Do you really think Indian cricket team deserves this?

Hi
Interesting to read opinions from fellow cricket buffs.
The only thing I could not swallow is Murali s comment on Sunil Gavaskar. Its an opinion and I respect it Murali but what do u not like about the man.
Do u feel he was a selfish bat ? Too political? Too slow a batsman? Too negative a captain? Lets not lose first, think of winning later attitude? I hope its not those accusations that he was in with the bookmakers!! The 'Great' Kapil Dev was also supposed to be neck deep in it FYI.

Cause as a batsman I think he was simply superb. The backbone of our batting, the key wicket for two decades for the opposition. We are talking about technique etc etc here. Tell me which modern batsman will stand up to the quicks without a helmet? Will the great Sachin manage? In an era when the WI Quartet made most batsmen shiver this small man achieved big. IMO leaving a ball, getting out of harms way is AS MUCH PART of a good batsman technique.

Yes its your opinion but if u could care to explain the reason for this scorn for one of the GREATEST cricketers of our times. Its not that I know the man though I know his son.
Regarding the Indian team sustaining this over any length of time. Well they may or may not BUT I WOULD TAKE IT WITH GREAT PRIDE IF I WAS THE BEST AT WHAT I DID if even for a minute so if the ratings say we are No 1 today lets just savour it.

Vortex, well I clubbed Sehway and yuvraj together as both are attacking batsmen who take risks. Both are not sound technically BUT both have a keen eye and are superb timers. When I first saw Yuvraj bat I though this guy was tooo talented and if he tightened up a bit he could be the next BIG batting sensation. Its not been quite that but the guy has played many a brilliant knock. Its not just T 20 & his sixes but loads of super knocks in the ODIs. I feel this success & all this super star status has got to him. I still feel he has enough talent to sort out his niggles, buckle down and be a quality test player for our country.
Rgds

hi dinyaar,

i stopped watching cricket when i saw kapil dev crying on TV-

but Sunil Gavaskar - each one of us lovers of cricket have to see him as you see him - a GIANT on whose shoulders indian cricket supremacy was launched - the world took notice - attention came our way - because of this one man! - yes, - a man to admire!

regds,
suri
 
Flashback 1: The first World Cup - 1975 in England; India's 1st match against England where Amiss socres a century and England pile up a huge total (60 overs those days); India score some 100-odd runs for a loss of a few wickets; lost the match; Gavaskar opens the innings and remains 36 not out at the end of the 60 overs; later justifies by saying that they could never chase the total and hence used for batting practice!!!

Flashback 2: India-Australia series against Lillee, Thompson etc; Some controversial umpiring decisions and Gavaskar as captain walks out of the ground in protest.

Now: He advises others.

I fully agree he was a great test batsman by technique and temperament and had played several great innings. No doubt there. But then remain like that and don't be hypocritical and advise and criticise others. He had never been great as a person and played dirty politics when Kapil was made captain. I respect him as one of the best batsmen India had produced and never as someone youngsters should look upon. There had been equally good or better batsmen like Vishwanath who never got the credit they deserved. Forgive me for saying this openly, those days used to be Bombay's (now Mumbai) domination in Indian cricket who never let others come up, especially Delhiites and the so-called Madrasis. Now things may have changed but let us not hide away from truths.

Another similar guy is Boycott ( a great batsman) now having become a darling of Indian public from the commentary box. A very similar character to Gavaskar. I still remember his being dropped from the England team after scoring a big century against the West Indies which was a blatant show of his playing-for-self attitude. Now he advises others!!!

Just my opinion.

cheers.
murali

Ok I see where u are hitting about SG.
I dont agree but then each of us are entitled to an opinion.

Regarding Example 1. Yes we as a team had no clue how to play the then new format of ODI (60 overs then) and we were pathetic. This guy played the only way he knew how to. Accumulated a few (yes 36 it was) played out the overs and yes we lost. If he too would have thrown his wicket trying something (slogging) he was at the time least familiar with WOULD IT HAVE HELPED THE TEAMS CAUSE? No it would not have.
Ex 2. Loads of us do things that we would normally not do OR things that we feel sorry later for IN A FIT OF RAGE. Sunil was sure that he nicked the ball onto the Pad and was shocked at being given out LBW and lillee rubbing it in was the last straw. YEs he blew a fuse & tried to take chetan chauhan off the field but the manager had better sense and sent in a batsman & all was fine.

