Nagaoka MP 110 Cartridge

[jls001]

Does any user have advice on the best capacitive and resistive loading options for this cartridge? The published spec does recommend 47K Ohms but is completely silent on capacitive loading.

Mine has played just 14-15 LP sides so far and it will be sometime before I hit the recommended 30 hours of play.

I've been playing around with various R & C loadings as well as vertical tracking angle, and I must say I'm already very impressed. Right now, the bass sounds recessed but playing around with the above mentioned settings have really opened up the highs and mids.

Thanks in advance for any actionable advice.

PS: I've seen a wild swing in C values recommended - some say as low as 120 pF while someone else says ~450 pF. Still another user recommended ~600 pF. My MM phono preamp can do 130 to 440 pF, including phono cable capacitance. If higher is needed I can increase 440 by 100 or even 150 pF, but I'll need to heat up the iron for that.

 

[greenhorn]

I found the MP110 (technically MP10 body with MP110 stylus) having a very solid low end - as good as the M 44-7 and better than most mid end carts. I am running the phono stage of my NAD 3020.

 

[sunder]

I found the MP110 (technically MP10 body with MP110 stylus) having a very solid low end - as good as the M 44-7 and better than most mid end carts. I am running the phono stage of my NAD 3020.

greenhorn, how would you compare these carts? : MP-110 - M 44-7 - AT91 & AT-95E ? Thanks.

 

[greenhorn]

M44-7 - big in your face V shaped sound ( big bass and highs), but the bass is boomy and the highs are grainy( my daily driver for rock etc)
MP110- Much more civilized compared to the M44-7. V shaped sound, but a bit more tame. quality bass and sparkling highs ( my pick for critical listening along with my ADC XLM and Stanton 680)
AT91 - much more neutral ( but not as laid back as the Shure m75/35 family, has decent bass and highs)- grainy highs ( my daily driver for most other soft music)
AT95E - AT91 with refined highs, but still some grain

 

[jls001]

I guess my earlier assessment was premature - I just played another record and there is bass aplenty.

My current settings: 68K Ohms resistive loading, 440 pF capacitive loading and very positive VTA. When time and energy permits, I'll try higher values of C. But as it is, it's already sounding pretty damned good.

 

[sunder]

M44-7 - big in your face V shaped sound ( big bass and highs), but the bass is boomy and the highs are grainy( my daily driver for rock etc)
MP110- Much more civilized compared to the M44-7. V shaped sound, but a bit more tame. quality bass and sparkling highs ( my pick for critical listening along with my ADC XLM and Stanton 680)
AT91 - much more neutral ( but not as laid back as the Shure m75/35 family, has decent bass and highs)- grainy highs ( my daily driver for most other soft music)
AT95E - AT91 with refined highs, but still some grain

Yes , exactly. But for the price, AT91 & AT-95 carts work reasonably very good.
But, MP-110 is four times costlier than of AT91 & AT-95.

 

[greenhorn]

The good thing about the nagaoka is that it sounds much better than the other mid end carts people buy. I found the ortofon om series (on which the 2m is based to sound too thin with no bass) while the shure M97 to sound too dull, and too neutral.
Also for beginners, a conical is a much better option, since I'm in my opinion, the extra clarity is not worth the higher record wear, igd and alignment effort.
I have been shouting hoarse for people starring out to go with the at91 or m44-7 first, but most people want to invest money rather than time and effort

 

[Hari Iyer]

@ jousha

my suggestion is this if you have an LCR meter,

- measure the resistance, inductance and capacitance of the cartridge with the LCR meter.
- download PhonoLCR from this link Website of Wayne Stegall - Phono Termination Calculations and Calculator
- Enter the measured L,C and R value in the simulator software
- Try with different values of Ctotal and RL to get the best flat response.

My guess is you are getting a peak around 17KHz to 22KHz range which is masking your low end. Once that is sorted out it should be good.

 

[jls001]

Thanks Hari. I will do that. I recently bought a cheap LCR meter so I should be able to take measurements.

 

[jls001]

Yes , exactly. But for the price, AT91 & AT-95 carts work reasonably very good.
But, MP-110 is four times costlier than of AT91 & AT-95.

This is the wrong comparison. The Nagaoka MP 110 is more often compared to cartridges costing twice, or even higher.

But having said that, the cartridge won't be my first recommendation unless that person owns a phono with flexible loading options. Till I got to the current ballpark settings, I often heard an edginess in the lower mids which was fatiguing. The usual 47K/220 pF with a level tonearm doesn't work. But once dialed in, the highs are very refined - almost filigreed and ethereal. Unreal at this price point.

