subwoofer for movies and music

[Rupinder]

I had planned a home theatre about 15*23feet dimensions. but after talking to the architect the room dimensions have been changed to 17*26feet.it will not be a dedicated HT room as it will have Windows which I had intially thought not to install
So I need a sub for a bit large size home theatre.the equipment I have finalised is

1 anthem mrx 500 avr
2 paradigm studio 100
3 paradigm cc690
4 paradigm adp surrounds
I have yet to finalise a sub. I want a sub to do duties for both music and movies.although I might not need a sub for music as studio 100 gives a very good bass response.so I would like a sub which is musical as well rock in low frequencies in movies.I am thinking about these subs but feel Free to give your own opinion

1 svs sb13 ultra
2 velodyne spl 1200
3paradigm studio 12 or 15
4 svs pb 13 ultra (think it is too big)

Or any sub which you think is fast and accurate and dig low also

 

[Kittu]

HSU has some decent choices too in the budget range, too bad that it doubles up after import. VTF-3mk4 is a pretty good choice. You can have a dual drive option too , there is nothing like having two subs in a home cinema.

VTF-3 MK4 Subwoofer

 

[Santy]

If you are particular about music also, then I would suggest sealed sub x 2.

SVS SB12 x 2 will be great for the requirement. Or even Velo SPL 1200 x 2.
For that matter VTF-3 MK4 x 2 also can be ideal. We could plug the ports.

If it is only one sub then SVS PB 13 ultra will certainly satisfy your bass thirst.

If possible try to get your hands on Rhythmik sub
Rythmik Audio • 15" servo subwoofer FV15HP
It has got rave reviews. Servo controlled for better transient response.

 

[Rupinder]

Thanks kittu and santy for your help. Can you tell me the person who distributes the hsu and rythmic subs in India.I am not in the mood for a direct import as these subs are heavy and adding shopping and customs well double the landed price

 

[shanmune]

As others have suggested, HSU and SVS are both great units. HSU offers more flexibility in your listening options and SVS offers better extension in the sub 20 hz. The only problem with HSU is that there is no established dealer network in India. As santy suggested, dual PB-12 NSD would be the best option. If not, PB-13 ultra would be the next.

 

[Santy]

Thanks kittu and santy for your help. Can you tell me the person who distributes the hsu and rythmic subs in India.I am not in the mood for a direct import as these subs are heavy and adding shopping and customs well double the landed price

Neither are available in India.
Yes importing sub is a pain.

It looks like SVS / Velodyne are your options now.

SVS also has some stock issues, you may have to wait after placing an order.
Check with sandeep at audire dot in. He is one of the authorised distributors in India.

Velodyne is available with many dealers I suppose. I bought from htstore.in. Also not sure if that model is available with anyone (is it not outdated?)

@shanmune
I suggested dual SB12, not PB12!
(though the later is much louder)

 

[shanmune]

Neither are available in India.
Yes importing sub is a pain.

It looks like SVS / Velodyne are your options now.

SVS also has some stock issues, you may have to wait after placing an order.
Check with sandeep at audire dot in. He is one of the authorised distributors in India.

Velodyne is available with many dealers I suppose. I bought from htstore.in. Also not sure if that model is available with anyone (is it not outdated?)

@shanmune
I suggested dual SB12, not PB12!
(though the later is much louder)

@Santy
Thanks Santy for the quick correction.

As per the information that I got, SVS stocks would be available sometime in the 2nd or 3rd week of December.
If we look closely at the respective prices of both SVS and HSU, they are almost same (comparing the SVS price offered in India and the total price of HSU after shipping). For example, HSU VTF-2 MK-4 and it's equivalent SVS PB-12NSD costs almost the same, but the advantage with SVS is the distribution network in India for any future service/repairs.

