Absolute Phase Bangalore

[murali]

Maybe I am in a minority here but I insist a Home Demo is the only way.
You may still not buy the 'best' you can for the money but you are minimising the chances of going wrong.
You do test drive the car before you buy???I cant really answer Mr Muralis comment on arranged marriages!!

Its not that i walk in to a dealership & tell him to send me say 5 pairs of speakers!!!!! I go there are listen to a few on my shortlist. Then try & narrow it down. Finally when I am left with what I think is the best option for me I request for that to be sent home. If i damage it , I buy it!!! As i said earlier one can be decent by offering to get it collected & dropped off at ones own cost.

Your room is 50 % of the battle. Good equipment is good equipment agreed, but just maybe something else in that bracket CAN sound better with the rest of your chain in YOUR ROOM so why not???

In the west you can almost always try things for a longer period (after paying for it in full) which I think is the best way and I would be happy to pay for it here too if that makes the vendor comfortable (or as Neo says that there may be a lack of trust and him having my money takes out the trust factor!!) Dont like it for whatever reason, return it & get back your money.

Anyway most vendors in bbay offer this service, at least the ones I am in touch with surely do. In fact I know of some dealers / distributors who are not from bbay who send stuff to audition at their cost. Many names come to my mind & some are even here on the forum but its best to keep this general. Very recently a particular power conditioner was being highly recommended by TAS, stereophile & tone. Now this conditioner is not distributed in bbay & costs about 3L. We (four of us in total) requested the distri(first time I spoke to the man ) to send us one unit to audition which he did & now he has made 5 sales. When one hears what a product can do for you, how much it lifts the performance of your rig one is a happy buyer.
Rgds

Just out of curiosity, can you please name at least a single item you had bought only after doing a "home demo"? Car, Fridge, washing machine, TV, laptop, watch, furniture, trousers, shirts, shoes..., even underwears??? If there is at least one, I support your stand, if not, why the exception for audio equipment???
Hope you have not forgotten that the minute an equipment is taken out of its original packing and used for a demo, either at home or at the shop, it has lost at least 20-30% of its value and becomes a "demo" equipment. The best dealers I have seen (none in India) keep several demo items to show the public, and though they have lost their "original" value, the are compensated by the manufacturers with discounts for maintaining the high inventory. My limited experience with Indian dealers is that most of them ask for 100% advance payment for placing the order and getting the equipment for you!!! I had bought all my expensive equipment from abroad only, at least having listended to them before writing the cheque, and will certainly continue to do so unless changes are seen "here". Of course, I still don't go for the home-demo requirement, but need to hear it somewhere.

Back to the silent days,
cheers.
murali

 

[bbr_shr]

Home Demo is the best demo. Some members are unaware of home demos of cars, water purifiers, vaccum cleaners etc. Even in arranged marriages people demo each other for hundred of hours at home and outside home before actually getting married.

 

[hydra]

I think a home demo is not really important for things like cars or home appliances or computers or clothes.

We do test drive cars in the environment they are to perform -- the road. We don't really need to home-demo them because we don't use them at home.

As far as home appliances are concerned, they don't really interact with the room they are placed in in such a way as to affect their primary function. It is the same for computers and such gadgets.

As for clothes and watches, we do try them out before buying, don't we? They are meant to be worn on our bodies, and we do try them out in the environment they are meant to be used in -- on our bodies.

In the case of speakers (particularly) and in the case of other kit (amps/cd players etc.), the way they sound and give satisfaction depends a lot on the actual room they are used in, and the rest of the equipment they are used with. So, if we want to get the best out of what we're buying, in the environment they are intended to be used in, and the equipment they are meant to be used with, I do think a home demo is essential.

Let me also state that I haven't taken a home demo of any of the equipment (for music) that I've bought -- simply because the option to do so did not exist. In fact, I've not even had the opportunity of doing a dealer demo of any of the kit I've bought: I bought them blind. But I have been lucky, probably because I have a forgiving room, and probably because I firmly believe that the room matters more than the equipment, and getting the room to interact right with the kit is 90% of the battle. So it does help a lot, if I can buy kit that (mostly) works with the room out of the box.

 

[santhosh]

I think Home Demos are great as it helps make a decision based on how well the new component integrates with rest of the chain. I try requesting for a home demo before buying or finalising a component. Having said that, I also understand that it may be difficult for dealers to give home demos.

