Advice required on enhancing music experience

ash147

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Hello All

I'm a newbie on this forum,just joined and would like some of the best brains around in the audio industry ( all you guys ), to provide me a suggestion.
I'm from Thane,Mumbai's neighbour next door.I bought an Onkyo 5.1 Channel HTS,model HTR 340, two years ago.This came as a package, an amplifier,with a sub-woofer , two front & rear side speakers and one center speaker.I have attached all the speakers except for the sub-woofer attached on the respective walls of my room.The major issue with the system is :

I had expected a very rich sound experience,a lively kind of an openness in sound in the music,which is not at all present.I find the sound as subdued one.

This is how I have attached the system

1. All the wall mounted speakers have been attached on to the wall directly with a nail minus the wall brackets.Is it necessary to attach the speakers with a wall bracket ?

2. The cabling has been done by a local electrician using a single pair wire used for electrical connections.Is it necessary to get the wiring done by some sound expert and what kind of wiring to be used for an enhanced sound experience?

3. The speakers have been placed at a height, approx 7 feet from the floor.

4. Pls suggest can an extra pair of front tower speakers be attached along with the existing speakers ? Will it enhance the sound quality ? If yes then which brand of tower speakers will be good ?
My budget is between Rs. 12K to 17K.

Normally I watch movies using this HTS but would love to listen to audio CDs also if I get the desired sound output.

Request you all to kindly suggest / enhancements to my existing setup within my budget so that I can enjoy listening to music.

Thanks in advance and hope to hear from you soon.
 

psychotropic

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Before the experts weigh in with their more detailed advice, let me put down my 2 cents:

Firstly, an HTIB, particularly an Onkyo one is not going to be a "rich sound experience" mostly because Onkyo's speakers (especialy the plastic satellites) are of very poor quality. The HTR 340 I believe is a variant of the 304 receiver which is not a bad amplifier to have.

Your path to a "rich sound experience" will involve replacing speakers. Floorstanding speakers are not necessary and a floorstander of a particular level of quality will be a lot more expensive than a standmount of a similar level of quality, and since you're moving up from Onkyo's plastic satellites, the standmounts should be sufficient to blow you away even in terms of low frequency response.

The first step would be to replace the front left and right speakers with a pair of good bookshelves such as the Wharfedale Diamond 9.1s, 9.2s or the new 10.1s, or the PSB Alpha B1s (all under Rs. 15k a pair, and should be capable of being drive reasonably [but not well] by your Onkyo AVR).

This should immediately give you a far superior sound, especially for music. Slowly you can think of swapping out your rears for a pair of similar speakers, and then changing the center, and finally changing the sub (it's not that the sub is not important, it is very, but it'll be the most expensive component to change).

But right now as a quickfix measure within your budget a pair of standmounts is the answer, you can pick up a good pair of stands for about 5k sometime later to get the best out of these speakers also.


Hello All

I'm a newbie on this forum,just joined and would like some of the best brains around in the audio industry ( all you guys ), to provide me a suggestion.
I'm from Thane,Mumbai's neighbour next door.I bought an Onkyo 5.1 Channel HTS,model HTR 340, two years ago.This came as a package, an amplifier,with a sub-woofer , two front & rear side speakers and one center speaker.I have attached all the speakers except for the sub-woofer attached on the respective walls of my room.The major issue with the system is :

I had expected a very rich sound experience,a lively kind of an openness in sound in the music,which is not at all present.I find the sound as subdued one.

This is how I have attached the system

1. All the wall mounted speakers have been attached on to the wall directly with a nail minus the wall brackets.Is it necessary to attach the speakers with a wall bracket ?

2. The cabling has been done by a local electrician using a single pair wire used for electrical connections.Is it necessary to get the wiring done by some sound expert and what kind of wiring to be used for an enhanced sound experience?

3. The speakers have been placed at a height, approx 7 feet from the floor.

4. Pls suggest can an extra pair of front tower speakers be attached along with the existing speakers ? Will it enhance the sound quality ? If yes then which brand of tower speakers will be good ?
My budget is between Rs. 12K to 17K.

Normally I watch movies using this HTS but would love to listen to audio CDs also if I get the desired sound output.

