Dacmagic
- Thread starter Adhiraj
- Start date
I second that.
Guys! With the new rDAC from Arcam, the game has already changed!
It has the new wolfson 8741 chipset, upsamples the new standard 32bit/192khz!
And its priced at about punds sterling - 400!
This is gonna KILL all debates along the CA Azur or Behringer for sure..... And it is supposed to give the Weiss etc a run for the penny as well!
It has the new wolfson 8741 chipset, upsamples the new standard 32bit/192khz!
And its priced at about punds sterling - 400!
This is gonna KILL all debates along the CA Azur or Behringer for sure..... And it is supposed to give the Weiss etc a run for the penny as well!
psychotropic
Well-Known Member
300 pounds man! 400 is with the wireless later in the year.
I read this in another site :
"I am astonished that anyone would try to rationalise a 32bit DAC. There is very little rational for using 32bit arithmetic in a DAC and if you tryed to achive a 32Bit output its just a numbers game.
24bits gives you a dynamic range of 144dB or a ratio from largest to smalllest of 15,848,931.92 thats more than 15 million times. Human hearing has a range of 120dB.
This means that if your DAC outputs 2V rms full scale then the least significant bit is 126 nano volts. This will be swamped by several orders of magnitude by noise in your power amplifer.
A perfect 1K resistor at 25 degC over a bandwidth of 20KHz generates a Johnson Thermal Noise of 548.9nV. (resistors are not perfect and actually generat lot more noise than this due to their terminations and vibration) most opamps won't drive much less than 1K so you can expect to see resistors of at least this size in the output stange. It would be uncommon for it not to use values of arround 10K which will be much more noisy. For this not to swamp your 24bit DACs output noise you would need to cool it with liquid nitrogen, however this would only work for the resistors and the semiconductors would all stop working.
The best I have ever seen out of a 24bit dac that should theortically have a 144dB dynamic range is 122dB, the rest is lost to noise.
A 32bit DACs least significant bit would be 465 pico Volts its thoretical range 192dB. It may use 32bit arithmatic and this may have some value (although only if you have a 24bit signal going in). However if it claims to have a 32bit output most of the bits are useless as this is never going to happen for a 2V output DAC. Don't fall for it!
The sound quality will all be down to the quality of the implementation of the digital filters and output stage. Other errors and effects will completely swamp the theoretical 32bits. "
esanthosh
Well-Known Member
In the specs, I find rDAC supporting up-to 24/192 for Coax, 24/96 for USB and 24/48 for Optical.
Similar is the case with Audio-GD DACs, most of which have been recently upgraded to WM8741, though their specs state support for 24/96 for USB and 24/192 for both Coax and Optical.
So, no 32-bit DACs for the time being?
psychotropic
Well-Known Member
bits apart, this sounds like an interesting product at an interesting price, and should be an interesting rival to the 230 GBP DacMagic. Would love to see more reviews and feedback. Hey malvai, where did you see it compared to a Weiss?
The DAC chip is 32 bits, but it does not change 16 or 24 bit to 32 bit. So please guys don't imagine more than there is taking place. The extra 8 bis are for DSD audio. Stereo audio is PCM, which so far has a maximum bit depth of 24.
The signal to noise ratio on the rDAC is only 104dB. So don't get confused with the DAC chip technical specs, and the DAC's ability.
The signal to noise ratio on the rDAC is only 104dB. So don't get confused with the DAC chip technical specs, and the DAC's ability.
ash147
Active Member
congrats adhiraj on ur new aquisition.hope u r njoying the music.after all these threads/reports on a DAC i've become interested in a DAC.previously i had planned to buy a 2 channel amp but after reading about DACs i've started having 2nd thoughts.at present i have a samsung DVD player bought @ Rs 2000, 2 yrs back and have connected to my Onkyo AVR.Pls tell me if i buy a DAC in between the DVD player and the AVR will my SQ improve or i should still think of putting my money in a 2 channel amp ? others on the forum can also put forth their views.
thanks
@Ash: I'd invest in a decent 2 channel amp FIRST. Or rather a good set of speakers + matching amp. Then build everything upwards - SLOWLY.
Most people go wrong in system matching and learn after spending pot loads of hard earned money.
Most people go wrong in system matching and learn after spending pot loads of hard earned money.
Hmm... my experience has been different, Adhiraj.
I have listened to a DACMagic on my setup and have not seen it as competition to the Behringer at all. And right now the Behringer is being used as an EQ and a DAC in my system.
Perception though is always subjective.
ash147
Active Member
Thanks malvai...as of now i have a pair of Mission floor standers M34i included in my setup and was thinking of adding norge amp b4 DACs stuck me..
The missions speakers are very good VFM at the entry level... Try out the Norge amps with them... might just work out for you! The save up for a decent DAC. If you wait a bit you might be able to get the new rDAC from ARCAM. Its supposed to be the best thing around if on a budget!
psychotropic
Well-Known Member
teh behringer does so many things that i don't think a behringer-dacmagic comparison is fair to either component.
currently i am auditioning a usb dac with tube buffer from a company called musica (the model is usb30..musica)..
i have paired it with amplifiers from the same folks ( musica int 30) and my audire callistoes...(both amp and dac provided by ARN and shipped by Cranky..the amp was initially auditioned by Gobble, with same speakers and cd player (6002) as mine)
i am liking it...too bad i cannot describe the sound as eloquently as the others..but as far as my ears were concerned they performed quite admirably with the chesky ultimate demonstration disc, lacking perhaps only a bit in the 'heft' department (the amp is only 20W/channel)..but focus, pace, rhythm and timing, detail retrieval etc were good...
i wanted to go the dac route because there is so much good and high quality music available for free on the net (don't really know for how long though..)
i have paired it with amplifiers from the same folks ( musica int 30) and my audire callistoes...(both amp and dac provided by ARN and shipped by Cranky..the amp was initially auditioned by Gobble, with same speakers and cd player (6002) as mine)
i am liking it...too bad i cannot describe the sound as eloquently as the others..but as far as my ears were concerned they performed quite admirably with the chesky ultimate demonstration disc, lacking perhaps only a bit in the 'heft' department (the amp is only 20W/channel)..but focus, pace, rhythm and timing, detail retrieval etc were good...
i wanted to go the dac route because there is so much good and high quality music available for free on the net (don't really know for how long though..)
Adhiraj
Active Member
Hi,
You should audition one, chances are that it will definitely make a difference ,how much of a difference is up to your equipment and your ears and if the rest of your chain can resolve it.Also ,what are the specs of the internal Dac in the onkyo? If you are using analog out from the DVDp directly then it will probably make a huge,HUGE difference.My suggestion is that you should give it a trial within your system ,all technicalities apart,the proof is indeed in the pudding.
True, Psychotropic. But then the price point is the same. And that - as you will agree - is a valid basis for comparison.
VinodChandran
New Member
Congrats, that's a superb DAC. The x2 Wolfson inside Magic, is the same as in CA 640c V2, so I can understand your joy!
Yep, thats the one 640C V2 ,very very highly regarded CD player.Really surprised by what it did to the Philips ,now it sounds almost as good as my analogue source
You've gone close to a notch higher actually. Up to the 740C in fact.
Apart from the same Dual Wolfson WM8740 24-bit DACs, the Dacmagic upsampleslike the 740Cwhile the 640C cannot.
And apparently the Dacmagic:
Source
:yahoo:
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