Advice on purchase of Quad 909

[captrajesh]

Actually speaking, I have not really narrowed down on Quad only. I'm open to an idea of any other Amp.

As I was open to any other Amp, I listened to the following Amps today along with one of our forum members, my pal Sashi Kumar. I took my Marantz CD 6003 along.

1. Pre-power combo of Torvin Audio with his newly made tower speakers.

2. Old Music Fedility Power Amp, Dr. Thomas.

3. Lyrita SET with DIY horn loaded speakers made by Rajiv at his place.

Wanted to listen to pre-used musical fedility A5 & Plinius 8150 but could not.

Torvin combo is just ordinary.

Dr. Thomas was much more clean, controlled & musical.

We then headed for Rajiv's place. What I heard was so fabulous & the amount of detailing was so incredible that this is the best setup that I heard till date. PERIOD

Don't worry about hearing the breath of the singers and the plucking of a guitar string, the decay etc. I could even hear the sound made by the impact of the finger on the guitar string even before it is plucked.

The SET is one of the best sounding Amps that I've ever heard. Ofcourse, that its integration with the speaker is seamless helped.

And Rajiv is the most amazingly knowledgable DIY enthusiast I've ever met. PHEW, what a system he has!!!

 

[captrajesh]

so, what is the plan - which amplifier?

Hmm I'm very confused right now Suri. I've not listened to the Quad yet. Donno how it sounds.

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

Lyrita with Horns!

@ Capt
This much i with what my ears have heard of Lyrita in a few sessions can second AE's words by their alphabets!

When we plugged Lyrita after the Quad Pre Power in out last session, Lyrita gently opened up the sound spectrum ..lows went deeper, mids went sweeter, highs were more airy.. The transition from a good to a better set was clearly audible.

Hence i can also sense what you have heard and yes, that my friend is certainly different than a Quad. Having said that ...this by NO MEANS is to downlook upon Quads. You must listen to Quads indeed.

@ AE
Do we have pics of Rajiv's horn speakers?

 

[Rajiv]

Hi

Capt.it was great having you and Sashi over this afternoon.

Thank you for your comments about my system.

The SET is one of the best sounding Amps that I've ever heard.

The credit shoud go to Viren, for designing and building this superb amp.

Knowing Rajiv, am sure he's done it to the last tooth...

@Arup,you give me too much credit.

I go about building/tweeking my system by picking the brains of knowledgeable people like you on various forums.

It is only because of inputs from these people who share their knowledge freely that I am able to cobble together a decent system.

Regards
Rajiv

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

(pulled from one of Rajiv's posts) - hope you don't mind Rajiv

Also - the "magic of immediacy" is only strictly between a SET & HIGH-EFFICIENCY HORNS / DYNAMIC SPEAKERS. This means at least above 94dB sens, preferably 96dB+.

The Quad 909 will otherwise do a whole range of lovely, different things for you, some of those the SET cannot even get to.

Either way, regardless of how much you spend, Rs. 1 Lac or Rs. 30 Lacs, there WILL always be some compromises you'll have to live with. And till to-date, there isn't a system that does everything.

I recall one of our distinguished Forum members < Shanti > said in another Forum:

The 3 important Things towards building an Audiophile System: (in order of their costs; highest being 1st)

1. The Real Estate space, i.e. what sort of a room can you dedicate towards your Audio?

2. The Software Collection you've built up.

3. The Hardware gear.

This is so true! Say in a place like Mumbai, a 15 x 20 = 300 Sq Ft dedicated room at approx @ 10k a sq ft in the suburbs would set you back Rs. 30 Lacs. Then, 1-2 decades of software collection can easily exceed another Rs. 10-15 Lacs. Finally, the system which could be another Rs. 10-15 Lacs. So, whats the overall figure looking like? Rs. 50-60 Lacs !! whew... :licklips:
Plus some compromises!! hyeah:

Bang down on the facts Arup Ji.

Money plays a big part but then the money at the same time doesnt, as we all agree. Would share a small experience out of my pretty new path taken ...I hv just heard, witnessed a system of about 70L last week. Yes! It was good ..rather outstanding ..but to me it was put up at a place which should have been double of its size to have it convey its magic in all its grace. BUT, my friend whispered to me in my ears ..'Sid ..after hearing this i can say that i love my system @ 3lacs approx' ...so to each his own 'pocket' and well ..'ears' can be fooled by money but a heart be not. It shall smile to the music it feels best.

