Entry Level HTIB for AV Novice

Wharfedale Diamond 12.1 & 12.2 Speakers

K Venugopalan

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Hai, HiFiVision Gurus/Members,

I am a newbie to this forum and since last last 2 weeks I have gone through most of the threads in this forum regarding HTIB.

I am looking for HTIB for my home (Living Room, L shaped around 300 Sq.Ft). I am presently using Sharp 32" Aquos LCD, Sony HiFi VHC 333 (3 VCD Changer, 7 years old), Mitashi DVD Player with USB (gone down 2 weeks back). Our family watch Hindi & Tamil Movies & Hollywood action movies and animated/cartoon movies. Our music is limited to Tamil & Hindi movie songs (mostly in MP3) and some devotional songs and few carnatic music. TV connection is Tata Sky.

So far I am happy with audio quality/output of Sony HiFI VHC 333 (2400W PMPO), except I can not play MP3/DVD in this. So I bought Mitashi DVD Player for playing MP3/DVD (bad buy, gone down within 8 months). As my Sony has started giving trouble like CD tray not opening, etc. So I decided to buy a HTIB with budget of around 25k

After going through so many threads (very useful & informative) in this forum, I have auditioned/shortlisted the following:

Yamaha - YHT 195 - Decent Performance in both Audio & Movies. Auditioned in Vijay Sales. Speakers performance is average. Price 24k

Onkyo SRS 505 with 230 Speakers, 7.1 Ch - Auditioned at Sumaria (very good audition room), Excellent for both music & moivies. But beyond my budget as price is Rs. 40 k. I liked the aluminium body of speakers

HK 133 with JBL Spekaers - Auditioned back to back with Onkyo at Sumaria. AVR is having limited connectivity options and look wise not attractive compared to Yamaha. Audio is very good. Price is 27.5 k

Yamaha AVR Rx-v461 with YHT 130 Speakers. Auditioned at Kohinoor. Better than YHT 195 audio quality wise but it was done in open hall. Price is too high at 34 k for an old AVR.

Visited Croma, Mulund but they do not have any better audition set up. Seen one 7.1 Ch Onkyo (not remembering the model) offered at 37 k. But the audio was too loud. Alsp visited e-zone, Mulund, the audition room was out of order. Even if in order, those sales guys are least interested in selling anything, worst of the whole lot.

Talked to X-Cite, Pune. They are offering Yamaha RX-V 463 with NS 270 Speakers (speakers same as YHT 195) at 30 k. They also have Onkyo 5105 @ 27.5 k. Really don't it is worth to travel down from Mumbai to Pune for auditioning.

So I am confused a lot. My heart is saying Onkyo SRS 505 but my mind is Yamaha YHT 195 due to budget. Please seek your expert advise. Sorry for the long post and thanks for reading.
 

gap g j

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Hai, HiFiVision Gurus/Members,

Talked to X-Cite, Pune. They are offering Yamaha RX-V 463 with NS 270 Speakers (speakers same as YHT 195) at 30 k. They also have Onkyo 5105 @ 27.5 k. Really don't it is worth to travel down from Mumbai to Pune for auditioning.

So I am confused a lot. My heart is saying Onkyo SRS 505 but my mind is Yamaha YHT 195 due to budget. Please seek your expert advise. Sorry for the long post and thanks for reading.

Go for Yamaha Rx-V 463 as it is a good AV receiver, but I have not auditioned the speakers. Also let us know whether it comes with a powered sub, Onkyo 5105 comes with a powered sub.. Any way Yamaha would be a better choice and you can upgrade your speakers after a while.
 

ajinkya

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I have realised that when buying a budget system, it is always better to spend a little above budget (2-4K) and be happy with the purchase for a longer time, then to regret not spending that money 2 months down the line.

If you liked the HK sound, then I think you should go for it, forget the looks. Please describe what connectivity was missing that you feel you need. Also mention whether this is a buy for the next 1 year, 5 years, 10 years, and how much you can stretch your budget, so that our advice is more informed.

The Yamaha AVRs are also good for the price. I think it is worth going to pune to audition the 463 if you're getting it at 20K with speakers. That is a decent price.
 
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K Venugopalan

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Go for Yamaha Rx-V 463 as it is a good AV receiver, ........let us know whether it comes with a powered sub,

Thanks gap g j, Yamaha comes with a powered sub woofer but it is 6" driver/cone. I understand from many threads on this forum 8" is minimum required for good performance. Speaker system Yamaha NSP 270 is same in both in YHT 195 & v463.
 

K Venugopalan

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If you liked the HK sound, then I think you should go for it, forget the looks. Please describe what connectivity was missing that you feel you need. Also mention whether this is a buy for the next 1 year, 5 years, 10 years, and how much you can stretch your budget, so that our advice is more informed.

