Speakers for classical music

[gustavm]

Im a big fan of your forum and have followed it a long time. I decided to join because I really need expert help from you guys to choose some speakers.
My budget for the speakers is up to 10k.
I started looking at ESL like the Quads, especially the 2905 model, but the trouble is that I listen to big orchestral works like symphonies of Bruckner, Mahler, Tchaikovsky and the Quads just give up at a certain level. I dont know if you can say the same about the Maggies or Martin Logans.
On the other hand I was thinking about the Tannoys or the Kef which both have a dual concentric system that makes trebles and lower frequencies to blend in better and have good pinpoint imaging and soundstage. The part that dosent convince me from the Tannoy is that there is just one big woofer and the treble inside. Can they really emulate a whole orchestra?
Any other suggestions?
Many thanks in advance, from Chile.

 

[gustavm]

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I mainly listen to classical music, be this vocal, chamber, symphonic or operatic. And a little bit of jazz (mostly bebop and hardtop). Cheers.

 

[gustavm]

Another detail I forgot about. My listening room is 4 x 6 mts and about 3 mts high.

 

[rohitmusic]

Just a quick pointer - have you explored tube amps with drivers like fostex, many people swear by this combination for your kind of music.

 

[jagdish_p]

My budget for the speakers is up to 10k.
I started looking at ESL like the Quads, especially the 2905 model, but the trouble is that I listen to big orchestral works like symphonies of Bruckner, Mahler, Tchaikovsky and the Quads just give up at a certain level. I dont know if you can say the same about the Maggies or Martin Logans.
On the other hand I was thinking about the Tannoys or the Kef which both have a dual concentric system that makes trebles and lower frequencies to blend in better and have good pinpoint imaging and soundstage. The part that dosent convince me from the Tannoy is that there is just one big woofer and the treble inside. Can they really emulate a whole orchestra?
Any other suggestions?
Many thanks in advance, from Chile.

When you say your budget is 10 k do you mean 10 k US $.?

I find the Tannoys very detailed with good sound stage though lacking in bass.
The DC 6 T has a a separate woofer in addition to mid with tweeter placed concentric ally

 

[Audio_Freek]

As per my suggestion, Tube amp with Full range Drives should be best for Classic.

So Good TT+Tube amp+Full range drives would be best for warm and vocal to delivery Vocal in specific to Classical Music.

You could wait for some suggestion from other Forum members too

 

[gustavm]

As per my suggestion, Tube amp with Full range Drives should be best for Classic.

So Good TT+Tube amp+Full range drives would be best for warm and vocal to delivery Vocal in specific to Classical Music.

You could wait for some suggestion from other Forum members too

Thanks, and what full range speakers would you recommend?

 

[gustavm]

When you say your budget is 10 k do you mean 10 k US $.?

I find the Tannoys very detailed with good sound stage though lacking in bass.
The DC 6 T has a a separate woofer in addition to mid with tweeter placed concentric ally

Yes 10.000 US dollar would be my roof. Any suggestions?

 

[Staxxx]

Hello Gustav. I listen to a lot of classical music and have been through a lot of iterations with regards to my music system.

It would help to understand what type of sound you prefer? Also what amplification do you have or intend to use? What brands can you get easily in Chile or can you import speakers and happy to do so without audition?

Broadly at the price point you mention there are speakers that capture micro detail, throw a big soundstage and allow you to follow each strand of counterpoint amongst the various instruments easily. Others are more focussed on getting the tonality of the instruments correct and focus on coherence (in terms of the music as all speakers attempt this in terms of drivers). These speakers play less of the audiophile game when trying to reproduce music. Both are valid and of course you can get to places in-between but this usually involves a lot of hard work in room treatments (a must in my opinion - save some money for this) and system matching.

Reproducing orchestral music is almost always a losing battle but as long as you realize that an orchestra within your room is not going to sound like an orchestra in a concert hall you can get to a level of reproduction that is quite pleasurable with good recordings.

Some speakers that I think excel in reproducing scale and timbre when it comes to this type of music (and within the bounds of my personal taste) are Harbeths 30.1, Focus Audio (from Canada), the bigger B&Ws (with the right partnering equipment), Eggleston Works (not sure of current pricing but some beautifully voiced speakers), PMC, Marten Design Django L (I use the XL), Sonus Faber and Vienna Acoustics. All these brands should give you a model within your budget, be it a competent monitor or floorstander.