A fellow member Denom says in other post that he cares least about labels/brands ..and i in a way have followed that myself.

May the love n magic music brings in all its forms prevail always.

Cheers

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

Hi

Capt.it was great having you and Sashi over this afternoon.

Thank you for your comments about my system.



The credit shoud go to Viren, for designing and building this superb amp.




@Arup,you give me too much credit.

I go about building/tweeking my system by picking the brains of knowledgeable people like you on various forums.

It is only because of inputs from these people who share their knowledge freely that I am able to cobble together a decent system.

Regards
Rajiv

@ Rajiv
Congrats on a beautiful set up back home Rajiv bhai and kudos to the efforts. And yes, humble credits to Viren sir as well. His contributions to the industry are noteworthy.

cheers

 

[captrajesh]

So Rajesh, if you are looking for this from the Quad, sorry pal, it wont do it for you!! Period... You then need to look elsewhere.

Yes, I'm already looking

 

[suri]

(pulled from one of Rajiv's posts) - hope you don't mind Rajiv

Also - the "magic of immediacy" is only strictly between a SET & HIGH-EFFICIENCY HORNS / DYNAMIC SPEAKERS. This means at least above 94dB sens, preferably 96dB+.

The Quad 909 will otherwise do a whole range of lovely, different things for you, some of those the SET cannot even get to.

Either way, regardless of how much you spend, Rs. 1 Lac or Rs. 30 Lacs, there WILL always be some compromises you'll have to live with. And till to-date, there isn't a system that does everything.

I recall one of our distinguished Forum members < Shanti > said in another Forum:

The 3 important Things towards building an Audiophile System: (in order of their costs; highest being 1st)

1. The Real Estate space, i.e. what sort of a room can you dedicate towards your Audio?

2. The Software Collection you've built up.

3. The Hardware gear.

This is so true! Say in a place like Mumbai, a 15 x 20 = 300 Sq Ft dedicated room at approx @ 10k a sq ft in the suburbs would set you back Rs. 30 Lacs. Then, 1-2 decades of software collection can easily exceed another Rs. 10-15 Lacs. Finally, the system which could be another Rs. 10-15 Lacs. So, whats the overall figure looking like? Rs. 50-60 Lacs !! whew... :licklips:
Plus some compromises!! hyeah:

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping:

 

[captrajesh]

When we plugged Lyrita after the Quad Pre Power in out last session, Lyrita gently opened up the sound spectrum ..lows went deeper, mids went sweeter, highs were more airy.. The transition from a good to a better set was clearly audible.

Have you guys played the Amity speakers along with the SET? If not, which were the speakers? Apart from the Amp, Rajiv's horns were also a big part of the 'audio vishwaroopa' at Rajiv's place.

Is there anyone who has Amitys anywhere in south? I wish I can listen to them.:sad:

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

Have you guys played the Amity speakers along with the SET? If not, which were the speakers? Apart from the Amp, Rajiv's horns were also a big part of the 'audio vishwaroopa' at Rajiv's place.

Is there anyone who has Amitys anywhere in south? I wish I can listen to them.:sad:

@ Rajesh bhai
We had connected - Quad 22L2, Dali Ikon 6, Quad 11L2 bookshelves ...the difference was clear on all (we were switching from one pair of speakers to another via a gadget to which all three speakers were connected) so all 3 speakers could be heard on the go, one after the other for a track played.

I hv alongwith many hv heard the Amity's .. U must hear them down south if a member has em.

 

[captrajesh]

We had connected - Quad 22L2, Dali Ikon 6, Quad 11L2 bookshelves

Whoa. You have driven the above speakers with SET They produce a princely 3 watts or so. Infact Rajiv modded them so his gives out onl.y 1.5 watts.

U must hear them down south if a member has em.

Yeah looking for one. Hope someone in the forum can help.:licklips:

 

[stevieboy]

captrajesh, yes there is someone who has em in bangalore with the russian SET amp kamal mentioned it. you can call viren to see if the owner would be ok for you to drop in and have a listen. maybe a few of us can go over some weekend eh?

regards

after 2nd april would be a good time! we can have a sort of meet again wot say?