The Yamaha AVRs are also good for the price. I think it is worth going to pune to audition the 463 if you're getting it at 20K with speakers. That is a decent price.

Thanks Ajinkya for your sound advise. Connectivity missing in HK 133 compared to Yamaha are:
1. Front 3.5 mm input for portable media player. (Instead of this HK 133 is having USB Port) so I can't connect my MP3 Player/Mobiles.
2. Front Auxiliary for Audio/ Video is not available. Instead of that they have normal audio/video input.
3. HDMI Ports are not there (I think it can be managed with HDMI enabled DVD Players)

I am going keep to the new system for atleast 5 years & I can stretch my budget up to 30 k.
Yamaha 463 with Yamaha Speaker NSP 270 is availble at 30 k (not 20k) at X-Cite, Pune. Is it worth 30k?

Seek expert advise from all of you.
 

gap g j

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Yamaha 463 with Yamaha Speaker NSP 270 is availble at 30 k (not 20k) at X-Cite, Pune. Is it worth 30k?

Seek expert advise from all of you.

The 463 AVR will 21K, you get 5.1 speakers with the powered sub for 9k is O.K., If you can spend a little more you can buy yamaha NS 8390 which is floor stander and nsp 60 which is a center and surround speaker set. costing you 14k. All these are low end budget speakers.
 

hemantwaghe

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HK + JBL is faaar better than yamaha 195 & Onkyo 3100

Anyway JBL has 8 Inch powered woofer
also I think in hypercity-inorbit HK + JBL ( and 1 Philips HDMI DVD + HDMI cable) was for 25 K
Just check

From which part of mumbai you are?
 

K Venugopalan

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I think in hypercity-inorbit HK + JBL ( and 1 Philips HDMI DVD + HDMI cable) was for 25 K Just check. From which part of mumbai you are?

Thank you very much for this information. I will definitely check this offer. btw, do you have any data sheet/link for HK AVR 133. I just googled around but there is no data sheet on AVR 133 on HK website. Information JBL India website is very limited. Could you/any other member help me on this? I am from Thane - West, Office at Vikhroli
 

SAMUEL

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H/K specs are available in ::: JBL :::
For your reference:
hk-avr-133&jbl-scs-140_1_300_1317_0_.jpg

Harman/Kardon AVR 133
Front USB 2.0 port for Audio Decoding from Memory Stick
Dolby Digital & Pro Logic II, DTS 5.1
MP3 & WMA Audio Decoding
Matrix Headphone, Matrix Surround & Virtual Surround Decoding
5 Channel Stereo DSP Mode
Front Panel Inputs, Audio(L/R) & Composite Video
Main & Remote Speaker Switching (Speaker A+B)
3 Digital Inputs, 2Coax & 1 Optical
HDTV-Compatible
Video Inputs 3/Outputs (1), Rear panel
5.1 Channel Direct Inputs
Audio Inputs (CD & Tape), Tape Audio Outputs
FM/AM Tuning, 30 Presets


JBL SCS140
Four powerful, compact satellites and a voice-matched center channel speaker with a 200mm (8"), 100-Watt powered subwoofer deliver CINEMATIC ACTION as it was MEANT TO BE HEARD. Very, very affordable (as opposed to cheap) thrills.

Frequency Response (6dB) 35Hz - 20kHz
Satellite
Frequency Response (6dB) 120Hz 20kHz
Sensitivity (2.83V @ 1m) 86dB
Nominal Impedance 4 Ohms
Recommended Power Amplifier Range 10 50 Watts RMS per Channel
Dimensions
(H x W x D) 111mm x 81mm x 95mm (4.4" x 3.2" x 3.7")
Weight 0.5kg (1.1lb)

The H/K avr 132's power output was around 30 W/Ch- all channels driven.So I think the AVR-133 outputs similar power.

All the best with your purchase,:thumbsup:T
Regards
Sam
 
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daddycool

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HK + JBL is faaar better than yamaha 195 & Onkyo 3100

Anyway JBL has 8 Inch powered woofer
also I think in hypercity-inorbit HK + JBL ( and 1 Philips HDMI DVD + HDMI cable) was for 25 K
Just check

From which part of mumbai you are?

Yes I too saw this combo at Hypercity at a fabulous price. Don't remember the price but it was awesome.
@K Venugopalan - BTW, I think having a USB port is more valuable than having a phono jack input. Not only can you use many portable audio players as just USB storage but I believe the overall SQ will be better this way.
 

K Venugopalan

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The H/K avr 132's power output was around 30 W/Ch- all channels driven.So I think the AVR-133 outputs similar power.

Thanks for the information on HK 133. Is 30W/Ch output too low as all other (Yamaha/Onkyo) claiming around 100W/Ch output? During audition, I didn't find any appreciable difference between HK & Onkyo but that was in a ideal demo room of 100 sq.ft.