I am sure other forum members can add to this list....and eventually you will have several more choices than you can possibly audition.

At the end you should listen to some of these and decide yourself on the sound presentation that you would like to live with. Believe me all audio systems are a compromise (and especially so when it comes to orchestral music) so don't go after a quest for perfection.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

What great advice!

To me, classical, orchestral music (as well as being wonderful!) is the test for any hifi system. Nothing else packs in so much, with so much variety in pitch, tone, stage, in fact in every element of music and performance with the possible exception of sheer electronically-forced ear-shattering volume --- although a big orchestra is quite loud.

(I'm not very good at music history, but I am aware that "classical" actually covers a vast range of cultures and history with many different sounds, and, I guess, what I'm really talking about here is the later "romantic" era of which my favourite is Mahler).

Gustav, I don't have much personal experience of different speakers, but I have heard Tannoys in a fellow forum member's system, and I think you may have not done them justice. Yes, I think that concentric-driver system can reproduce a whole orchestra.

I know it's the sound that matters, but I've given up being ashamed of taking appearance into account o :lol. OK, I wouldn't buy Tannoys just because they look the part, but, my goodness they do! And i think that beautiful woodwork, in speakers, also increases confidence in what's inside.

 

[techboy]

The setup I have is fairly similar to what you could make:

AVI ADM 9RS Around 2.5-3k USD based on the dealer

Asus Essence One Muses Edition DAC Around 1k USD

Then you can get a Hybrid or Tube Preamp/Headphone Amp as PRE for another 500-1500 USD or so

Between the stands, cables, misc, accessories etc you will be out another 500 USD or so.

Total around 4-6k USD and ideal for classical. The stock speakers are dry, but the DAC and tube pre more than makes up for it and gives the ideal natural and lifelike sound you need.

You can check more reviews of AVI speakers, especially on hddaudio.net. You may do better for 10k but more so from a sound signature preference rather than a purely technical point of view, and very unlikely under sub 5k USD!

Thank You

Aakshey

PS: If you can afford it, I say go for AVI ADM 40 which are 2 way floorstanding speakers, along with the setup I mentioned above. But I am not sure whether they would fit in your budget along with the other stuff.

 

[gustavm]

Hello Gustav. I listen to a lot of classical music and have been through a lot of iterations with regards to my music system.

It would help to understand what type of sound you prefer? Also what amplification do you have or intend to use? What brands can you get easily in Chile or can you import speakers and happy to do so without audition?

Broadly at the price point you mention there are speakers that capture micro detail, throw a big soundstage and allow you to follow each strand of counterpoint amongst the various instruments easily. Others are more focussed on getting the tonality of the instruments correct and focus on coherence (in terms of the music as all speakers attempt this in terms of drivers). These speakers play less of the audiophile game when trying to reproduce music. Both are valid and of course you can get to places in-between but this usually involves a lot of hard work in room treatments (a must in my opinion - save some money for this) and system matching.

Reproducing orchestral music is almost always a losing battle but as long as you realize that an orchestra within your room is not going to sound like an orchestra in a concert hall you can get to a level of reproduction that is quite pleasurable with good recordings.

Some speakers that I think excel in reproducing scale and timbre when it comes to this type of music (and within the bounds of my personal taste) are Harbeths 30.1, Focus Audio (from Canada), the bigger B&Ws (with the right partnering equipment), Eggleston Works (not sure of current pricing but some beautifully voiced speakers), PMC, Marten Design Django L (I use the XL), Sonus Faber and Vienna Acoustics. All these brands should give you a model within your budget, be it a competent monitor or floorstander.

I am sure other forum members can add to this list....and eventually you will have several more choices than you can possibly audition.

At the end you should listen to some of these and decide yourself on the sound presentation that you would like to live with. Believe me all audio systems are a compromise (and especially so when it comes to orchestral music) so don't go after a quest for perfection.