 

[viren bakhshi]

Hi Capt. Rajesh and stevieboy,

Yes, there's a setup in Bangalore now using the Lyrita 6C33C SET amp and the Amity speakers. Owned by another young listener, Abhishek Narsipur (I don't think he's on the forum). I've already talked to him, and he's willing to host listeners. I'll pm his phone number if you're interested.

Viren

 

[viren bakhshi]

Hi Arup,

What you've said about the cost of owning a good music setup is true.
However, let's not scare the young guys here as far as costs are concerned.

Compromises are always there - the first one has to do with space. The music system has to coexist with your living space. So, that cost is shared. And that means that the system has to be simple, with ease of movement and setup to changing living spaces. And, if music is a big part of your life, you will atleast rearrange your living space to get the most benefit out of your system.

Then comes music - the "software". The expense of building a library of music can be huge. But, then, you don't have to be in a terrible hurry! You have the rest of your life ahead of you, and your music library will grow with you, reflecting your evolving tastes.

"Evolving tastes" - that also describes what sort of music system you end up with. It takes some years of listening, maturing, to really determine what you want out of a system. Once that recognition comes, the system also comes together relatively easily.

To that satisfying end, good systems can be put together even for a lakh of rupees. Of course, the upper end is no limit.

So, seek, and you shall discover!

Regards,
Viren

 

[sidvee]

Viren I concur with you whole heartedly. I personally think that in the lower budget range of equipment there are lot of gems to be had and as we move upward the laws of diminishing returns kick in pretty fast and one has to be a fairly mature listener to discern the difference. As far as listening spaces go, I think majority of listeners double up their living rooms/bed rooms as listening spaces rather than dedicated rooms and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that as long as some basic acoustic principles are adhered to.
Cheers
Sid

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

Hi Arup,

What you've said about the cost of owning a good music setup is true.
However, let's not scare the young guys here as far as costs are concerned.

Compromises are always there - the first one has to do with space. The music system has to coexist with your living space. So, that cost is shared. And that means that the system has to be simple, with ease of movement and setup to changing living spaces. And, if music is a big part of your life, you will atleast rearrange your living space to get the most benefit out of your system.

Then comes music - the "software". The expense of building a library of music can be huge. But, then, you don't have to be in a terrible hurry! You have the rest of your life ahead of you, and your music library will grow with you, reflecting your evolving tastes.

"Evolving tastes" - that also describes what sort of music system you end up with. It takes some years of listening, maturing, to really determine what you want out of a system. Once that recognition comes, the system also comes together relatively easily.

To that satisfying end, good systems can be put together even for a lakh of rupees. Of course, the upper end is no limit.

So, seek, and you shall discover!

Regards,
Viren

what a delicate pick of words to define the life of an audiophile sir.
You give me a zillion reasons first and then you tell me to not use 'sir' while addressing you

Its a pleasure to have come across & to know more of you via the interactions off and on. To hear your perspective makes us fine tune our own in the process & be guided w.r.t. music accordingly intune with lives.

Touched.

Our sincere regards
..

 

[captrajesh]

captrajesh, yes there is someone who has em in bangalore with the russian SET amp kamal mentioned it. you can call viren to see if the owner would be ok for you to drop in and have a listen. maybe a few of us can go over some weekend eh?

:yahoo:That's a great news Stevie. I spoke to Viren & took the telephone number of that Gentleman. Will speak to him & fix up an audition.:yahoo:

after 2nd april would be a good time! we can have a sort of meet again wot say?

That sounds a great idea.:clapping:

 

[CLEARCUT]

I love bryston than quad power amp which is sweet sounding seducive nature. I use lexcion nt412 which is the power amp produced by bryston in another number . I use it with axiom passive pre with marantz 63 ki sig player. It matches with every kind of speakers which means they give complete neutral sound in full spectrum. Only you have to choose the speaker upto your taste. If you love mid clarity go for quad and full spectrum quality dali mentor range and b&w or anything else thanks

 

[Sidharth Trehan]

I love bryston than quad power amp which is sweet sounding seducive nature. I use lexcion nt412 which is the power amp produced by bryston in another number . I use it with axiom passive pre with marantz 63 ki sig player. It matches with every kind of speakers which means they give complete neutral sound in full spectrum. Only you have to choose the speaker upto your taste. If you love mid clarity go for quad and full spectrum quality dali mentor range and b&w or anything else thanks

Bryston may just be out of Capt.'s budget or rather out of the budget for most of in here. So there are many second best options to look in for, permutations and combinations per individuals budget decide whats good for him. I had a friend who barred me from picking a Bryston Pre-Power, for he knew that i had a fancy for Accuphase and to which he amongst many advised that Accuphase to Bryston are again like how you compare Bryston to Quad or any other. It all comes down to matter of choice, ears and money in pockets i shall say.