I have never met the dealer mentioned by OP though I have had very good experience with two dealers - Sridhar (odyssey) of ARN Systems and Jochen Semler of The Listening Room who have both let me borrow stuff for listening in my system.

Let me share the other side to borrowing stuff for home demo....

Recently, I requested Sridhar of ARN Systems for a Leben CS-600 for trying out with my Altec A7s which he kindly obliged. There were some change in my evening plans that day and I had to attend a dinner after taking delivery of the amp. I was so damn worried about leaving such an expensive amp (~3lakhs MRP) in the car and even tipped the security guard in advance to take care of my car. Even after taking it home, I was extremely careful and protected it from my son. If I can feel this way, it is only fair for the dealers to worry about offering a Home Demo.

 

[bhagwan]

Just out of curiosity, can you please name at least a single item you had bought only after doing a "home demo"? Car, Fridge, washing machine, TV, laptop, watch, furniture, trousers, shirts, shoes..., even underwears??? If there is at least one, I support your stand, if not, why the exception for audio equipment???
murali

Respected Sir,

I just know 1 small think;
The performance of 'Car, Fridge, washing machine, TV, laptop, watch, furniture, trousers, shirts, shoes..., even underwears' does not alter in the shop & the house. It is not environment dependent - except in the case of a car.

However, the biggest issue is that none of the products you talked about have a 50 to 70 % margin kept for the dealer & distributor.
That margin is kept for 2 reasons :-
Demo in Store & Demo @ Home [A]
Buy back of Old Audio Gear

Therefore, I state - demo in store & at home is a 'must' !!

 

[dinyaar]

Just out of curiosity, can you please name at least a single item you had bought only after doing a "home demo"? Car, Fridge, washing machine, TV, laptop, watch, furniture, trousers, shirts, shoes..., even underwears??? If there is at least one, I support your stand, if not, why the exception for audio equipment???
Hope you have not forgotten that the minute an equipment is taken out of its original packing and used for a demo, either at home or at the shop, it has lost at least 20-30% of its value and becomes a "demo" equipment. The best dealers I have seen (none in India) keep several demo items to show the public, and though they have lost their "original" value, the are compensated by the manufacturers with discounts for maintaining the high inventory. My limited experience with Indian dealers is that most of them ask for 100% advance payment for placing the order and getting the equipment for you!!! I had bought all my expensive equipment from abroad only, at least having listended to them before writing the cheque, and will certainly continue to do so unless changes are seen "here". Of course, I still don't go for the home-demo requirement, but need to hear it somewhere.

Back to the silent days,
cheers.
murali

Hello Mr Murali
I find your comments and the comparisons rarther amusing.
Car, I drive on a public road NOT IN MY HOME and so I test drive it such. Must add that I had requested Honda that apart from the test drive of the Accord in 2006 I would like to check if the big vehicle FITS IN MY GARAGE which they agreed & After that I bought it.
Fridge, Washing machines are not really that room sensitive are they??? Does the performance of the unit change with every change of location???Same applies to laptops!!!!
REgarding an LCD TV. I needed one a while ago & went to the SONY dealer in my area and was not sure whether to go for a 40' or 46'. Since the guy saw my anxiety HE SUGGESTED he send both with his staff. They held it on my wall and when I was convinved that 46' looks a bit too large I opted for the 40". There in a huge ( 600 SFT plus) showroom the 46 didnt overwhelm but in my room it looks a mismatch VISUALLY
Dont know about you but I always try on trousers, shirts, watches etc to see how it FITS ME. An armani jacket is an armani jacket so its off a certain quality BUT IT MAY NOT LOOK GOOD ON ME as it may be a slim fit & that may not suit me.
Point is we are all different, our tastes are different, OUR ROOMS ARE UNIQUE so why not try if the option is available.

Regarding demo gear & the depreciation, Well bhagwan has answered it all. You know the margins in HIFI, dont you??? You know that when a distribution chain is set up the Co in most cases offers the distributor an 'introductory' price FOR GEAR TO BE USED FOR DEMOS.

I am not here to ruffle feathers of dealers/ distributors or Forum members who differ but rather strongly suggest to all HIFI purchasers that a HOME DEMO IS THE BEST WAY. As Bhagwan said YOU WANT THE GEAR TO COMPLEMENT YOUR ROOM NOT WORK AGAINST IT!!!!!
We are all so particular to match cables to our gear, match an amp with the speakers, match a source to the rest of our chain BUT WILL NOT BOTHER ABOUT HOW THIS ENTIRE RIG WILL SOUND IN A ROOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rather will hear it in a treated room, with unfamiliar cables, conditioning & some times even unfamiliar gear at a vendors!!!!! OR worse still base your selections entirely on the ears of other people!!!! ( reviews etc)

I dont like to gamble so I CHOOSE A HOME DEMO

Rgds

 

[coaltrain]

my $.02

- i'm all for home demos. if i can't demo it at home, i don't buy. i can't afford expensive mistakes.