Request you all to kindly suggest / enhancements to my existing setup within my budget so that I can enjoy listening to music.

Thanks in advance and hope to hear from you soon.
 

moserw

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Depends...
Well for starters the Onkyo 3100 you've bought is an entry level HT unit and does a decent job for movies with Dolby Digital and DTS. Asking it to sing though is another thing and no matter what it's not going to sound great.

The best option will be to up the budget or wait till you have an increased budget and then go for a separate stereo rig. If you have a decent to good PC then its going to be better sounding and less of a cost too than assembling a stereo amp unit.
 

anm

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quick question - was it rich sounding (in your personal opinion) when you demoed it at the dealer's place?

regards
 

hemantwaghe

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WwHICH DVD PLAYER U R USING?
HAVE YOU TESTED THIS SETUP WITH ORIGNAL DOLBY DIGITAL DVD?
HOW YOUR DVD PLAYER IS CONNECTED TO RECEIVER - BY SINGLE WIRE DIGITAL CONNECTION? OR OPTICAL ONE/ OR JUST 2 WIRES CONNECTED?

Pls answer asap so that we can gauge...
 

marsilians

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quick question - was it rich sounding (in your personal opinion) when you demoed it at the dealer's place?

regards

Excellent question! Contentment is a psychological thing as much as being driven by your components. If you have never felt but wish for experiencing an enhanced music experience, then you will get a different set of recommendations than if you had felt before. Pls. clarify this for us ash147
 

ash147

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Hello All
First of all let me thank all of you for taking ur time out to reply me.Thanks to psychotropic, moserw, anm, hemantwaghe, marsilians for your quick and very informative replies.

Anm : Frankly speaking I did not judge the sound quality @ the delear's place minutely.I had bought the system during Diwali offers and since price offered was low for a Onkyo system I bit the bate.The delear showed me a demo movie DVD with the sound on a high volume & that to in a 8 feet X 8 feet closed room.I listened to the music CDs very carefully long after I bought the system.

Hemantwaghe : Am using a Samsung DVD player and have connected it via an Optical cable to the amp.

marsilians : As far as experiencing an enhanced music experience goes I have heard one playing at one of the reliance webworld outlets which has a Javagreen counter,then other at an Mc Donald's outlet and a few during a demo at Bose Store.The audio quality is so rich even at low volume that you feel totally mesmerised.That's the quality am looking out for.

Dear all pls let me know is the way I have the speakers connected like with normal wires and without the wall brackets is fault? Does it make any any difference in the sound output if I use audio cabling wires and wall mounts for speakers ? The dealer wants me to connect the speaker thru some hi end audio cable wires.

Any suggestions
 

marsilians

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This is how I have attached the system

1. All the wall mounted speakers have been attached on to the wall directly with a nail minus the wall brackets.Is it necessary to attach the speakers with a wall bracket ?

What brand speakers do you have?

Its preferable to use the wall brackets so you prevent vibration or potential damage to the speakers if they fall off. Also the brackets help in orienting the speakers up down or sideways.

2. The cabling has been done by a local electrician using a single pair wire used for electrical connections.Is it necessary to get the wiring done by some sound expert and what kind of wiring to be used for an enhanced sound experience?

I am not sure what you mean by a wire used for electrical connections. YOu should be using the right (not necessarily expensive) speaker cables to connect to the receiver. A 16 gauge (AWG) copper wire is good for most cases. Search around the forum for the brands of cable that will foot the bill.

3. The speakers have been placed at a height, approx 7 feet from the floor.

Should be fine if they are angled at the seating position to form a rough equilateral or isoceles triangle.

4. Pls suggest can an extra pair of front tower speakers be attached along with the existing speakers ? Will it enhance the sound quality ? If yes then which brand of tower speakers will be good ?
My budget is between Rs. 12K to 17K.


It might, but you should look into this option if adjusting the speakers and your setup does absolutely nothing. So hold onto the money for now.

Normally I watch movies using this HTS but would love to listen to audio CDs also if I get the desired sound output.

Are you happy with the movie output? ALso, wha type of music you listen to?

Bottom line is you should have some improvements wiht the proper setup, but don't expect magic with the setup.

