AV Receiver upgrade

[nindo]

Hi pals,

New to the forum, but not so new to the AV/HiFi world.

Have been using this set up for quite some time now:

TV: Samsung 40" 5 Series 2008/9 model FullHD LCD
AVR: Yamaha RX-V457
Front/Music: Sonodyne Sonus 2605 (old version)
Centre: Sonodyne Sonus C2401 V2 (bought about a year back)
Surrounds: Bose 201 BS
SW: Kenwood (10", powered) don't remember the model number- oldest component in the set up.
CD/DVD P: Grundig GDV130- another old timer
DVD P: LG
Philips SRU9600 universal remote

Planning to upgrade to BluRay, but major obstacle is my AVR has no HDMI connectivity and poor thing is completely ignorant about HD audio- typical problem in old AVRs.

I have 2 options:
1. Get a Bluray player with in-built HD sound decoder and 5.1/7.1 ch analogue output and hook it to the 5.1 ch analogue-in in my AVR.
2. Upgrade my AVR

For point 1. there are not many options available for a budget minded guy like me. Best one I found was Cambridge Audio Azur 650BD...but it costs INR 38k...!
Then I thought with that kinda money I can as well buy a new AVR- that is point 2. and buy a best rated BR player in the <20k budget.

Have been browsing posts looking for the best bet among: Onkyo TX-SR608/NR609, Denon AVR1911, Yamaha RX-V667.

All suggestions/inputs welcome. And of course i ll keep giving my 2 bit advise/opinion when & where possible.

cheers...

 

[venkatcr]

You have two options:

1. A new AVR + a BR Player - budget of around 60-70K.

2. Get the Oppo 93 from the US for about 30K.

In both options, unless you install the region free chip in Oppo 93, you will be locked to region A or region C depending upon which BR player your buy.

Cheers

 

[rana_kirti]

@ nindo,

you have a V457. Now this was a mid level avr during it's time. Some may say lower-mid level. I have a V450 and they are almost identical.

AVRs like these which were available 5-6 yrs ago were of very high quality. They had much better internals and much better amplification than the ones which can be found in todays' mid level AVRs. The quality of components and especially the Amplification has gone down drastically in the past few years.

I have compared my 6 yr old V450 to many of today's mid level AVRs and trust me when i say this... They are no match to the sound provided by my V450. It is much superior to all of today's mid level offerings. Now this is keeping only "Sonic" aspect in consideration. Though the newer mid level avrs will have more features.

If you really want a jump in the sound quality of the V457 you will have to look at mid-upper level AVRs like the V1067 and higher and if looking at Onkyo then a minimum of 808/809 and Denon 2312.

Also your V457 can still decode DTS Core from the Bluray discs. I'm my humble opinion there is not significant difference in sound quality in DTS Core vs DTS HD MA. It's not as big a jump between DVD and Bluray picture. If you still want DTS HD MA then your own option no 1 solves the purpose.

As far HDMI connectivity goes, if you have multiple sources then it's much better/cheaper alternative to buy an HDMI Switcher.

My suggestion is to go with Option 2 of venkatcr's reply. All Bluray players are not created equal. The Oppo 93 will give not only give you an excellent picture but will also give you much better sound than regular cheaper bluray players. Add an HDMI Switcher to the equation and you have a winning combination.

Cheers,

Rana

 

[nindo]

venkatcr, rana_kirti,

thanks for your inputs.

Well of course the idea is to be able to upgrade to better sound and picture, but at the same time planning to make the set up future proof...atleast to the extent possible in my budget.

I had thought of buying the oppo 83 some time back when it was launched, but then postponed the plan with a view to upgrade the AVR. Cannot comment on the point that the current range of mid-level AVRs do not offer the sound and hardware quality of earlier ones as i have not auditioned any of late.

May be you are right on the point that if I need similar sound and build quality from current range of AVRs i will have to go in for mid-higher ones.

the landed price for oppo 93 ordered from amazon US is about INR 33000 which is almost the price of a new AVR in the mid level. I pay a bit more and I can get one of the better ones from Denon/Onkyo/Yamaha. Also more and more bluray players being introduced now are lacking the analogue 7.1 ch audio out options. AV sources is one area where there are always new things coming up - like BD itself was a huge jump and we all thought this is the ultimate that is at least for sometime...but suddenly now 3D is all the new rage and we never know something new might come up sooner than expected. Hence, I feel, its more important and a need to keep upgrading in this dept. Buying the latest AVR now will enable me to carry on with it at least for 4-5 years before we have a big leap in processing/amplification tech...

Just my opinion...yours are most welcome and awaited.

cheers

 

[venkatcr]

the landed price for oppo 93 ordered from amazon US is about INR 33000 which is almost the price of a new AVR in the mid level. I pay a bit more and I can get one of the better ones from Denon/Onkyo/Yamaha. Also more and more bluray players being introduced now are lacking the analogue 7.1 ch audio out options. AV sources is one area where there are always new things coming up - like BD itself was a huge jump and we all thought this is the ultimate that is at least for sometime...but suddenly now 3D is all the new rage and we never know something new might come up sooner than expected. Hence, I feel, its more important and a need to keep upgrading in this dept. Buying the latest AVR now will enable me to carry on with it at least for 4-5 years before we have a big leap in processing/amplification tech..

Mid level AVRs cost between 40 to 50K.

There is no harm in changing your AVR. Just remember you may have to change a number of connections between the AVR, sources, and your display. HDMI is the best connection possible and you should use this as much as possible.

Blu-Ray players, other than the expensive ones, will have just one or two HDMI outs. The AVRs of today are so powerful, that processing of audio or video at the source does not make any sense any more. And, by removing the processing capabilities, manufacturers are able to reduce prices.