The one thing I hope improves with further play is the width of the sound stage. Right now, it's rather bunched up around the phantom center.

 

[JayaRaa]

@ jls001, where did you get the nagaoka cart from? price?

 

[greenhorn]

I think the high price is because of the us/uk distributors. In Japan, i bought my mp110 stylus for more or less the same price as an at95e. Till recently there was a parallel importer audio kazu who used to sell it somewhat cheaper

 

[jls001]

@ jls001, where did you get the nagaoka cart from? price?

Bought it from Japan Auction Center (Yahoo Japan Auctions. eBay Japan). It's a front end for Yahoo! Japan Auctions.

Caveat about this site: they have lots of fees. But if you can see past that, they have some fine selection of used and new cartridges. Here's the home screen for "Needles, Cartridges":

Auction - Yahoo Japan Auctions. eBay Japan

The Google Translate renders of the item descriptions can be challenging to understand at times, but one can mostly understand it.

I bought a few carts recently. The Nagaoka is the first one mounted.

 

[jls001]

I think the high price is because of the us/uk distributors. In Japan, i bought my mp110 stylus for more or less the same price as an at95e. Till recently there was a parallel importer audio kazu who used to sell it somewhat cheaper

Kazu's website no longer works. May be his FB page still works.

New prices for Nagaoka carts, at least on Jauce, are on par with international prices.

 

[jls001]

My current settings: 68K Ohms resistive loading, 440 pF capacitive loading and very positive VTA. When time and energy permits, I'll try higher values of C. But as it is, it's already sounding pretty damned good.

I tried higher C (590 pF). Doesn't work for me. 440 pF is the sweet spot.

 

[greenhorn]

I bought from rakuten japan, and since shipping was local, it was negligible. Roughly worked out to 36 gbp. Amazon us and uk prices are roughly twice that while at 95 costs are the same in Japan and uk
Checking on eBay i see a seller who ships from Japan to India for a reasonable fee

I recall reading kazu's post shutting down, hence i said that he was an option till recently

I bought a few carts recently. The Nagaoka is the first one mounted.

Do keep us posted about the rest!

 

[Hari Iyer]

I tried higher C (590 pF). Doesn't work for me. 440 pF is the sweet spot.

Try simulation of both values and you should be close to a solution

 

[JayaRaa]

Bought it from Japan Auction Center (Yahoo Japan Auctions. eBay Japan). It's a front end for Yahoo! Japan Auctions.

Caveat about this site: they have lots of fees. But if you can see past that, they have some fine selection of used and new cartridges. Here's the home screen for "Needles, Cartridges":

Auction - Yahoo Japan Auctions. eBay Japan

The Google Translate renders of the item descriptions can be challenging to understand at times, but one can mostly understand it.

I bought a few carts recently. The Nagaoka is the first one mounted.

i just checked and found amazon.jp prices to be cheaper than this auction site. anyway too much head ache and translation issues always there.
lp gear has listed it for $124 with free shipping anywhere in us over orders of $77, so probably makes sense for someone to get it along from there, atleast imho.

 

[jls001]

i just checked and found amazon.jp prices to be cheaper than this auction site. anyway too much head ache and translation issues always there.
lp gear has listed it for $124 with free shipping anywhere in us over orders of $77, so probably makes sense for someone to get it along from there, atleast imho.

If buying Nagaoka only, Jauce is probably not the best option. But if interested in New Old Stock vintage cartridges or used vintage top of the line MM/MI/MF cartridges, Jauce is a great market place. I could recommend a few

If buying more than one item from different sellers, Jauce can club them into a single international shipment, saving costs. Very convenient.

 

[jls001]

The one thing I hope improves with further play is the width of the sound stage. Right now, it's rather bunched up around the phantom center.

I've come to the sad conclusion that my cartridge seems to be defective:sad:

The narrow soundstage which I thought would improve with burn in is actually channel imbalance. Left channel is normal but right is lower. My guesstimate is it's lower by about 5-6 dB.

One possible reason could be that the coils are skewed internally, since the cantilever itself is perfectly perpendicular to the bottom surface of the cartridge.

I tried varying the azimuth from one extreme to the other extreme to check if channel balance varies, but it is of no help as right channel continues to be lower no matter how much I skewed the azimuth. This is really a shame because I really like the sound I heard (punchy, has lots of drive and most of all very refined highs).

Any ideas?

I haven't checked by removing the stylus assembly.