- i've bought speakers from AP, and had a demo pair at home for a week before buying. i guess i was lucky that a well run-in demo piece was available for home trial. my experience with them was pretty good.

- i believe the dealer should have the good sense to spot genuine buyers, and respond accordingly. from what little info i've gleaned from hfv, people like dinyaar and shanthi are serious enthusiasts who have spent large sums on their systems. denying them a home demo would be pretty dumb.

- while my kit is nowhere comparable to theirs, i've been lucky to find dealers who understand i'm serious about hifi. for such dealers, i'm not a one time customer, but someone who can provide future business as well.

- on the flip side, i'm sure there are lots of hifi aficionados who would love to try out expensive gear at home for a week, with no intention of buying. the dealer should attempt to find out who he's dealing with.

- regarding pricing: the speakers i bought from AP were very well priced. the speaker cable i wanted was not. so i bought the cables from london. if you don't like someone's pricing, vote with your wallet.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

Just out of curiosity, can you please name at least a single item you had bought only after doing a "home demo"? Car, Fridge, washing machine, TV, laptop, watch, furniture, trousers, shirts, shoes..., even underwears??? If there is at least one, I support your stand, if not, why the exception for audio equipment???

I think a home demo is not really important for things like cars or home appliances or computers or clothes.

... ... ...

Let me also state that I haven't taken a home demo of any of the equipment (for music) that I've bought -- simply because the option to do so did not exist.

For home equipment and gadgets it could be nice, but, simply it has never been the custom, so it has never been done. It is true that a washing machine, for instance, is going to wash your clothes and a microwave is going to heat your food. Both will do their jobs more or less well, and with more or less ease. How they implement their functionality can be anything from easy to live with to damned annoying. One of my buying tactics is to try to read the manual (downloaded, or even in the shop) before buying. Manuals tend to lie less often than sales material!

Choose a speaker that works with your room & not against your room.
Not too Big / Not too small.
Should not over power nor under play in your room...

Can I suggest a different form of words? Choose a speaker that you can live with. Size and appearance is genuinely a part of that (and your family has to live with it too) but sound that we can live with is not necessarily the sound that seems best in the shop.

Probably auditioning experience helps, but for those of us who do not audition often, I think it is easy to be taken in by either a bright sound, or maybe an over-heavy sound, according to our tastes --- and be tired of it in a few days at home.

From our shopping list of comparisons, cars come closest. A one-hour test drive is just not enough to realise the things that a particular car has, or has not, or how the seats will feel after a day of driving, etc, etc, especially as the sales person is trying hard to influence us.

But, of course, if the option of home trial is not there --- then it is not there, which rather ends the story!

Richer Sounds, UK, returns:

To return your purchase to Richer Sounds Internet

We will happily accept the return of your online purchase under the following circumstances.

1. Goods, other than faulty goods, may be returned within 7 working days of the date of receipt by you of the goods.

It's not exactly a home demo system, and I don't think they would be happy about it being used that way, but if you buy something you really don't like, you are not stuck with having wasted your money. This is a big mass box-shifting company. Of course, that makes it easier for them to absorb the cost of a few sales that go wrong, but still, it's customer care, which counts.

 

[maxcoutinho]

Example 1
You want to buy a watch... it costs 10K....You see a watch...You like it...you buy it...simple.

Example 2
Now you want to buy another watch...this one too costs 10k ....you see it you like it...but this one has a strap which is not adjustable and has only one fixed setting... Will you buy it without trying it on your wrist.

Just as you cannot change your wrist to suit your watch, you cannot change your room ( although some may ) to suit an audio component.

BottomLine.... HOME DEMO

 

[Staxxx]

Honestly, after living abroad in the US and Europe for over 25 years, as a die-hard audiophile, I can definitely say that there has rarely if ever been a set up at a dealer's place that has come remotely close to a good set up at home. There is so much you can and need to work with in making your audio equipment give its best.
That saying, I agree with Murali, I have bought many high-end items without home demonstrations, which in many cases are impractical and downright impossible and have rarely ever been disappointed. I also concur that there are no absolutes in this hobby and one man's scotch is another man's poison!