 

[Rupinder]

I think I will go for the svs sb13 ultra
Another option is to go for svs pb13 ultra and run it in sealed mode for music and ported mode for movies
Waiting for price list from audire

 

[Rupinder]

I had decided to go for svs pb13 ultra sub but that is priced at close to 2 lacs.its this sub worth 2 lac. Can i get the same by using some other sub or two subs

 

[rbalagopalan]

I am not in the mood for a direct import as these subs are heavy and adding shopping and customs well double the landed price

If we look closely at the respective prices of both SVS and HSU, they are almost same (comparing the SVS price offered in India and the total price of HSU after shipping). For example, HSU VTF-2 MK-4 and it's equivalent SVS PB-12NSD costs almost the same, but the advantage with SVS is the distribution network in India for any future service/repairs.

@Rupinder I do agree adding shipping & customs will double the price but the landing will be less the huge profits of Indian dealers.

lf you had seen my thread "My home theatre journey" by now you would have known that I was struggling for matching of sub in my setup. I was also contemplating between Velodyne DD12, SVS PB 13 Ultra, HSU VTF3 MK 3 or 4 cause the difference between both is nothing but EQ which in any case I don't need as Anthem is asking us to keep the Sub's EQ off as it does the EQ for Sub too in response to the Mains.

Luckily I could get SVS PB 13 ultra for audition at my setup and I could source one HSU VTF3 MK3. Out of this two HSU could out perform SVS with regard to musicality and especially it has vanished totally in to the respective speakers. The bass was fully rounded, deep and stayed where it has to without dispersing in to the room. of course SVS also did a fair job and in comparison to my earlier Sunrise TSEQ 12 SVS was far far superior.

Note: My set is in Living Room measuring 15' x 22' with almost 60% opening by windows and doors and the whole audition is done keeping all the doors open. So in your room HSU VTF 3 should be great and more than enough.

@Shanmune. The Indian price of PB 13 and Landing cost of the VTH3 will almost be the same may be VTF 3 is cheaper. I would say at this juncture we can totally discount the distributor network and service back up. Cause none of these products are chip level serviced by any of the dealers but for the mid and low segment items. At least given the liberty we can try out chip level servicing (if at all it fails) or else we ourselves can import the board and replace it. Especially Subwoofers and power amps no big deal.

In fact Madbullram and Naseer was at my house last Sunday and had audition so Ram as a new listener of my setup will be able to throw more light on HSU's performance in my set up.

R. Balagopalan.

 

[madbullram]

I concur with Bala. I would suggest a velodyne or HSU paired with Anthem. In fact, I honestly felt the 2nd HSU Bala had was an overkill as his primary sub was doing a fantastic job.

 

[Soundstage]

I had planned a home theatre about 15*23feet dimensions. but after talking to the architect the room dimensions have been changed to 17*26feet.it will not be a dedicated HT room as it will have Windows which I had intially thought not to install
So I need a sub for a bit large size home theatre.the equipment I have finalised is

1 anthem mrx 500 avr
2 paradigm studio 100
3 paradigm cc690
4 paradigm adp surrounds
I have yet to finalise a sub. I want a sub to do duties for both music and movies.although I might not need a sub for music as studio 100 gives a very good bass response.so I would like a sub which is musical as well rock in low frequencies in movies.I am thinking about these subs but feel Free to give your own opinion

1 svs sb13 ultra
2 velodyne spl 1200
3paradigm studio 12 or 15
4 svs pb 13 ultra (think it is too big)

Or any sub which you think is fast and accurate and dig low also

Sir,

IMHO 2 smaller subs will be able to load your 17 x 26 room better than 1 big sub. Not only will you benefit in HT, but they would also augment the Studio 100s much better for stereo, should you feel the need for lower bass.

I have been using a Velodyne HGS 18 with my Studio 100s for HT for a number of years, albeit in a smaller room. For a larger room, I would definitely go with 2 subs.

Cheers!

 

[Rupinder]

Thanks for all the suggestions. It's not that I don't think two will not load the room properly.I want a sub or two which can give flat response till 20 Hz or go below even that.

 

[manoj.p]

+1 to soundstage.

The additional sub will not be much help for loudness, but it will help even out peaks n dips for better bass consistency.

When I was looking for subwoofers, One of my friend asked me this question - "Do you want loud bass or good bass?" The answer was off course good bass and the way to get is multiple subs rather than a single more powerful one.

If price is a concern, you can look into diy. Building sealed subwoofers is the easiest and many people actually prefer sealed subs.