Also listening to music in showrooms si very misleading since the environment is more conducive than a house where there is a lot of external noise and the the reflections are just not the same as in a demo room.
 

spirovious

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Hi ash147,

I m using Onk330 for music & mov.I got same feeling when I brought the system.I did RND with cables & used 16awg OFC cables which improved clearity is sound.

Then I changed spks & using Tannoy F1 & centre.Soundstage has improved by 40% ,but still a stereo amp is the correct option for CD listening.

In your case ,you have placed spk above the level of ears,so naturally sound can not be accurate.Htib comes with OREQ setting which is good for music.
Try good cables,setting & speakers ,lastly add stereo amp if not satisfied.

Cheers...
 

anm

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I have the same htib and the speakers are the weakest link. The amp is not that bad. A decent pair of bookshelfs can replace the front speakers and you can get a decent stereo experience.
You may replace the cables, but do not spend more than 1k. It should be ok to change only for left/ right and subwoofer to start with. A braided cable may be better than the one that looks like 8. More people here can advice on the same.

When I connected a different pair of speakers, the change in quality was audibly better.
Subwoofer is another weak link imo. So maybe you can listen to the music without the sub, or later add a sub when you have more money to spare. Or if you have to choose between two while budget is limited, buy a stereo amp instead of sub.
 

psychotropic

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with speakers of that quality, cables will make little or no difference, and will really be a waste of money. And whether it is mounted on the wall with a nail or a bracket also will not make that much of a difference either. To get the difference that you're looking for, you'll have to change the speakers. The Wharfedale Diamond 9.1s come for Rs 11k, spend 5k on a pair of decent stands (you can even do the stands later), and you'll definitely get a much better sound, especially for music.

Hello All
First of all let me thank all of you for taking ur time out to reply me.Thanks to psychotropic, moserw, anm, hemantwaghe, marsilians for your quick and very informative replies.

Anm : Frankly speaking I did not judge the sound quality @ the delear's place minutely.I had bought the system during Diwali offers and since price offered was low for a Onkyo system I bit the bate.The delear showed me a demo movie DVD with the sound on a high volume & that to in a 8 feet X 8 feet closed room.I listened to the music CDs very carefully long after I bought the system.

Hemantwaghe : Am using a Samsung DVD player and have connected it via an Optical cable to the amp.

marsilians : As far as experiencing an enhanced music experience goes I have heard one playing at one of the reliance webworld outlets which has a Javagreen counter,then other at an Mc Donald's outlet and a few during a demo at Bose Store.The audio quality is so rich even at low volume that you feel totally mesmerised.That's the quality am looking out for.

Dear all pls let me know is the way I have the speakers connected like with normal wires and without the wall brackets is fault? Does it make any any difference in the sound output if I use audio cabling wires and wall mounts for speakers ? The dealer wants me to connect the speaker thru some hi end audio cable wires.

Any suggestions
 

hemantwaghe

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First experement with existing hardware
1) Read manuals of DVD & HTIB
2) Connect Subwoofer
3) Speakers should be at ear hight esp front & center
4) Check plarity of speakrs ie + & - poperly connected
5) Find good referance DVd with DD 5.1
6) Try different settings
6) See if Data output of DVD to receiver is right ....and while playing DD & DTS content respective logoes displayed on scree
7) See if dolby pro logic is not permantly activated - it is psudo decoding and I saw instances where people listen DD or DTS content in Pro logic mode!!!

Do NOT test with Pirated DVD or MP3 music !

Do post your results

What is your location ? I can suggest some speaker dealers then...
 

ash147

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Hi ash147,

I m using Onk330 for music & mov.I got same feeling when I brought the system.I did RND with cables & used 16awg OFC cables which improved clearity is sound.

Then I changed spks & using Tannoy F1 & centre.Soundstage has improved by 40% ,but still a stereo amp is the correct option for CD listening.

In your case ,you have placed spk above the level of ears,so naturally sound can not be accurate.Htib comes with OREQ setting which is good for music.
Try good cables,setting & speakers ,lastly add stereo amp if not satisfied.

Cheers...


