Cadence vs Lyrita vs Rethm

[heinlein2302]

Guys, has anyone here listened to two or three of the above systems? I would love to know how they compare to each other.

I am sure all sound wonderful but I am interested to know what kind of music each sounds best with, what are the relative strengths and weaknesses of each, what is the price-value equation and how much extra does one get for shelling out the extra bucks etc.

Would really appreciate if I could get some inputs on this.

 

[captrajesh]

Ur question is vague. What are u looking for? They all manufacture amps, spkrs etc that are different to each other. Cadence & Rethm have gone global & reviewed by high end magazines but very expensive. Lyrita is VFM & serious stepping stone to Valve Amps & single driver speakers. BTW u left out a few others who are also in this biz

 

[heinlein2302]

Okay, let me make it more specific. I am looking to buy integrated amp and speakers.

So let's take two systems:

1. Lyrita 6C33C with Amity speakers
2. Cadence VA1 with Amaya speakers

Assume an identical source.

Now from whatever I read, it seems to me that the Lyrita is a very capable combination and Viren is a wonderful guy to deal with. My question is, what extra does the Cadence combination provide for more than 2x the price? If there is a difference, is it noticeable to an untrained ear like mine? In what kind of music is the difference most noticeable? Which combination is more forgiving if the source is less than ideal (say, internet radio)?

I listen to a wide variety of music, but first love is rock.

Based on the above, would it be possible to provide some inputs?

 

[venkatcr]

I listen to a wide variety of music, but first love is rock.

At the outset let me say that both Lyrita and Cadence make excellent equipment. The justification for price difference can only be confirmed by your own ears. When you are so intent on good music, it is imperative that you audition both equipment. The 10-15K you will spend on travelling is well worth the peace of mind.

More important, neither of these equipment will suit your first love. Though the bass will be tight, they will not create the kind of large and deep bass - if that is what you are looking for. Lyrita and Cadence is more suited for easy listening, wind instruments, orchestral numbers, jazz, voices, etc.

Cheers

 

[stevieboy]

Hi Heinlein,

You could also listen to Viren's new 845 SET amp. And listen to the single driver Harmony One speakers versus the Amity's and decide. I've heard Cadence gear and decided on Lyrita. Take a trip to Viren's since Delhi is close by and listen to hear the differences in his speakers and amps for yourself.

I listen to rock, blues, retro pop classics, classical, internet radio through the 2A3 SET amp (I use the 45 tube instead of the 2A3 tube, which puts out bout 1.5 watts compared to 3 watts of the 2A3 tube) and the Harmony One single driver speakers. Depending on your listening levels you might need the higher power of the 845 amp or be happy with the sound of the 2A3 SET. There has a been a recent thread Tube Sound I think, started by Ajay, it'll give you good pointers.

regards

edit: There's also a thread started by Heliumflight, the owner of the first 845 amp made by Viren and a thread on the 845 amp by Viren himself in the Press Release section

 

[heinlein2302]

Venkatcr, thanks for that input. I read on this site that Viren designed that combination specifically for rock lovers?

I guess you are right; I should go listen to both. Any other Indian products that you would recommend adding to my consideration set, given my preference for rock?

I don't need overpowering bass that will shake my guts. I prefer lesser good quality bass than more poor quality bass.

 

[heinlein2302]

I've heard Cadence gear and decided on Lyrita.

Hi Stevieboy, thanks a lot for that response. Will read all those recommended threads.

Since you auditioned both, I am very keen to know what made you go for the Lyrita. Can you please share your thought process on this?

 

[venkatcr]

Venkatcr, thanks for that input. I read on this site that Viren designed that combination specifically for rock lovers?

I guess you are right; I should go listen to both. Any other Indian products that you would recommend adding to my consideration set, given my preference for rock?

I don't need overpowering bass that will shake my guts. I prefer lesser good quality bass than more poor quality bass.

As they say, there is rock and then there is rock. If you are referring to Beatles, America, or what is called soft rock - yes, Lyrita/Cadence equipment will work well. If you are referring to Megaderth, then you have to look elsewhere.

In India, I can think of three companies that make good equipment - Lyrita, Cadence, and Audire. Audire makes 25 watts Class A amps and a large range of speakers. All these are very musical and wonderful to listen to.

Cheers

 

[stevieboy]

Hi Heinlein,

I found that Cadence speakers needed to be driven more to sound good. At lower volumes they were not so good. Perhaps cos of the cone material that required more power to move them, the Aritas specifically. I couldn't imagine listening at high volumes all the time. In contrast, the single drivers respond faster to even the slightest detail and it does not require much to move them, hence even low level listening sounds superb. Other than that, the amp sounded less involving to me. I'm not a fan of hybrid designs. The Lyrita amp sounds more involving. The Cadence to my ears created sounds that I could perhaps quantify as good/bad treble, bass etc, the Lyrita system forgot all that and simply created music which brought alive the band for me. On bad recordings the Lyrita also sounded far better, with the Cadence you were aware of recording quality, with the Lyrita the bad quality was evident but the music shone through over that. Quite a subjective thing I guess. For me, the coherence in sound a single driver brings far overshadows the frequency extreme gains of a traditional two/three way system. I still remember Blue Oyster Cult's 'Don't fear the reaper' that I played on the Cadence VA1 and Aritas, a not too good recording best of cd and with the Cadence gear it just didn't bring me any joy, with the Lyrita gear there's that hypnotic rhythmic driving plucking guitar that loops through chord changes and the soothing gentle reassuring tone yet sometimes urging in the singer's voice while he builds a case for why one should not fear the reaper. If you've heard the song I guess you'll know what I mean.