Whatever BR Player you choose, if you are going to watch BRs from multiple regions, that is something you have to take care of. At around 30K, a Dune HD Max is also a good option. It is a media player, and a BR Player though it does not have 7.1 out. It is region free by default.

Cheers

 

[nindo]

Agree that I will have to change quite a few connections...but thats going to be a one time exercise, and I must say its quite a rewarding feel once everything works the way I intended it to after the connections.:yahoo:

"Blu-Ray players, other than the expensive ones, will have just one or two HDMI outs."

Do I need more than one HDMI out from a BR player, if I have a compatible AVR? - I do not know much about this as I have never used one, please put some light.

And venkatcr you are on dot in mentioning the region issue for BR and BR players. I saw some BRs on flipkart.com and found they are region specific (though some show compatibility for all 3 regions, one can never be sure.!) Dune HD sounds like a good option, but are they any better sonically and otherwise in comparison to normal BR players?

thanks guys

 

[ashishkesarwani]

At around 30K, a Dune HD Max is also a good option. It is a media player, and a BR Player though it does not have 7.1 out. It is region free by default.

Cheers

Dune HD Max does have a 7.1 Analogue Out and it's not region free out of the box but there is a software patch which after installation makes its region free for DVDs and allows region switching between different region Blu Rays, but after every firmware upgrade you have to load this software patch file again.

 

[venkatcr]

"Blu-Ray players, other than the expensive ones, will have just one or two HDMI outs." Do I need more than one HDMI out from a BR player, if I have a compatible AVR? - I do not know much about this as I have never used one, please put some light.

It all depends upon how you use it. For example, if I have a Oppo 93, I will use on HDMI to transfer audio to the AVR and another HDMI to send the picture to the display. Why, simply because you need to get an AVR costing around a lakh to match the video processing capabilities of the Oppo.

And venkatcr you are on dot in mentioning the region issue for BR and BR players. I saw some BRs on flipkart.com and found they are region specific (though some show compatibility for all 3 regions, one can never be sure.!) Dune HD sounds like a good option, but are they any better sonically and otherwise in comparison to normal BR players?

Dune has followed the principle that the AVR will do the video and audio processing. It is no great shake when it comes to processing. It does send the A/V data without any mishap to the AVR. When you are playing a BR, you don't need any video processing. When you play a DVD or a media, the processing can be done by the AVR.

The sonic capabilities of Dune is irrelevant if you are processing and amplifying outside. As I said before sources will not have much processing capabilities and will depend upon the AVR to do that. If you looking for source level exceptional processing, I cannot think of anything other than an Oppo at a price that does not force you to rob a bank.

Cheers

thanks guys[/QUOTE]

 

[nindo]

Dune HD Max does have a 7.1 Analogue Out and it's not region free out of the box but there is a software patch which after installation makes its region free for DVDs and allows region switching between different region Blu Rays, but after every firmware upgrade you have to load this software patch file again.

thanks for the input ashish, you seem to know quite a bit about Dune. Could you tell me how it compares against dedicated BR players like cambridge audio, oppo or the sonys and samsungs of the world, cos I have never seen or heard the output from Dunes.

thanks.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

Could you tell me how it compares against dedicated BR players like cambridge audio, oppo or the sonys and samsungs of the world, cos I have never seen or heard the output from Dunes.

thanks.

Its a descent player if you compare its overall performance i.e Region Free playback, Full Fledged Media player with a Blu Ray Rom and a Nice User Interface. But all it lacks is in the Analogue audio performance wherein Oppos as well as Cambridge Audio are way more superior. About Samsung and Sony I would say that they are not compared as they don't even perform half the functions which a Dune or Oppo could perform with authority.

 

[venkatcr]

Dune HD Max does have a 7.1 Analogue Out and it's not region free out of the box but there is a software patch which after installation makes its region free for DVDs and allows region switching between different region Blu Rays, but after every firmware upgrade you have to load this software patch file again.

You are right, Dune HD Max does have 7.1 analogue out. But, I am not sure about it being region free. As far as I have seen, it comes region free for Bly-Ray straight out of the box All you need to do is press a few keys on the remote. I never had to install any patch.

Cheers

 

[nindo]

Gurus,

Stereo sound reproduction is really important for me cos I ll be listening to music about 70% of the time. So I guess Dune HD is out. As mentioned by Ashish sonically oppo or Cambridge audio are much better and I believe so too.

So my focus currently will be on a AVR with good stereo reproduction and the latest possible HD audio/video tech in the 35-45k range. What say?

Have been going through the posts on this forum and other review websites on relevant topics and found onkyo tx-nr609, denon avr1911/12 and marantz 6005 to be closest to my expectations.

What would you suggest, may be there are other models/brands which you guys know/heard but I don't know about. So please feel free to comment.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

If you are looking for a Good Musical performance from an AVR then look at brands like NAD, ARCAM , Cambridge Audio. A NAD T748, 747 will be slightly out of your budget but even if you consider buying a regular integrated amp later then too NAD Avrs would be cheaper in comparison. Also they get close to 90% performance of an Integrated amplifier for 2 Channel sound.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

You are right, Dune HD Max does have 7.1 analogue out. But, I am not sure about it being region free. As far as I have seen, it comes region free for Bly-Ray straight out of the box All you need to do is press a few keys on the remote. I never had to install any patch.

Cheers

This was the practice earlier but now distributer sends a unopened box without the patch file and let the patch installed in front of the end user. Also there is new firmware so after upgrading it anyways a patch file needs to be installed again.

 

[fullerms]

Check if the Denon 2311 sold in India has pre outs. If yes, go for it. Denon AVRs are good value for money and they don't run hot like the Onkyos.