MARTIN LOGAN Speakers huge problems

[serum]

I am a long time audiophile. after much thought and auditioning i decided to invest in a pair of Martin Logan electrostatic speakers the vantage. I paid a few lacs for the same.
they sounded GREAT for a few months about 8 or so.
thereafter I found that one channel was beginning to get softer and hazy. soon both channels dropped in high frequency.the bass became dominant. I took them back to A2V who sold them to me. they attended to my problem promptly and returned them back to me, they were sounding fine. Unfortunately this was shortlived.two months later this was the same story.repeat the service from A2V. they returned them in a week and they seemed fine. 4 months later SAME problem. now i got mad at A2V and pushed them for an answer, finally they indicated that there was a problem that they seem to be having with all their Martin Logans with the DUST factor in India. Recently I met another owner(by sheer coincidence , at a cocktail) who faces the same problem.Now I believe that A2V has dropped the Martin Logan line as it was affecting their reputation and the Company is unable /unwilling to solve the problem. is there any other owners out there facing this problem, we need to discuss as to how to take this further.

 

[sud98]

Check with Marsilians who owns an electrostatic I think. Also with Prithvi of Absolute Phase but I suppose he deals with the Motion series which are non-electrostatic.

 

[myriad]

I am a long time audiophile. after much thought and auditioning i decided to invest in a pair of Martin Logan electrostatic speakers the vantage. I paid a few lacs for the same.
they sounded GREAT for a few months about 8 or so.
thereafter I found that one channel was beginning to get softer and hazy. soon both channels dropped in high frequency.the bass became dominant. I took them back to A2V who sold them to me. they attended to my problem promptly and returned them back to me, they were sounding fine. Unfortunately this was shortlived.two months later this was the same story.repeat the service from A2V. they returned them in a week and they seemed fine. 4 months later SAME problem. now i got mad at A2V and pushed them for an answer, finally they indicated that there was a problem that they seem to be having with all their Martin Logans with the DUST factor in India. Recently I met another owner(by sheer coincidence , at a cocktail) who faces the same problem.Now I believe that A2V has dropped the Martin Logan line as it was affecting their reputation and the Company is unable /unwilling to solve the problem. is there any other owners out there facing this problem, we need to discuss as to how to take this further.

serum,
One gentleman in kolkata has the same problem with ML. These speakers need dry & dust free environment. They need an air conditoned in room especially in Mumbai, Chennai & Kolkata weather due to high percentage of moisture.
Regards

 

[malvai]

serum,
One gentleman in kolkata has the same problem with ML. These speakers need dry & dust free environment. They need an air conditoned in room especially in Mumbai, Chennai & Kolkata weather due to high percentage of moisture.
Regards

Not just the ML's bro it any electrostat... But, it seems that the ML's are exceptionally susceptible to this problem...

I have friends who face this prob with their ESL and Cadence speakers as well... These need to be in a completely A/C and dehumidified environment.... Then they work like magic... or else, its totally tragic!

Maybe the OP can sell off his pair and move to other equally good brands like Thiel or Avalon or even the B&W's. Far more satisfying on all counts including reliability.

 

[serum]

Its really annoying that you spend lacs of Rupees to buy a product that fails and the company cannot resolve the problem. I too have been hearing about the very serious reliability issue. by the way the speakers were ALWAYS in a air-conditioned room which was carefully protected from moisture and dust as best possible. i believe A2V were advised to wash the stators but this was just a temporary solution.it seems this brand will just not work in our environment.

 

[murali]

Not just the ML's bro it any electrostat... But, it seems that the ML's are exceptionally susceptible to this problem...

I have friends who face this prob with their ESL and Cadence speakers as well... These need to be in a completely A/C and dehumidified environment.... Then they work like magic... or else, its totally tragic!

Maybe the OP can sell off his pair and move to other equally good brands like Thiel or Avalon or even the B&W's. Far more satisfying on all counts including reliability.

I wonder who sells the Avalon in India. Any idea whether the Ascendent is available and if yes, roughly what it costs??? I believe it is some Preeti Trading Company in Mumbai who distributes but without website or e-mails.

Thanks in advance.
murali

 

[avidyarthy]

Air conditioned room ALWAYS does not mean de-humidified ....

De-humidified means < 45% RH. In a place like Mumbai, the moment it rains, even air conditioned rooms get up to 70% ... more so due to faulty design than anything else.

Other than the moisture, we are also endowed (blessed) with dust. This dust would now go and stick to the 'elements' due to the moisture present ... and spoil it, if its sensitivity index is high .... just as in your case.

 

[rikhav]

I wonder who sells the Avalon in India. Any idea whether the Ascendent is available and if yes, roughly what it costs??? I believe it is some Preeti Trading Company in Mumbai who distributes but without website or e-mails.

Thanks in advance.
murali

Dinyaar bhai on the forum has just purchased the Avalon Ascendent a few months back. He can give you a better idea of the prices

 

[malvai]

I wonder who sells the Avalon in India. Any idea whether the Ascendent is available and if yes, roughly what it costs??? I believe it is some Preeti Trading Company in Mumbai who distributes but without website or e-mails.