YET,
some of the reasonably priced stuff works well for most.


Generall discussing this,
I was looking at a few valve amps while i was window shopping online a two month back, so i wondered that what we have from Lyrita and many other wonderful Indian audiphile quality product vendors, DIY enthusiasts is a bit more worthy of praise than what we assume it to be. Offcourse, i am assuming all these products made are loved by all for the quality & edge they add onto your music rack.


Lets take a case study as an example..
Valve amps are exotic pieces for the exotic audiophiles who need that something extra in ears... called refinement.

So, looking at what we have from "Lyrita Audio" in India w.r.t. tube amps, IMAGINE a situation if these amps were produced in ..say UK or Austria & be marketed as the Exotic valve amps from Austria hitting the Indian Market ... $$$ !! ..with choices of wood and finish for even more exotic tastes.

Then the British/Austrian would have clubbed with someone in India and the product does sell, for :
1) Sounds damn good
2) Exotic looks
3) British/Austrian tag
4) Big showroom in Delhi has it tagged at $3000 with a warm spot light falling onto it with the SET kept on a Mehroon colored soft shiny fabric to catch the eye! (to compliment the black glass and teak color of the amp).

Now approximating the break up we can reduce:

- British/Austrian manufacturers premium for being born in UK/Austria + their profit margin! Deduct a humble 20% for all this!
- 20% importer's margin on the landing cost!
- Reduce 10% towards locals costs, International transportation & customs when it arrives in India.

So lets see, we reduce total 50% off the price we see on the tag on this beautiful valve amplifier (the margin approximations we have deducted are are not too vague but close approximates, since i have been handling International Logistics Projects since last decade, being in shipping. So the figures are not all that bad.)

Now,
50% of $3000 piece goes off ..so we are left with USD1500 as the actual price.
This price is still costly than the TUBE amp's price we have from Lyrita ..with not just me but with quite a long list of buyers who admire the purchase made. So, i being a cautious buyer well realise that i am paying nearly 50% of the amount on these imported products as a premium for my liking for the magic they produce.
These margins are not funny! AND here in INDIA i have similar or rather BETTER product from Lyrita (much lower than Accu/Brys for some), but then we love it for what it produces. And it still brings the smile & assurance for the money spent to many, which is still 30% cheaper than the $$$$ imported amp.


Now at last,
coming back to the point for why i shared the note above is to point out that money does play a role but then we buy these products with our head stuck 'there' like an Ostrich for we just crave for the magic! (having said this, i do confirm to the fact that some of these products we discuss are really good!)


BUT like the small blessings in disguise we have around us Viren, AE, SURI, RAJIV, GVENU who have probably exponential technical/aesthetic talent than all the goras claim ..and how i wish that they could get their expertise on the commercial scale .. i mean large!

Shall be a bliss for ones like me ...who still wants to dip lower on the price scale and be least bothered if someone says that Suri's speaker sounds not like my B&W ..while i am smiling when i hear the notes into my ears ..i care least for the statements made.

So for the time being my friend, many like me shall still buy QUAD (and or lower end stuff) despite how crap it sounds against a Bryston and be assured of the magic it brings. BUT then we have some who would buy Accuphase/Conrad Jhonson etc etc.. but it all comes down to the magic that comes in the ears, tags come later. Period.


This ones to music ....Cheers!

P.S. Lyrita, Quad, Accu etc here is taken here just an example. I am not employed or paid in cash/kind by any company or their competitor for whom i write

 

[captrajesh]

after 2nd april would be a good time! we can have a sort of meet again wot say?

Hi Stevieboy

spoke to Abhishek Narsipur, the gentleman who owns Viren's SET & Amitys. He is willing for an audition and is also OK with the idea of a group of us.

He was curious about the forum & I had taken the liberty of inviting him to join us.

Hope to have one more audiophile amongst us.

Is 3rd or 4th OK?