 

[murali]

Example 1
You want to buy a watch... it costs 10K....You see a watch...You like it...you buy it...simple.

Example 2
Now you want to buy another watch...this one too costs 10k ....you see it you like it...but this one has a strap which is not adjustable and has only one fixed setting... Will you buy it without trying it on your wrist.

Just as you cannot change your wrist to suit your watch, you cannot change your room ( although some may ) to suit an audio component.

BottomLine.... HOME DEMO

This is where this hobby gets most interesting. Like one cannot change the room, one also cannot change the basic characteristics of an equipment irrespective of where it plays. A room's characteristics can be changed to some extent by acoustic treatment and other means. The equipment's characteristics can be changed by various other techniques, like playing around with different cables, footers, equipment support, tubes, and several others.
I presume you are looking to buy the watch and not the strap. Whether the strap fits your wrist can be judged in the shop itself and you need not wear it at home to find it out. If you are genuinely convinced about the watch and the strap does not fit, buy the watch with another strap, and that is where you start experimenting with different straps.
Of course, it all depends, whether you are buying the watch for its quality and performance, or as a show-piece.
Even loudspeakers, which many feel should be demonstrated at home, do not sound the same when mated with different equipment, moved a little here and there, even when the room starts getting filled with newer things. There is nothing absolute one will prove by a home demo. Most of us keep changing our equipment now and then.
I am not at all against the idea of home demo, nor am I a dealer. My experience is that as long as you do your homework properly before buying, talk to others who own such equipment, I have survived. I do understand the need for a real home demo if one is considering buying an equipment costing a few lakhs, but for a few thousands, I wonder which dealer takes all the pains to bring it to your home and let you run it for a few days. Even in USA, the biggest market of high-end audio, that is the fact of life. Of course, then there are dealers with whom you are doing regular business and they will be too happy to arrange a home demo for you. But for a one-time buyer, involving a low or moderate outlay, come on, you can forget it.

cheers.
murali

 

[bhagwan]

Like one cannot change the room, one also cannot change the basic characteristics of an equipment irrespective of where it plays

Sir,
If I could give an extreme example - 1 pair of speaker - played in the Hall & played in the Bedroom & played in the Bathroom will sound very different. Even if the CD Player & Amplifier is the same;; Why is that ?
The environment where a product is played affects its final outcome....
So I have experienced.

Therefore a product in the D & D's demo room [if it is treated] will sound in a particular manner vis a vis what it will play like in your house....

Even in USA, the biggest market of high-end audio, that is the fact of life. Of course, then there are dealers with whom you are doing regular business and they will be too happy to arrange a home demo for you.

In USA - Home demo is the order of the day - if you are serious in your purchase & commit to purchase A / B /C from the D & D - he will get gear to your place & let you listen to it, before you decide. That is why he gets a 50 % margin on the product....
Why else would a manufacturer offer such margins to any D & D ?
Do consider;

 

[srinisundar]

In USA - Home demo is the order of the day - if you are serious in your purchase & commit to purchase A / B /C from the D & D - he will get gear to your place & let you listen to it, before you decide. That is why he gets a 50 % margin on the product....
Why else would a manufacturer offer such margins to any D & D ?
Do consider;

here in india they make 100% profit without giving home demo What we shoud think about/ rate about ????How cruel-some OR just don't care whether you buy or not OR they care about who don't want demo OR just want to go with buyers with hands-on review

End of the day still market grows, it is funny and the concept never change of not allowing home demo...

 

[anm]

here in india they make 100% profit without giving home demo What we shoud think about/ rate about ????How cruel-some OR just don't care whether you buy or not OR they care about who don't want demo OR just want to go with buyers with hands-on review

End of the day still market grows, it is funny and the concept never change of not allowing home demo...

true about home auditions. Denny of Bass and Treble refused a home demo for the thiels. Even when I offered pick and drop by my car (so no extra expense for him). I offered to pick him/ his person and speakers early in the day, spend a couple of hours with his person present, and drop him back. To be fair to him, I agree that the speakers were on a special deal, and he may not have made much money on them. Also, he gave me ample time/ iterations to go to his showroom and audition as many time, and as long a duration I wanted.
In the end, it was a guess work on how would they sound in my room. It turned out fine in the end. However, they are moved back and covered with silken cloth, waiting for the tweeter to be fixed Meanwhile my faithful JBLs are doing the backup duty.