Thanks in advance.
murali

Avalon is sold by Boomerang. Great guys to deal with. if you want I can PM Grattan's number.... And yes, Dinyaar also bought from them!

 

[venkatcr]

Serum, this seems to be a maintenance issue. If A2V can train you how to do it, maybe you can clean the speakers once every two months.

The other thing I would advise is to stick a cloth cover and keep the speakers covered when not in use. I have done that to all my equipment. That will positively reduce the issue of dust.

Cheers

 

[myriad]

I have friends who face this prob with their ESL and Cadence speakers as well...

I am using Cadence Avita for the last 5 years. There was some drop in performance of their panels in humid condition but not after i got them refurbished with the newer material about 3 years back. After refurbish their performance is even throughout the year.
Regards

 

[dinyaar]

I wonder who sells the Avalon in India. Any idea whether the Ascendent is available and if yes, roughly what it costs??? I believe it is some Preeti Trading Company in Mumbai who distributes but without website or e-mails.

Thanks in advance.
murali

Hi Murali
Yes PTC is the importer and is located in Bombay. The bbay dealer is Boomerang. The speaker retails between Rs 6.5 to 7.5 L depending on the chosen finish.The US list price is 10K to 12.5K if I am correct.
Yes there is almost not publicity for the brand. Ptc also carries Accuphase, Simaudio, Morel, Esoteric.
Call Boomerang and speak to Grattan Vaz or Vijay Singh.
Rgds

 

[malvai]

I am using Cadence Avita for the last 5 years. There was some drop in performance of their panels in humid condition but not after i got them refurbished with the newer material about 3 years back. After refurbish their performance is even throughout the year.
Regards

That's good to hear Myriad... am gonna suggest this to the friend that has been having probs with his Cadence Amaya's... In fact this monsoon that we're having, his speakers have been acting up waaaay too much...

 

[GeorgeO]

I have heard and enjoyed listening to Myriad's speakers.

 

[myriad]

Thanks George! It was great to have you at my place. Any chance of visiting Kolkata again? I have upgraded the amp from VA1 to Ayon Orion. It's still in burn in process but already showing it's huge prowess of handling swings and dynamics with gutso. It sounds creamy in triode much closer to VA1 which you had heard but turns a real beast when switched over to pentode.
Regards

I have heard and enjoyed listening to Myriad's speakers.

 

[murali]

Hi Murali
Yes PTC is the importer and is located in Bombay. The bbay dealer is Boomerang. The speaker retails between Rs 6.5 to 7.5 L depending on the chosen finish.The US list price is 10K to 12.5K if I am correct.
Yes there is almost not publicity for the brand. Ptc also carries Accuphase, Simaudio, Morel, Esoteric.
Call Boomerang and speak to Grattan Vaz or Vijay Singh.
Rgds

Oops. Theoretically the Vandy Quatros look to be of much better value. If one buys direct from factory, adding freight and "reasonable import duties", even the wood version of Quatro should not cost > Rs 5.0 L! The technical advantages will be 4-way compared to 2-way, plus built in powered subs and high pass filter relieving the main amp of much strain.

Of course, getting them all the way from USA is still the problem.

It looks like all high-end equipment locally available in India are priced in the stratosphere. Some time back I encountered similar issues when looking for Theta amps from their Mumbai dealer and finally dropped it altogether and settled for a used Ayre from abroad. I will be closer to truth if I say that such equipment will cost a local distributor 60-70% of the so-called MRP published in USA, add the freight and duties, still, will it reach that level???

Anyway, thanks a lot for the info.
murali

 

[dinyaar]

Hi Murali
This mark up is a sad fact. I guess Theta is distributed by AVI so u are assured of a 'high end price tag"

Your working is very accurate and actually is a bit conservative. I know of some products where the distributor transfer price is even lower. Getting into these arguments with local distributors is pointless as I have realised, so i only buy from places I know I will get a 'fair' deal. I am not prepared to pay too much more than international prices for gear.

The biggest con is in cables. Buy at pittance off the reel. Packing comes seperately. Then terminate it here shabbily .Then sell at 40 % above international retail and justify with all the usual bull shit. This does not apply to all disties naturally but I know of a few who have done pretty well for themselves adopting this brilliant policy.

Rgds

 

[G401fan]

I've been using Cadence Avitas since 2002. Never had a problem with dust (though I do have acrylic dustcovers over the 'stat unit, when not in use), nor with the crazy humidity levels of Bombay. And these are the original stats, not upgraded to the new ones.

rgds

 

[serum]

Spoke to A2V and they say that they no longer sell the brand as Martin Logan is unable to solve this problem. The product seems to be defective in our dusty climate. This is a disaster for all the Martin Logan owners and the future prospective , un suspecting buyers in the future.
I will write to the USA to complain about this.

 

[quad]

There is a huge thread on ESL diaphragm coating, in which
MJ Dijkstra says "accumulated dirt which gets more conductive at
higher humidity" could cause issues.
Also, they tried various anti-static stuff like ACL Staticide 6300
which might help.

ESL Diaphragm coating - diyAudio

Permanent Anti Static Clear Coat