is different in digital world.

If a digital cable is not working properly, data will still be sent from point A to B. But it will take longer. This is because:

1. A sends a "frame" over the wire to B. Frame is like a packet of data.
2. Frame gets lost due to bad transmission. E.g. cable did not shield it from interference or there was noise. checksum would fail at B, so Frame is lost
3. A would keep sending Frame till B confirms receipt via "ACK" frame.

Thats why if you stay far away from telephone exchange, you get poorer speeds for broadband due to too much noise on line.

In case of audio/video that results in buffer being full at one end of HDMI, and most good systems will compensate that by lowering bandwidth requirements. That is done by lowering signal quality.

However, this would happen is extreme cases. That is if cable skimped on copper or skimped on shielding.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

In my perusing of various consumer sources, I find one company comes in for a lot of criticism about its hype and its prices --- and its tendency to defend its market in court. I don't think I would ever buy its products, whether video or audio.

As it happens, the only 'digital' cables that I use at this time are ethernet network cables. When I was using digital interconnects (as part of a fairly complex setup combining PC, mini-disk, hifi) they were optical --- but they were not expensive.

So far as HDMI is concerned: I don't even watch TV! My new PC has HDMI output; one day I might have something to connect it to

However, as a consumer issue so well put, this just screamed at me that I had to post it here. I've read and heard the same point of view often --- but this was so well illustrated --- literally!.

One very good point is that the dealer markup can be as much as 80%. Those of us (which certainly includes me) that find it hard to escape the expensive-must-be-better psychology, should, therefore, look at those prices and cut them to 20% before evaluating the feel-good factor!

 

[venkatcr]

Though, in general, what you all are saying is true, the quality of cables do matter to some extent. For example, if your cable length is over 30 feet, cheap cables may not even carry HDMI signals at all. Even for short distances, I would prefer to use a cable I have some confidence in.

HDMI actually sends the picture pixel by pixel, uncompressed, so dropouts can happen on individual pixels. If these dropouts are bad, a whole line could disappear, or you could see a frame jumping.

With particular regard to AV, HDMI uses what is called TDMS (Transition Minimized Differential Signalling) to carry AV data. This is across 12 pins of a HDMI connector. Pins 01 to 09 carry the AV data, while pins 10 through 12 carry a clock signal. Now this very critical as the clock synchronizes between the audio and video. If the clock signal is dropped you will get lip-sync issues. For example, at home yesterday, I have playing a HD version of Rush Hour. Whenever a chapter changed, I would get the sound first, and the video a few seconds later. This did not happen in every movie. I changed the cable (that came with the player) with a branded cable, and the issue disappeared.

Unlike computer networking, communication between AV equipment through HDMI is not always two way. At the beginning, the receiving station sends what is called Extended Display Identification Channel (EDID). This information tells the sending station what kind of data the receiving station can accept. Once this is set, then the data flow is one way. Unlike computer networks, where the communication is dynamic and continuous, the receiving station in an AV system cannot ask for resending of AV data if the checksum is incorrect. Data loss, if any, is thus absolute.

Though the data moving between the two stations is digital, also remember that cable sees it as just an electrical current. If the cable has bad conductance, it can lose data. The longer the cable, the more the danger of losing data. Similarly if the connectors are not made well, seating could be an issue, and any of the nineteen odd pins in HDMI may not have a proper contact. If the conductivity of the pins are suspect, again you have will have issues of data travelling in whole. You could lose pixels of video information, or hear stuttering of audio, as well as see lip-sync issues.

I am not arguing for expensive cables. Just cautioning members that even for HDMI, quality can be an issue. I have seen extensive differences between cables in co-axial digital, optical digital, component, as well as HDMI.

When I spend 50,000 on a receiver, 50,000 on a TV, 20,000 on a player, I certainly will not insert a cable that I suspect.

Cheers

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

No arguments with your technical coverage (you know far more about this stuff than I do anyway, audio or visual) but I would draw attention to the subjectivity and non-technical nature of confidence and suspicion!

When I spend 50,000 on a receiver, 50,000 on a TV, 20,000 on a player, I certainly will not insert a cable that I suspect.

Any cable should be well made, with the right conductors, good protection/insulation and well-made, quality terminations. This applies just as much to something that has a light bulb on the end as it does to something which connects 1 Lakh worth of kit*. What your table lamp does not need is all the expensive hype stuff, some of which might be valid for analogue cables, but would seem absolutely irrelevant for digital.

Yesterday, I got through two burnt-out sockets, one plug, one melted adapter, and nearly ruined one rather nice digital plug-in time switch before I finally accepted that the garden christmas lights, drawing over 7 amps (yes, to my shame, I even metered it ) could not be plugged into a 5-amp socket. It is now changed to 16-amp plug/socket and is not even warming the pins, let alone causing heat.