 

[Asit]

In USA - Home demo is the order of the day

No, sir, that is not correct. I have lived in the US for close to 10 years, and that is far from the truth. Very similar also in Europe, as I have lived there also for more than 4 years. The situation has not changed from the days I lived in those countries, because I keep visiting on a yearly basis. It's true that some dealers will offer that, but in general they do not. I had the opportunity to audition hundreds of systems at showrooms and at people's homes in those countries, and home auditioning is rarely done. But they are very particular about service, if anything goes wrong. Sometimes, with a particular customer (usually from the same city) whom the dealer has faith in, he may offer home audition. Usually there are return options with a bit of restocking fee, or even exchange. However, with stuff like TT cartridges, I do not think they entertain the customer very much with return options, unless the customer can prove there was some manufacturing defect.

Here in India, I bought a Leben tube amp without any auditioning, but some of you may be aware of the work put in before taking that decision. I paid the money in full, but the dealer gave me the option of returning it (with full money back minus the return shipping) within a stipulated period of time if I did not like it for whatever reason (of course, the main worry here was, how well a 12 wpc amp could drive my speakers, and this could not be determined unless I tried the amp at home even though my speakers have 93.4 db/m/W sensitivity).

I have been given (by Kolkata dealer SKS Traders) an IC for trying out at home. The IC was not the cheapest (more than INR 20K), and I returned it after trying at home for a couple of weeks, because the ICs I use mostly were far better than this one. I have received some other stuff like TT mat, isolation material for home demo from some dealer. But then I have been very known to these dealers and there is a trust involved here developed over a period of time.

Sure, the home auditioning is the most ideal thing. Room environment is important. But at the same time, knowing fully the characteristics of the room (because it's my room and I have played systems there before), if proper research is done about the product to be purchased, the room cannot play such a huge role as described here in this thread even if I am an audiophile who is fussy to the core.

With the volumes as they are in India especially with niche products, it is virtually impossible to offer home demo in India (because it may lead to various complications for the dealers), unless the dealer knows the customer very well and the customer regularly upgrades so that the dealer's interest is there to sell something eventually.

Well, the upshot is that the customer has to be careful enough to protect his own interest. One thing I have learned over the last 30 years or so in this hobby is that, never buy anything without 'proper' research, and never buy anything in a haste. One usually always comes to the correct decision if the above is followed. I am forced to this situation in a natural way, because being a scientist I always work with very little disposable money, and am only looking to buy my money's worth.

Regards.

 

[bhagwan]

No, sir, that is not correct.
Regards.

Sir,

I shall retract my statement;
You are definately correct, since you have lived in USA & I have not & therefore your knowledge on the matter supersedes mine. I will accept what you have to say.

However, I would like to add, that I have personally sent to many persons in India - System Audio Sub Woofer [2 Times] - Bow Technologies ZZ One - Cochin & Hyderabad - Allnic Audio [New Delhi] - Meridian 808i.2 [Jaipur] for audition. The List on 2,000/- US $'s ++ Cables is endless.

There are other products that I have sent for demo - that have been purchased [not mentioned here], these are products that I sent & were returned back to me - unsold. Just demo was offered....
So, I have always sent audio gear for demo & am 100 % of the opinion that Hi End Audio gear should be sold with a DEMO & no other way;

Also, in 1 room - same audio gear [source + amplification + speakers] placed differently will sound so different - have you not noticed ? Move your speaker front & back [Just a few inches] & then move it wider & bring them closer [just a few inches] & the difference is night & day [to my ears at least] ....

I still say - audio gear must be sold by :-
Demo in Store - so that a product can be short listed - choose between many options.
Demo @ Home - so that a final product can be selected. See if it works for you...

 

[Asit]

Bhagwan Sir,

Your opinion is not necessarily different from mine. As I said in my previous post, room auditioning is the most ideal. But at the same time, I am not sure if the over-all logistics in India supports in general the arrangement of home-auditioning at all. I am not talking specifically about a person like you - in fact I think your case is very special, but generally I do not think I can expect the same benefits given to me, for example, by the same dealers, at least not initially.