 

[shanmune]

@Shanmune. The Indian price of PB 13 and Landing cost of the VTH3 will almost be the same may be VTF 3 is cheaper. I would say at this juncture we can totally discount the distributor network and service back up. Cause none of these products are chip level serviced by any of the dealers but for the mid and low segment items. At least given the liberty we can try out chip level servicing (if at all it fails) or else we ourselves can import the board and replace it. Especially Subwoofers and power amps no big deal.

In fact Madbullram and Naseer was at my house last Sunday and had audition so Ram as a new listener of my setup will be able to throw more light on HSU's performance in my set up.

R. Balagopalan.

Bala,
Thanks for sharing your comments. In fact few of our forum members (including me) are in search of good subwoofers (either from SVS or HSU). I was bit skeptical of getting HSU for the reasons that I mentioned in my earlier post.

I am trying to understand your point on the servicing/repair of subwoofers. Are you suggesting that repairing a subwoofer is not a big issue in case of a failure ? Let's say if the amp inside the sub has to be replaced. In that case, can we easily import the amp unit alone from HSU and replace the faulty one on our own ? Even other wise, few of us (at least me) do not posses the engineering skills to try out these things. In case if there are some experts who can do repairing/servicing for us and provided we can order any part from HSU, I will be more than willing to take HSU. Since you have dealt with lots of AV products across the spectrum, you must be more knowledgeable than me and so please feel free to educate me if I am having any misconceptions.

 

[rbalagopalan]

I concur with Bala. I would suggest a velodyne or HSU paired with Anthem. In fact, I honestly felt the 2nd HSU Bala had was an overkill as his primary sub was doing a fantastic job.

Thanks for all the suggestions. It's not that I don't think two will not load the room properly.I want a sub or two which can give flat response till 20 Hz or go below even that.

I also was of the same opinion that I need 2 subs till I had HSU VTF3. Seeing the performance of this I ordered one more cylindrical HSU to place it in the rear corner. After placing the result was disappointing as clearly stated by Ram.

 

[manoj.p]

rbalagopalan,

When you add the second sub, usually it should be same as the first one or frequency response same as first one. Only then it can take care of peaks and dips. Also, the positioning for two subs is bit different than only if there were just one sub. Usually the quarter points of front/back wall or center point of opposite walls is the best location for subs.

Since you are using two different subs even if from the same manufacturer, the results are not surprising. As said earlier, the second sub is not to add more spl, but to cancel out the room modes created by first sub. If you try different positions, you may get some better response. But if you are happy with single sub, then better to stick with it because being happy with setup matters the most.

 

[arj]

adding on to the above post,
2 subs are always better than one but getting it right is even more difficult as integeration is all about balancing the Position, crossover point , phase and the volume in that order of difficulty as well as process.
instead of corners can you try placing it just behind the speakers,slightly Left or right and then individually make sure you get the phase right so the sound is the highest .after that move the volume so low such that the sub is barely heard..but when you switch it off you miss it.
for crossover point, you could try play between th3 3db to 6db point on your speakers (a REL would have been at a 10 db point)
i took me more than a month to get the right spots..but when they did they just locked in and worked great !

 

[Soundstage]

I also was of the same opinion that I need 2 subs till I had HSU VTF3. Seeing the performance of this I ordered one more cylindrical HSU to place it in the rear corner. After placing the result was disappointing as clearly stated by Ram.

Agree fully with Manoj.P and Arj.

Positioning is critical when it comes to employing multiple subs. With due respect, maybe you should play around with placement of _both_ the subs and the phase selection until you get them to load the room correctly in tandem. With less than perfect placement, you usually have the second sub cancelling the first sub, leading to a markedly inferior combined performance, as compared to a single sub.

Cheers!

 

[madbullram]

Adding to the above, the important point Manoj pointed is critical. I have seen more success with 2 Subs of the same model. the moment we change models even if its of same manufacturer, its becomes difficult to bring the harmony.

bala: But we need to audition once you have the 2nd sub in perfect condition, and let Anthem do the room correction again. Only then we will know the real impact.