Of course cabling should be appropriate.

That street food may once have made a person ill does not mean that only five-star-hotel catering is safe!




*in fact, that light-bulb cable could put your entire house at risk!

 

[venkatcr]

but I would draw attention to the subjectivity and non-technical nature of confidence and suspicion! Any cable should be well made, with the right conductors, good protection/insulation and well-made, quality terminations. This applies just as much to something that has a light bulb on the end as it does to something which connects 1 Lakh worth of kit*.

Thad, any cable cannot be well made. Every product has a cost - R&D, material, production, organisation, quality control, and distribution. When I say confidence, I am talking about a product that is manufactured under some quality guidance that I know exists. Remember, HDMI connectors need very precise measurements. When I buy from a well known company with warranty and support, I know that certain quality measures would have been followed and thus I have some 'confidence' in the product.

When you buy an HDMI cable for 10$, obviously the manufacturer has to cut corners to make some margins. Where he is cutting corners is something I will never know. It could be the cable, could be the connectors, could be soldering, could be anything. That is why my 'suspicion' is high in these cases. And, of course, when and if you can call such manufacturers for support, you will not get any. I have many times faced shops and dealers telling me, 'what do you expect when you buy something cheap?'.

Not my cup of tea at all. A well known brand gives me piece of mind, and that also has a cost, unfortunately.

Fortunately or unfortunately I have seen both sides of the coin. For many HFV members I have assembled a speaker switch. In spite of my best efforts, I was not able to reduce the cost with a given quality I was adamant about. Many of the people involved in the process have advised me - used cheaper connectors, why do you need such a expensive cabinet, use cheap cables, and so on. I stuck to my quality standards, and the end result was good. But it had a cost attached.

Cheers

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Venkat, I am sure you base your considerations on genuine quality advantages and I can't argue with that. Still, there are a lot of ifs and could-bes

 

[spirovious]

As long as cheap cables are of better quality with specifications,they are worth.
I can say this as I compared monoprice HDMI cable with MX.

 

[NetFreak]

When you buy an HDMI cable for 10$, obviously the manufacturer has to cut corners to make some margins. Where he is cutting corners is something I will never know.

10$ is certainly more than enough to create , distribute and sell a quality cable of 5 - 10 feet.

Problem with HDMI is, it carries data at 10 gbps (at full load, E.g. 3D, 1440p, 16 bit colors). So, any error has larger impact.

In comparison, LAN cable maxes out at just 1 gbps.

In a real world test:

1. Even $230 Monster cables failed some tests at 10 meter (messed up 1s and 0s)
2. Cheap cable ($5) passed 1080p tests up to 6 feet

So, for 6 feet connection even monoprice cables would do the job.

Details:

The Truth About Monster Cable, Part 2 (Verdict: Cheap Cables Keep Up...Usually)

 

[venkatcr]

As long as cheap cables are of better quality with specifications,they are worth.

This sounds like a oxymoron, Spiro.

I am sure what you meant was - 'as long as the quality is good, and the price is reasonable, they are worth it.'

Cheers

 

[vardu]

Though, in general, what you all are saying is true, the quality of cables do matter to some extent. For example, if your cable length is over 30 feet, cheap cables may not even carry HDMI signals at all. Even for short distances, I would prefer to use a cable I have some confidence in.

HDMI actually sends the picture pixel by pixel, uncompressed, so dropouts can happen on individual pixels. If these dropouts are bad, a whole line could disappear, or you could see a frame jumping.

With particular regard to AV, HDMI uses what is called TDMS (Transition Minimized Differential Signalling) to carry AV data. This is across 12 pins of a HDMI connector. Pins 01 to 09 carry the AV data, while pins 10 through 12 carry a clock signal. Now this very critical as the clock synchronizes between the audio and video. If the clock signal is dropped you will get lip-sync issues. For example, at home yesterday, I have playing a HD version of Rush Hour. Whenever a chapter changed, I would get the sound first, and the video a few seconds later. This did not happen in every movie. I changed the cable (that came with the player) with a branded cable, and the issue disappeared.

Unlike computer networking, communication between AV equipment through HDMI is not always two way. At the beginning, the receiving station sends what is called Extended Display Identification Channel (EDID). This information tells the sending station what kind of data the receiving station can accept. Once this is set, then the data flow is one way. Unlike computer networks, where the communication is dynamic and continuous, the receiving station in an AV system cannot ask for resending of AV data if the checksum is incorrect. Data loss, if any, is thus absolute.

Though the data moving between the two stations is digital, also remember that cable sees it as just an electrical current. If the cable has bad conductance, it can lose data. The longer the cable, the more the danger of losing data. Similarly if the connectors are not made well, seating could be an issue, and any of the nineteen odd pins in HDMI may not have a proper contact. If the conductivity of the pins are suspect, again you have will have issues of data travelling in whole. You could lose pixels of video information, or hear stuttering of audio, as well as see lip-sync issues.