regards

 

[Dr.Bass]

As far as speakers are concerned and especially if you are looking at Amaya, there is no competition from any of the speakers you have listed here IMO. Amaya does amazing rock!!
I will not say the same for Avita or Arista though. The electrostatic panels are extremely fast and has some of the best midrange I have ever heard, combine this with an amazingly extended yet sweet high frequency all churned out of one panel, it is superb!! Yes, the integration of bass driver with the panel is not very seamless but they more than make it up by doing excellent in other areas. Again I would say, there is no competition.

The Rethm may fair better in some genres but all-rounders ? they are not, by a mile !!

The Cadence electrostats are very easy to drive as well.

I am not a big fan of the VA-1 though. They are nice but not for the price, again they are not all-rounders. They do the typical jazz, vocals stuff well but beyond that they are average.

 

[heinlein2302]

I am not a big fan of the VA-1 though.

Dr Bass, that's a very interesting input. I did notice that Stevieboy hadn't auditioned the hybrid speaker. Given that you didn't like the VA-1, what amplifier would you use with the Amaya?

 

[stevieboy]

Hi Heinlein,

I have heard the hybrid speakers

regards

 

[heinlein2302]

Hi Heinlein,

I have heard the hybrid speakers

regards

Oh, sorry.

You mentioned only the Arita so I thought you didn't want the hybrids and didn't audition them.

So, you didn't like the Amayas either? Same reasons? Do share your thoughts on Amaya vs Harmony please.

I have been reading many other posts by you and Venkatcr (including that wonderful review of Audire) and I find that my tastes and listening style is similar to yours (though narrower perhaps), so inputs from both of you would be very valuable to me.

 

[Dr.Bass]

Dr Bass, that's a very interesting input. I did notice that Stevieboy hadn't auditioned the hybrid speaker. Given that you didn't like the VA-1, what amplifier would you use with the Amaya?

Depends on your budget actually.


Another thing, I actually forgot to add in my previous post. Single driver speakers are extremely niche. It is not at all for everyone. Forget about everyone, it appeals to a very limited segment of audiophiles. The reasons are many. However I can only suggest you not to get carried away by anything but to listen to them and take a call. Either you like them or you dont, there is no middle ground in case of single driver speakers. You will not get confused

 

[venkatcr]

You will not get confused

Because, you are listening to only one driver?

Yes, Dr. Bass is correct. Since the time I have started listening to IO2s from Audire, I have been constantly been dragged back to them whenever I listen to even expensive multi driver speakers.

Sharath of Audire explained the rationale to me once. Let me see if I remember right, and explain it in layman terms.

Let us look at a stereo channel as a pipe carrying musical data. You add certain momentum to the data through amplification. The data is moving as a cohesive unit of frequencies that are close to each other physically. Suddenly when you reach the speakers, you separate the frequency data and through a crossover, and push them to the human ears through multiple drivers. The cohesiveness of the data is lost, and a sharp ear can identify time delays in the playback of the composition.

In a single driver speaker system, on the other hand, the cohesiveness is maintained throughout till the music reaches your ears. The time between the various voices and instruments is as tight as was originally recorded, and the musicality is kept under control.

Cheers

 

[prem]

Hi as others have said, listen to a single driver first. See if you like its presentation. I have owned a whole lot of speakers. PSB Strata, Cadence Avita, Amaya, Audio Artistry Beethoven, Martin Logan, Rethm Second, Rethm Saadhanas. All have a different presentation. Have not heard Lyrita or Audire. So cannot comment on them. The Rethm IMO is way superior to the Cadences. But they also cost much more.

 

[heinlein2302]

Guys,

All this is truly very helpful and thanks again. I shall definitely go and have a listen. Let's see if the single driver is for me. Hopefully I can try both one after the other (Harmony and Amity) and see which I like better.

I'll post my impressions here from a layman's point of view so other laymen can possibly benefit from it. And the rest of you can be amused.

I checked out the Audire website too. Those speakers look beautiful though from the descriptions I would guess they are way out of my league. It can't be cheap to have Japanese folk custom design materials for you...

Regards,

 

[prem]

The Lyritas are a good bet to get into single drivers and SEt amps.

 

[iaudio]

heinlein, Audire range starts from about 28k,40k,65k and goes up in steady increments to speakers costing lakhs. You must be talking about the Feastrex based ones, they start at 5 lakhs or so, iirc.

 

[heinlein2302]

heinlein, Audire range starts from about 28k,40k,65k and goes up in steady increments to speakers costing lakhs. You must be talking about the Feastrex based ones, they start at 5 lakhs or so, iirc.

Interesting. Well, I have a business trip to Coimbatore coming up so maybe I'll pay them a visit too.

BTW, Audire probably has the worst website of any high-end audio company in the world. If it wasn't for this forum, I would never give that company a second look. I understand that one of them is a professional filmmaker but really he should swallow his pride and get a professional website designer to redo that horrible thing.