Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is better?

[elangoas]

Hi All,

Trying to seek inputs on which is a better surround speaker placement among speakers at Ear Level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted towards user...

Also please share if you have tried more than one placement..

 

[Murlidher]

I tried all. For me, I did not like at ear level as it was distracting for me. Above ear level should be fine with atmos in the ceiling.

Tilted/ angled with little more height should be ok if there is no ceiling at top, as it would be difficult to differentiate between the two.

My 2 cents

By the way good topic thread. People can also share pics of their surround with their experiences....

Sent from my XT1562 using Tapatalk

 

[determinus]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

If they are dipoles it doesnt matter where they are positioned. Di/Bipoles in general diffuse the sound. Otherwise, usually it is recommended to be above ear level on the wall. That's what most of the 5.1 schematics show.

 

[elangoas]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Tilted/ angled with little more height should be ok if there is no ceiling at top, as it would be difficult to differentiate between the two.

Didn't get you..

If they are dipoles it doesnt matter where they are positioned. Di/Bipoles in general diffuse the sound. Otherwise, usually it is recommended to be above ear level on the wall. That's what most of the 5.1 schematics show.

Yeah right.. For dipoles they are fine..

 

[MaSh]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Rear surrounds should fill the void and give a sense of spaciousness. Keeping them directly at ear level, will make them overpower the front speakers. Hence they are recommended to be around 2-3 feet above ear level.

 

[sdurani]

Surround placement depends on the situation. If you only have 2 surrounds, then they should be at some location between your sides and behind you, so they have the best compromise between sides and rears. If you're using 4 surrounds, then you can move the surround speakers directly to your sides or slightly forward in order to have better separation from the surround-back speakers on the back wall.

With the same thinking, if you're doing a non-Atmos set-up, then the surrounds should be elevated at some height between ear level and the ceiling, so that they have the best compromise between surrounds and heights. If you have an Atmos set-up, then you can move the surrounds closer to ear level in order to have better separation from the height speakers on the ceiling.

Speakers usually sound best on-axis (aimed at the listener). Surround speakers have to follow the same laws of physics as other speakers. So if you're pointing your centre speaker at you, then you should point all other speakers at you.

If they are dipoles it doesnt matter where they are positioned.

Diopoles have to be very carefully positioned and aimed so that listeners are sitting in the null of their dispersion pattern (which is the whole reason to use dipoles instead of bipoles).

 

[sidvee]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

I prefer them 2-3 feet above ear level slightly behind the listener. I really find monopoles aimed at the listener very distracting as I prefer surround effects to be more diffused so while using monopoles I prefer them firing to the back wall which gives me a more diffuse effect.
Cheers,
Sid

 

[elangoas]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Surround placement depends on the situation. If you only have 2 surrounds, then they should be at some location between your sides and behind you, so they have the best compromise between sides and rears. If you're using 4 surrounds, then you can move the surround speakers directly to your sides or slightly forward in order to have better separation from the surround-back speakers on the back wall.

With the same thinking, if you're doing a non-Atmos set-up, then the surrounds should be elevated at some height between ear level and the ceiling, so that they have the best compromise between surrounds and heights. If you have an Atmos set-up, then you can move the surrounds closer to ear level in order to have better separation from the height speakers on the ceiling.

Speakers usually sound best on-axis (aimed at the listener). Surround speakers have to follow the same laws of physics as other speakers. So if you're pointing your centre speaker at you, then you should point all other speakers at you.

Thanks for the info..Assuming a user plans for 5.1.2 setup, with front heights, then i guess a surround is better at ear level...

There are lot of manufacturer's who are providing Atmos add on speaker.. But i believe they can also be used as surrounds (or) heights because they are angled towards the listener when wall mounted..

Here is one speaker

What position can a user best benefit from these speaker?

 

[sdurani]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Assuming a user plans for 5.1.2 setup, with front heights, then i guess a surround is better at ear level...

With front heights, surrounds can still be elevated, since they are nowhere near the height speakers. However, if you were doing a 5.1.4 set-up with rear heights, THEN it would be better to lower the surrounds in order to separate them from the heights back there.

There are lot of manufacturer's who are providing Atmos add on speaker.. But i believe they can also be used as surrounds (or) heights because they are angled towards the listener when wall mounted..

They can be used as surrounds, but that's not a good idea. Atmos upfiring speakers contain a circuit in the crossover that has a frequency response notch around 10-14kHz that fools the ear into thinking those sounds are coming from above you. This is called Dolby Elevation processing. Plus they have a narrow dispersion pattern to light up a spot on the ceiling (instead of the whole ceiling).

Both those things cost extra and are good for upfiring speakers but not good for use as regular surrounds. For surround use, you can get better speakers for less money than Atmos upfiring speakers.

What position can a user best benefit from these speaker?

Sitting on top of their other speakers, pointing up at the ceiling.

 

[elangoas]

For me, I did not like at ear level as it was distracting for me.

I really find monopoles aimed at the listener very distracting as I prefer surround effects to be more diffused

Two user's so far reporting that surrounds at ear level distract more... Even if you try to bring down the level, is it still distracting ?

They can be used as surrounds, but that's not a good idea. Atmos upfiring speakers contain a circuit in the crossover that has a frequency response notch around 10-14kHz that fools the ear into thinking those sounds are coming from above you. This is called Dolby Elevation processing. Plus they have a narrow dispersion pattern to light up a spot on the ceiling (instead of the whole ceiling).

Good info.. Wasn't aware of this.. There is no mention about this on any of the reviews for these kind of speakers..

Both those things cost extra and are good for upfiring speakers but not good for use as regular surrounds. For surround use, you can get better speakers for less money than Atmos upfiring speakers

So if an angled speaker, which doesn't spike the freq response (or) which doesn't comply to Dolby atmos specification, could very well serve for both surrounds and heights too?

