Bollywood and Music in India

[Deleted member 15865]

@SachinChavan , There was this old discussion on this forum, with some very good recommendations. It's slightly on a tangent to the current discussion, but there the conversation gets derailed towards the end, and some interesting bits (anecdotal) do turn up and aligns with the one here

Thanks @sandeepss for the link. The OP was making some very valid observations and statements till the thread got derailed by what I’d term poor dialectics on part of some participants. Recording of Indian classical music in India is still horrible and perhaps it’s down to to the incompetence of sound recordists at the venues with very few exceptions. May be the organisers also don’t look at recoding sales as a significant revenue stream (in comparison to ticket sales and sponsorships). One isn’t sure if the artists make any money at all from the sale of live concert recordings - my guess would be no.

But coming back to the subject of this thread, these are audio problems and not musical deficiencies. Will the sale of CDs or steaming numbers increase for classical music if recording (and mastering) quality is significantly improved? I doubt. We‘d still have to create listeners for non-filmI Indian music.

 

[Ashenden]

Will the sale of CDs or steaming numbers increase for classical music if recording (and mastering) quality is significantly improved? I doubt. We‘d still have to create listeners for non-filmI Indian music.

Now, this is from my personal experience, not a generalization

Growing up, we didn't have Ghazal cassettes at home, but mostly Carnatic classical and Malayalam/Hindi film songs/devotional. Later, when I started to earn and began buying CDs, Ghazals from Jagjit/Chitra Singh used to sound great on my then modest system and I started exploring more from that genre. Needless to say, the music was exceptionally good, but this factor also played a big role in improving the appreciation and me exploring further from that genre. If the recording quality was abysmal to start with, I might've moved onto something else and would've missed listening to some of the finest music in my library, like Gulzar's Mirza Ghalib

 

[firearm12]

Now, this is from my personal experience, not a generalization

Growing up, we didn't have Ghazal cassettes at home, but mostly Carnatic classical and Malayalam/Hindi film songs/devotional. Later, when I started to earn and began buying CDs, Ghazals from Jagjit/Chitra Singh used to sound great on my then modest system and I started exploring more from that genre. Needless to say, the music was exceptionally good, but this factor also played a big role in improving the appreciation and me exploring further from that genre. If the recording quality was abysmal to start with, I might've moved onto something else and would've missed listening to some of the finest music in my library, like Gulzar's Mirza Ghalib

I think he is talkimg about music that is not considered as popular music. Jagjit singh was a special case. I think he single handedly brought ghazals into mainstream through his elegant singing which appealed to masses as well as classes. Before him ghazals used to be full of classical based singing techniques and less no. of people listened to them. He did not follow that norm and thought to bring ghazals close to common man and he succeeded. He made his ghazals to be considered into a popular music category. I am also a big fan of him but when i listen to someone like Mehdi hasan who is a traditional ghazal singer, its difficult for me to hum his ghazals and it needs a different kind of attention to music to understand his works. Jagjit singh was special case.

 

[Deleted member 15865]

I think he is talkimg about music that is not considered as popular music. Jagjit singh was a special case. I think he single handedly brought ghazals into mainstream through his elegant singing which appealed to masses as well as classes. Before him ghazals used to be full of classical based singing techniques and less no. of people listened to them. He did not follow that norm and thought to bring ghazals close to common man and he succeeded. He made his ghazals to be considered into a popular music category. I am also a big fan of him but when i listen to someone like Mehdi hasan who is a traditional ghazal singer, its difficult for me to hum his ghazals and it needs a different kind of attention to music to understand his works. Jagjit singh was special case.

@firearm12 is helping us see another factor that can bring newer audiences to less popular forms of music. That of what can be called a 'bridge musician'. Like Jagjit Singh was for Ghazals... he made them popular by simplifying it for the masses, of course with his exceptional voice and capable singing. Some of these new audiences can then graduate onto other less accessible but more rewarding music in the genre. Ravi Shankar, Hariprasad, Zakir and even someone newer like Shujaat Khan and others have done similarly to Hindustani classical by coming up with more accessible fusion and in some cases, lounge music with broader appeal than Khyal. Indeed from time to time these and other classical artists have given music in films too.. once again reaching out to the masses without significantly diluting their art form,

 

[firearm12]

Once i read or heard somewhere that being more detached from nature has created a void in our music and literature and other art forms. Music is sound only and its basic source comes from nature. Today with all contrete around and people even living hundreds of feet above ground, it has detached us from very mother nature, we dont experience the sunsets, sunrises, rivers, mountains, chaudvin ka channd and numerous of these things. In past it was not so. To understand and appreciate good music as well as literature, we need to go back into the lap of mother nature. More and more away we go from nature more art forms will die.

 

[Ashenden]

Yes, good music and art shouldn't be restricted to a very small exclusive group. During Ghalib's time, Persian was the language of choice for poetry. He did compose several thousand couplets in Persian, but also used Urdu (which was the common man's language) in several other works, to make them more accessible. Jagjit Singh did something similar and made Ghazals more accessible and more importantly, enjoyable.

 

[Deleted member 15865]

Once i read or heard somewhere that being more detached from nature has created a void in our music and literature and other art forms. Music is sound only and its basic source comes from nature. Today with all contrete around and people even living hundreds of feet above ground, it has detached us from very mother nature, we dont experience the sunsets, sunrises, rivers, mountains, chaudvin ka channd and numerous of these things. In past it was not so. To understand and appreciate good music as well as literature, we need to go back into the lap of mother nature. More and more away we go from nature more art forms will die.

Yes, and would like to add that nature also includes ourselves - our body, thoughts and emotions. Diving deep within also helps connect to music - both within and without. No wonder that the many artists take to spiritual exploration at some point in their lives.

 

[firearm12]

Yes, and would like to add that nature also includes ourselves - our body, mind and emotions. Diving deep within also helps connect to music - both within and without. No wonder that the many artists take to spiritual exploration at some point in their lives.

Obviously my dear friend. Music is basically sound and mathematics both of which are something derived from nature. Nature has only set up rules for music, all musical notes and related frequencies follow a specific patterns. Basic seven notes cannot work if nature does not want them to work the way they work. Every instrument is made up to express a certain frequency at a certain pitch which tends to affect our senses in ways which even we dont know. We as individuals have only used these patterns to make us feel more happy. But if we now go away from nature and then expect to appreciate what nature has given us, its a foolish thing. E.g. Lets say if i hear a sarangi, now thoughts of a beautiful scenery with a red sandy sunset automatically covers my mind, means nature is calling us subconciously, we cannot understand music if we go away from it, never.

For your point yes nature and mind are supposed to be in constant communication as we are ourselves a part of nature, thats the basis of sprituality. Music bridges this communication even further, icfact basis of indian music is supposed to be created only for this purpose, the ultimate enjoyment, not for temporary enjoyment.

 

[firearm12]

Opening a new thread on nature and music, very important I think the relation

 

[sid0710]

One of my friend has started a podcast on lesser known but great independent musicians and bands across India. Do check it out if interested -
Spotify link for the latest episode - https://open.spotify.com/episode/3O4t4i74KzXE9yIOi3ydma
Link for Google podcasts, apple podcasts and youtube - https://linktr.ee/soundcheckwithdg