Many thanks Staxxx for a very complete response. Im aware that I wont be able to emulate an orchestra through my sound system. I just wanted to have opinions from people that have had experiences with speakers and classical music, including big orchestral works with all their complexities. From the speakers you mention I could audition the B&Ws and the Sonus Fabers. I was going more for a floorstander than a monitor since the latter is limited on the low frequencies (which you would need for examples for organ works big orchestral works from the romantic period). I have now Tannoy monitors and, although they have very good detailing, they lack an envolving soundstage. I was thinking of waiting a little more and save so as to be able to get the B&W 800 diamonds. Another brand that I could get here in Chile is KEF. They have a similar system like the Tannoys with the Dual Concentric. The Reference 207/2 has very good reviews. Have you heard them?
Thanks again for everything.

 

[gustavm]

Gustav, I don't have much personal experience of different speakers, but I have heard Tannoys in a fellow forum member's system, and I think you may have not done them justice. Yes, I think that concentric-driver system can reproduce a whole orchestra.

I know it's the sound that matters, but I've given up being ashamed of taking appearance into account o :lol. OK, I wouldn't buy Tannoys just because they look the part, but, my goodness they do! And i think that beautiful woodwork, in speakers, also increases confidence in what's inside.

Thanks Thad! And what Tannoys would you recommend?

 

[gustavm]

The setup I have is fairly similar to what you could make:

AVI ADM 9RS Around 2.5-3k USD based on the dealer

Asus Essence One Muses Edition DAC Around 1k USD

Then you can get a Hybrid or Tube Preamp/Headphone Amp as PRE for another 500-1500 USD or so

Between the stands, cables, misc, accessories etc you will be out another 500 USD or so.

Total around 4-6k USD and ideal for classical. The stock speakers are dry, but the DAC and tube pre more than makes up for it and gives the ideal natural and lifelike sound you need.

You can check more reviews of AVI speakers, especially on hddaudio.net. You may do better for 10k but more so from a sound signature preference rather than a purely technical point of view, and very unlikely under sub 5k USD!

Thank You

Aakshey

PS: If you can afford it, I say go for AVI ADM 40 which are 2 way floorstanding speakers, along with the setup I mentioned above. But I am not sure whether they would fit in your budget along with the other stuff.

Hi Aakshey! Unfortunately the AVI speaker is not available here in Chile, but could you explain the advantages of having a active vs passive speaker for classical music?

 

[Staxxx]

Hello Gustav, I have not had the opportunity to hear those KEFs. Do let us know your opinion if you get a chance to audition them.
Also, depending on your room, do try and listen to the big Harbeths (40.1). They are much larger than several floorstanders even if they don't reach the floor...and they can produce a lot of bass.

 

[techboy]

To learn more about active vs passive, head over to hddaudio.net or email Ashley James of AVI.

 

[techboy]

And AVI ship globally for 1375 pounds for the 9RS

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Thanks Thad! And what Tannoys would you recommend?

Not enough experience to make a recommendation as such, but I think it is the Turnberry that I have listened to, on three visits to HFV member Dr.Bass's place. You might contact him for full feedback on Tannoy: he can also give comparisons with other makes.

EDIT: also just got a reminder of this thread. More HFV experience to draw on!

To learn more about active vs passive, head over to hddaudio.net or email Ashley James of AVI.

There is a good thread here, where I learnt the difference!


~

 

[gustavm]

Hello Gustav, I have not had the opportunity to hear those KEFs. Do let us know your opinion if you get a chance to audition them.
Also, depending on your room, do try and listen to the big Harbeths (40.1). They are much larger than several floorstanders even if they don't reach the floor...and they can produce a lot of bass.

Hi Staxxx. The Herberths look really good and have very good reviews too, including one from Stereophile. Have you audition them? How do they cope with Mahlers 8th?

 

[Staxxx]

The dealer here in Bangalore has the Compact 7 ES and the SHL5. I have heard both and I truly like the sound they produce when it comes to classical music (which is what I listen to almost 90% of the time). The compact 7 is too small for you but either the SHL5 or the 40.1 should suit you.
The SHL5 produces a vast soundstage. It is all about the music with Harbeths and therefore the usual audiophile precision of more analytic speakers is less obvious. I have the Djangos for that, which throw a huge precise soundstage also but of a different nature.
If your room is big enough and your budget can stretch it I should think the 40.1, their flagship speaker should be the one to go for. If not, perhaps the SHL5. But remember this is for extended listening sessions with no sense of fatigue.
So when it comes to Mahler's 8th the question really is which speaker can you sit in front of for 81 or so minutes of music and enjoy the symphony. I think a Harbeth would be one of them.