 

[sdurani]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Good info.. Wasn't aware of this.. There is no mention about this on any of the reviews for these kind of speakers..

If you search the terms Atmos Elevation in Google images, you can see the frequency response notch of upfiring speakers:

Why would anyone deliberately want that sort of frequency response added to their surround speakers?

So if an angled speaker, which doesn't spike the freq response (or) which doesn't comply to Dolby atmos specification, could very well serve for both surrounds and heights too?

Any ordinary bookshelf speaker can work fine as a surround speaker or height speaker. It's just sound, coming out of a speaker. Just like sound coming out of your front speakers or centre speaker.

The physics of sound reproduction doesn't change just because you're feeding a speaker a "surround" channel instead of the "centre" channel. It's just sound, coming out of a speaker.

 

[elangoas]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

Why would anyone deliberately want that sort of frequency response added to their surround speakers? Any ordinary bookshelf speaker can work fine as a surround speaker or height speaker. It's just sound, coming out of a speaker. Just like sound coming out of your front speakers or centre speaker.

Agree.. But my thoughts were that non dolby atmos angled speaker should provide a better dispersion angle aimed at the listener than the regular bookshelf speaker achieve to do..

The physics of sound reproduction doesn't change just because you're feeding a speaker a "surround" channel instead of the "centre" channel. It's just sound, coming out of a speaker.

Perfect..got it..

 

[superczar]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

I use a pair of Bose 301s positioned above the ear level just behind the couch..

I shifted to these from a pair of JBL Control Ones and trying a borrowed pair of Wharfedale Diamonds
I am very happy with the placement as well as the choice of speakers

The JBL and the wharfs had to be placed at ear level because of the tight directional sound they create (which made them very obtrusive and had a very poor WAF)

The Bose 301s on the other hand work great for the very reason they are bad speakers for a stereo setup (because of the diffused sound they create at a fraction of the cost of a good pair of dipoles)

 

[sdurani]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

..my thoughts were that non dolby atmos angled speaker should provide a better dispersion angle aimed at the listener than the regular bookshelf speaker achieve to do..

Does the tilt really need to be built into the speaker cabinet? What if it's the wrong tilt angle for your situation? Instead of buying an angled speaker, I would just buy a good speaker and angle it.

 

[MaSh]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

There are lot of manufacturer's who are providing Atmos add on speaker.. But i believe they can also be used as surrounds (or) heights because they are angled towards the listener when wall mounted..


What position can a user best benefit from these speaker?

I believe any speaker can be used at any location. See no issue with that. The speaker in the image here has a big wave guide which would help spread the frequencies better than a speaker without one.

If you are getting this one, try it out at different locations and see if it makes a difference.

MaSh

 

[elangoas]

I use a pair of Bose 301s positioned above the ear level just behind the couch..

I shifted to these from a pair of JBL Control Ones and trying a borrowed pair of Wharfedale Diamonds
I am very happy with the placement as well as the choice of speakers

The JBL and the wharfs had to be placed at ear level because of the tight directional sound they create (which made them very obtrusive and had a very poor WAF)

The Bose 301s on the other hand work great for the very reason they are bad speakers for a stereo setup (because of the diffused sound they create at a fraction of the cost of a good pair of dipoles)

That's nice.. Exploiting the speaker to its best of capabilities...

Does the tilt really need to be built into the speaker cabinet?

I think better.. Makes life easy for the user.. straight out of the box solution..

What if it's the wrong tilt angle for your situation?

Hmmm..In what scenario is it a compromise ?

Instead of buying an angled speaker, I would just buy a good speaker and angle it.

Yes.. The user has to look for surrounds with wall brackets to then angle it..

I believe any speaker can be used at any location. See no issue with that. The speaker in the image here has a big wave guide which would help spread the frequencies better than a speaker without one.

If you are getting this one, try it out at different locations and see if it makes a difference.

MaSh

Yes.. Precisely my thoughts too.. Sure.. Yet to decide.. But there seem to be trade-off in this type of speaker as there may be spike in the freq resp as sdurani pointed out..

 

[htfan17]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

I believe if u have a dedicated room that u can treat professionally acoustically then any position for surrounds is fine as it will reach ur ears undiluted. If not then only at ear level makes sense. there are tons of things in non acoustic room that eat up or distort a lot of sound eminating from speakers. thats the only rule for me.

 

[elangoas]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

I believe if u have a dedicated room that u can treat professionally acoustically then any position for surrounds is fine as it will reach ur ears undiluted. If not then only at ear level makes sense. there are tons of things in non acoustic room that eat up or distort a lot of sound eminating from speakers. thats the only rule for me.

For some who is not able to treat it professionally, i think Digital Room Correction should be of some help..

 

[leo_leo]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

2 - 3 feet may be a bit excessive in some cases. The Dolby site is purposely vague when it says "above ear level" because there is no exact distance or height to get the most out of your setup. It will depend a lot on the speakers.

On my setup, I have the surrounds on the back corners of the couch pointing towards the center of the couch. When sitting in the couch they are close to ear level depending on how comfortable I am and they provide good surround. Ideally I'd like to get some stands and move them up, back, and out another foot or so.

If the surrounds are distracting you and you hear them too much they are probably too close. If they sound like you're in a ditch, they're too high. If they are barely audible, they're either too far, too low, or pointing in the wrong direction.

 

[elangoas]

Re: Surround's - Ear level (or) Above ear level (or) Angled / Tilted - Which is bette

If the surrounds are distracting you and you hear them too much they are probably too close. If they sound like you're in a ditch, they're too high. If they are barely audible, they're either too far, too low, or pointing in the wrong direction.

Nicely said