Sure, the placement of speakers is very crucial as is the listening position. Obviously, it depends on a lot of factors like the off-axis behavior of the speakers, porting of the speakers, baffle design and perhaps a few other characteristics. It also matters whether you put your rack in the middle of the two speakers, or to one side. There are other factors too - what's there in the back wall, what's there in the front wall, as well as the distances from all walls. Some people even have non-parallel opposite walls (not just the front-back and side walls but also the floor and the ceiling) to reduce effects of standing waves in the room. All the above you know, so I do not want to elaborate any more.

My point is a little different - it's got to do with what's practicable, especially in India. Can the dealers, as a general rule, offer home demo to any prospective customers (whom they do not know at all), especially when these prospective buyers are from a different far-away city? In my previous post, I expressed my view saying that I did not think it was a feasible method. In the Western world even, this is not done generally to most customers, that is what I was saying.

But I am all for a home demo - but as I said I think this will not materialize.

I have no comments on the profit margins of the dealers - simply I have no way to know. All I can guess is that the materials cost combined for a particular product is about one-fifth to one-tenth of the cost it is sold to customers, for most of the products. For example, last weekend I had the opportunity of hearing a DIY speakers made of Scanspeak drivers in a 2 way design. The person (never a member of HFV, but a frequenter of a few DIY forums) spent comfortably less than a lakh on the parts, but spent two years researching drivers and crossover-designs, but I think these are comparable to at least 3L price range speakers. Of course, an established brand will factor in the costs regarding R&D etc. Anyway, since I do not know the commercial side of things very well, it is better I do not make any comment on that.

Regards.

 

[GeorgeO]

Good thoughtful posts Asit.

 

[ranjeetrain]

I have lived in the USA (just in case it matters), and I know that I can return the item within the specified time (usually 14-days). I didn't buy high-end hifi so I never got around to discuss this with the dealers, but I am sure they will entertain the home demo request if I insisted (and came across as a genuine buyer to him).

I know how this hurts the dealer. Anything which is not already on display, if returned causes him some loss. I know because I bought many entry level stuff at substantial discount just because they were "open-box" items. That might explain why some dealers have a provision for "restocking fee".

USA consumer market is way more mature than India. In India it can still be called in infancy stage whereas maturity level is concerned.

In USA, typically, Hifi wholesale rate is 40-50% less than the MRP. So dealers often sell it with a significant discount on MRP. In India, after duty and freight, the wholesale price should work out to be 80% (or less than) the USA MRP. Typical hifi rate in India is 130-150-200% of USA MRP. So the margin is thicker in India. It is understandable that the sale volumes are low in India, but then rentals are higher in USA. So all things compared, Indian dealers don't make any less profit compared to their US counterparts, except on volume may be.

Still, in India, dealers would not agree to/hesitate for a home demo (unless you happen to be friends or enjoy a super rapport). I think the reason also lies in the fact that Indians are bigger abusers of any given facility (no offense to anyone, this is just an observation, and applies to me equally as I am myself a 100% Indian).

All things said, Indian dealers have no reason not to be open to home demo, except for where they might be subject to misuse/abuse of such arrangement.

 

[thatguy]

I just went to five audio equipment dealers/manufacturers (in US/Europe) and checked their return policies.

Return Policy

Music Direct offers a 30-day money back guarantee on most equipment/accessories (excluding fluids, pastes, aerosols, special order items, and close-out items, none of which are returnable).

We'll require an explanation for the return (defective, damaged, etc). Don't be surprised if we ask you some pretty detailed questions about the reason for your return. Hearing first hand what our customers are experiencing will enable us to provide you with the best possible service.

Shipping and Returns

We want you to enjoy the items you purchase from Crutchfield. If you are not satisfied with your purchase, you may return items that are complete and like new for any reason within 60 days.

You may choose an exchange or a refund for the full amount of the items you purchased.
Refunds must be issued to the same credit card, debit card, gift certificate, or other form of payment used in the original transaction.
The money-back guarantee does not apply to prepaid installations, and navigation map upgrades once the installation or map upgrade has been performed.

Richer Sounds - The UK's Hi-Fi, Home Cinema & Flat Panel TV Specialists!

Goods, other than faulty goods, may be returned within 7 working days of the date of receipt by you of the goods.

Return Option : High end audio cables | Audiophile cables | High end speaker cables by LessLoss

To encourage you to try LessLoss products in the comfort and context of your own home, we offer a 30-day money-back guarantee on all purchases of our products (except our DAC).

JansZen Electrostatic Speakers

30 Day Satisfaction Guarantee on direct sales

I am quite certain I could dig up as many as I want to. Shouldn't a generous return policy be considered same as a home demo?