Am sorry but Murali I surely cant understand how u can scorn one of India s greatest just for the two reasons above.

Like Suri said it broke my heart to see Kapil Dev cry on TV. Here was a guy I adored, admired and looked up to as a kid. Seeing that on TV just upset me. I dont know who all were/ are involved in that ugly part of our cricket history (i.e match fixing) so I just let it pass & watch this sport as it will survive this and much much more.
Rgds
 
Vortex, Dinyaar (and anybody else crazy enough)

Since both of you have played the game with some seriousness, and vortex was discussing grips, I thought I'd share with you my notes on batting grips. Call me crazy or whatever, but I have worked on the stuff (in terms of accumulating all sorts of coaching material from everywhere and video-analyzing at home a host of cricketers, self-trying, experimenting with grips of my son).

Since this is a thread dedicated for a different topic albeit on cricket, let me not bother others, by posting it. I am rather attaching it with this post (others if interested may read it too).

Please read it and let me know your opinion. This is an excerpt from my notes on cricket called 'My Cricket Diary" and the selected portion contains two sections, the first being on a comparison on baseball and cricket and then on the grip. Both are important to understand the batting grip.
 
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Asit - most interesting indeed. I will go through this and have my comments soon. Glad to find another person passionate about cricket here.
 
Asit - thanks for that article. It was a most informative read. Many nuggets of information for the uninitiated and the initiated alike. My comments such as they are :

1) There was a tantalizing comparison between Cricket and Baseball. But that section appears to be left wide open and sort of incomplete to me. Did you want to go ahead and conclude in favour of one or the other game?

As an avid cricketer and a fan and also somebody who has played some baseball in the US, consider me properly biased towards cricket. But in my mind there is no comparison. Cricket requires far more skill.

The 'natural actions' aspect was very interesting. Take for example basketball. It is not natural for people to do the actions that a sport like basketball demands. Nor volleyball or any number of others. I hope cricket's actions not being natural are not held against it.

One small note - cricket does not require for a bowler to start with a fully stretched out arm. He can start with a bent arm, he can even finish his action with a bent arm. What he cannot do is straighten it at the point of delivery.

2) I personally use what I consider tennis logic for my batting grip. The objective is to use both hands to cover as much territory on the bat as possible - without losing traction on the bat handle as such. This would necessarily mean that the two hands are not held close together.

In fact I do not believe that modern coaching is done that way. Players are asked to maintain optimum distance between hands and fingers for both ease when swinging as also to even out the impact and even to promote a sense of timing in budding players.

Lastly, cricket is such a complex and involved game that a talk on grip has to be complemented by talks on stance, backlift and shot execution. In fact all these three along with the grip are what determine a batsman - in his totality. For example, a closed grip does not go with an open stance and so on so forth. The person holding both his hands close together cannot have a stance where he holds his bat high even before the bowler releases the ball (a la Graham Gooch).

I am really enjoying this stimulating conversation and consequently have exceeded the maximum allotted time with the laptop as per house orders :). Never mind though.
 
Ok I see where u are hitting about SG.
I dont agree but then each of us are entitled to an opinion.

Regarding Example 1. Yes we as a team had no clue how to play the then new format of ODI (60 overs then) and we were pathetic. This guy played the only way he knew how to. Accumulated a few (yes 36 it was) played out the overs and yes we lost. If he too would have thrown his wicket trying something (slogging) he was at the time least familiar with WOULD IT HAVE HELPED THE TEAMS CAUSE? No it would not have.
Ex 2. Loads of us do things that we would normally not do OR things that we feel sorry later for IN A FIT OF RAGE. Sunil was sure that he nicked the ball onto the Pad and was shocked at being given out LBW and lillee rubbing it in was the last straw. YEs he blew a fuse & tried to take chetan chauhan off the field but the manager had better sense and sent in a batsman & all was fine.

Am sorry but Murali I surely cant understand how u can scorn one of India s greatest just for the two reasons above.

Like Suri said it broke my heart to see Kapil Dev cry on TV. Here was a guy I adored, admired and looked up to as a kid. Seeing that on TV just upset me. I dont know who all were/ are involved in that ugly part of our cricket history (i.e match fixing) so I just let it pass & watch this sport as it will survive this and much much more.
Rgds

I agree with dinyaar here & would like to add regarding the example 2.
I recently watched an interview of SMG and he was asked what was one thing that he regretted of his playing career ?
He singled out this walkout & said he let his emotions take over him & as captain of Indian team, he should have known better.
 
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