Now slowly things are becoming more clear to me.Thanks to this forum.Now my question is are bookshelf speakers a good option or floorstanding tower speakers.I just browsed thru Bose's website where they have displayed their bookshelf speakers 201 Series V Direct /Reflecting Speaker System @ Rs 12000 for a pair.The url : Bose 201 Series V Direct /Reflecting Speaker System.
Pls let me know are these speakers good and shall I go for them to be used as front speakers with my system?
 

Jith77

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at that price range...bookshelfs will be the only/better option...

as far as bo** goes, hifi forums bashes anyone saying that word:lol:...i havent demoed any bose, but the general opinion is that their pricing is too high for the sq they offer...so checking other brands is advised
 

skumar

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I just browsed thru Bose's website where they have displayed their bookshelf speakers 201 Series V Direct /Reflecting Speaker System @ Rs 12000 for a pair.
Pls let me know are these speakers good and shall I go for them to be used as front speakers with my system?

Though I do not have an opinion on the SQ of Bose speakers, I can say that they look sleek and their marketing is top notch. Say, you can audition the Bose V-201 and the Wharfedale 9.1/9.2 and see which one sounds better?
 

ash147

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First experement with existing hardware
1) Read manuals of DVD & HTIB
2) Connect Subwoofer
3) Speakers should be at ear hight esp front & center
4) Check plarity of speakrs ie + & - poperly connected
5) Find good referance DVd with DD 5.1
6) Try different settings
6) See if Data output of DVD to receiver is right ....and while playing DD & DTS content respective logoes displayed on scree
7) See if dolby pro logic is not permantly activated - it is psudo decoding and I saw instances where people listen DD or DTS content in Pro logic mode!!!

Do NOT test with Pirated DVD or MP3 music !

Do post your results

What is your location ? I can suggest some speaker dealers then...


Thanks for your advice.I'll surely follow it.I'm based in Thane near Mumbai.
 

hemantwaghe

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No BOSE please
I am from vashi- in case I'll PM you my number so that we can talk....
You have plenty of otions in mumbai ..some of them used too

My idea is first test the suggestions - especially I am finiky about wiring and speaker placement as I've seen sound degradation after wrong polarity and improper placement...

It is good u r using optical cable -I've seen people completlyunaware of DTS & DD and giving stereo output to AVR and then using Pro Logic to 5.1 sound

In case of 12-14 K speakrs you can have beginer range of wharfadale ,q acostics etc - this forum will uide you....

In fact you can just change cabling of just front 2 speakrs ( if you are chaging the speakers) and get desired effect....

Are ou open to idea of Used speakrs too....??
 

psychotropic

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Please don't waste your time with the Bose, for that same amount you can buy a pair of Wharfedale Diamond 9.1s.

Now slowly things are becoming more clear to me.Thanks to this forum.Now my question is are bookshelf speakers a good option or floorstanding tower speakers.I just browsed thru Bose's website where they have displayed their bookshelf speakers 201 Series V Direct /Reflecting Speaker System @ Rs 12000 for a pair.The url : Bose 201 Series V Direct /Reflecting Speaker System.
Pls let me know are these speakers good and shall I go for them to be used as front speakers with my system?
 

ash147

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No BOSE please
I am from vashi- in case I'll PM you my number so that we can talk....
You have plenty of otions in mumbai ..some of them used too

My idea is first test the suggestions - especially I am finiky about wiring and speaker placement as I've seen sound degradation after wrong polarity and improper placement...

It is good u r using optical cable -I've seen people completlyunaware of DTS & DD and giving stereo output to AVR and then using Pro Logic to 5.1 sound

In case of 12-14 K speakrs you can have beginer range of wharfadale ,q acostics etc - this forum will uide you....

In fact you can just change cabling of just front 2 speakrs ( if you are chaging the speakers) and get desired effect....

Are ou open to idea of Used speakrs too....??

Hi Hemant

Do u have any idea of a good speaker shop in Thane which stocks branded speakers ?

I don't mind checking out the used ones too.Should not be too old a model.
 

hemantwaghe

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Thane - try vijay sales - if they are carruying mission also croma
Mumbai will be better
There is seprate thread which gives you phone number of dealerrs -I'll try to find out for you..
 
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