I am not arguing for expensive cables. Just cautioning members that even for HDMI, quality can be an issue. I have seen extensive differences between cables in co-axial digital, optical digital, component, as well as HDMI.

When I spend 50,000 on a receiver, 50,000 on a TV, 20,000 on a player, I certainly will not insert a cable that I suspect.

Cheers

It is the standard 90/10 rule - If the cable can satisfy 90% of the requirements , how much are you willing to spend for the remaining 10% and is it really something you are buying because it is there or because you can feel the difference.

Even though the TV is 75K and the HT setup - 1.5 - I am still not going to buy a wall plate for more than Rs 20 for the switch.

There is a certain point beyond which we are merely the suckers being spotted a mile away.

100 ft Belkin Cat-6 cable is around $80 at Staples, whereas you can buy the same 100ft online for $20 at Monoprice. The quality is the same - I MEAN THE EXACT SAME in terms of speed,frequency etc...

Sometimes things cost more because there are enough folks to buy it.

Companies tend to make things look indispensable because they want to sell it - one example - banana plugs.

Sure they make life easier and it is easier to handle than a 12 AWG but folks have forgotten the original purpose of the termination/connector and instead made it an industry - JUST CONNECT THE BARE WIRE!!

It has been proven in many experiments , that if you were to just connect it properly to both ends and maybe cover it with proper electrical tape - as long as you don't keep shifting and changing it, you should do just fine.

But folks still keep plugging away at buying the next gen of plugs made of plated gold , solid gold, temple jewelery gold ( including me) because they just can't accept that the original solution is probably a very decent one meeting the 90/10 rule.

 

[venkatcr]

10$ is certainly more than enough to create , distribute and sell a quality cable of 5 - 10 feet.

2. Cheap cable ($5) passed 1080p tests up to 6 feet

I don't have any Monster products, and I cannot pass any judgement on them.

At the same time I have seen 'cheap' cables fail consistently in HDMI in the real world. I have seen cables from companies such as Eagle, Liberty, AQ, QED, etc., deliver consistently without any issues. The picture is brighter, the blacks are blacker, and the sound is fullsome. There are no artefacts whatsoever.

As I said, I am more comfortable with brands I am aware of, and would hesitate to be adventurous with new and unknown companies.

All I am trying to say here is that assuming that HDMI is purely digital and any cable would do would be dangerous.

Now whether 10$ is enough to make a good quality HDMI is not something I can argue with as I have no idea of the production costs.

Ultimately you have to go with what you understand and believe in.

Cheers

 

[venkatcr]

is it really something you are buying because it is there or because you can feel the difference.

Well, in the case of AV, you both hear and see the difference. As I said in my previous post I have seen brighter pictures, blacker blacks, lack of artefacts - all that is critical for me to enjoy a movie. In my case I am using a line cleaner (so to say) from Audire, and I have not interference from electrical connections. So whatever noise I see is either from the media or from the connections. That way I have been able to shortlist the culprit.

100 ft Belkin Cat-6 cable is around $80 at Staples, whereas you can buy the same 100ft online for $20 at Monoprice. The quality is the same - I MEAN THE EXACT SAME in terms of speed,frequency etc...

I am not sure about Belkin or Monoprice, but at the places I have worked, we have always insisted on using cables from reputed companies just to ensure there will be no connectivity issues. Once the cabling is done and the interiors finished, it becomes hell to trace a fault.

Sure they make life easier and it is easier to handle than a 12 AWG but folks have forgotten the original purpose of the termination/connector and instead made it an industry - JUST CONNECT THE BARE WIRE!!

Though I agree that bare wire is the best, having connectors such as banana plugs have their own advantage. For one, it is easier to remove equipment and clean. Two, you can switch speakers if you have more than one pair. It is also easier to disconnect floor standing speakers, move them and clean the area where they were placed. And you can dust the speakers. I always use banana plugs at the equipment end. The loss of data, if any, is negligible, and that is all right with me.

Ultimately, as I said before, you have to do what you understand and believe in.

Cheers

 

[NetFreak]

Now whether 10$ is enough to make a good quality HDMI is not something I can argue with as I have no idea of the production costs.

Ultimately you have to go with what you understand and believe in.

At least in this case belief is not required since that article actually measured output (instead of relying on human observation). So we know that even $5 cable worked for today's content (1080p).

Finally, HDMI is a "data" cable. And next version of A/V connectivity would actually a use a LAN cable (cat6). Details : Category 6 cable - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I manage a large IT infrastructure with routers that run more bandwidth than HDMI on each link. Even there we don't pay that much for cables.