I think having a USB port is more valuable than having a phono jack input. Not only can you use many portable audio players as just USB storage but I believe the overall SQ will be better this way.

Thanks for highlighting about USB. I thought as most of the DVD Players are having USB, so it is better to have 3.5 mm input on AVR for better connectivity

I will visit Hypercity this week end for a demo/audition
 

K Venugopalan

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Hi madbullram,

I have taken a demo of HTS 3571 at Philips Arena, Thane. It was very good for movies but average for music. That was the higher model they had for demo. I couldn't find your favourite 4750 in any of the leading shops (Vijay Sales, Croma, e-Zone, Philips Arena, etc). I liked the feature of Yamaha YHT-195 & HK 133 which can switch to 2 speaker mode for music.

Could you please suggest a system from Philips which is balanced for both music & movies.
 

SAMUEL

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Thanks for the information on HK 133. Is 30W/Ch output too low as all other (Yamaha/Onkyo) claiming around 100W/Ch output? During audition, I didn't find any appreciable difference between HK & Onkyo but that was in a ideal demo room of 100 sq.ft.



Thanks for highlighting about USB. I thought as most of the DVD Players are having USB, so it is better to have 3.5 mm input on AVR for better connectivity

I will visit Hypercity this week end for a demo/audition

Yes,30w/ch seems low,it's all channels driven i.e, power output at all 5 speakers firing at the same time and typically rated from 20hz-20khz.
Even onkyo and Yamaha must be putting out similar power at these levels.
Some manufacturers like Onkyo, Yamaha,Sony etc state their peak output wattage on a single channel and tone bursts of 1Khz.But in real world conditions ,Music and movies sound consists of frequency ranging from 20hz-20khz(Audible Range) at the least & some exceed this range.

Harman Kardon, Marantz, Cambridge Audio etc are some of few companies that state the real power and most exceed their specs.
Having said that, wattage alone should not be the priority.
Instead look for quality of output,does it sound good to your ears,does it fullfil your requirements,can it be upgraded and the likes...
Audition keenly with your requirements.
Onkyo,Yam,H/K you can't go wrong with any of these.You can easily upgrade the main speakers at a later time and take the sund to the next level.
These receivers can easily run a few floorstanders and bookshelf speakers.
Onkyo Htib's are currently selling like hot cakes.
Only gripe with the entry level onkyo is that the subwoofer is passive,but that should not put you off.

coming to your next query , All receivers many (atleast 3) have RCA inputs.
You can easily connect any component with 3.5mm jack using an adapter or specific RCA to 3.5mm jack.
CABLE-Audio-Y-Splitter-2-RCA-Male-to-1-3-5mm-Female-Cwholesale.jpg


Take your time, audition with your favorite music and movies and let your eyes and ears be your judge.;)
Good luck,
Samuel
 

madbullram

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Hi madbullram,

I have taken a demo of HTS 3571 at Philips Arena, Thane. It was very good for movies but average for music. That was the higher model they had for demo. I couldn't find your favourite 4750 in any of the leading shops (Vijay Sales, Croma, e-Zone, Philips Arena, etc). I liked the feature of Yamaha YHT-195 & HK 133 which can switch to 2 speaker mode for music.

Could you please suggest a system from Philips which is balanced for both music & movies.

4750 is not available anymore. Try if u can get a demo of 3578 and listen to music in Stereo Mode and Pro Logic II mode. Please take you own CDs, if MP3s pls take 256 kbs and above.
 

K Venugopalan

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Thanks a lot, Samuel. Information posted by you is very useful for a novice like me.

Thanks Ram, I will try in other Philips Arena for 3578 demo.
 

gap g j

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Drawbacks with Philips HTiB are, after five years you will not able to upgrade the DVD-Amp. if it develops any problem. You will have to buy a new HTiB along with their set of speakers and your existing speakers will be useless.

If you go for a AVR later, again the speakers will be useless as most would be 2 Ohms and you will have to go for Goods speakers again.

Sorry if I confuse you.

Regards
Gap G J
 
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Yogesh

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Thanks for the information on HK 133. Is 30W/Ch output too low as all other (Yamaha/Onkyo) claiming around 100W/Ch output? During audition, I didn't find any appreciable difference between HK & Onkyo but that was in a ideal demo room of 100 sq.ft.

Don't go by figures, HK packs a punch. Audition in reality. HK will be least as loud as Onk/Yam. I found them to be a bit bright though. One -ve for HK+JBL combo is that they r pricier compared to Onk/Yam. My fav among HTIBs is Onk5105. OR New 6200 if u can afford it.

Philips also are a good HTIBs. But, there is no upgrade path which HK/Onk/yam offers. Plus, most phlilips don't have headphone jack, which comes handy when night time movie watching. Than, THD of DVD HTIB is very high compared to AVR+SPk combo.
 

SAMUEL

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New Onkyo 5205 is out.I don't know the price but it probably fulfills all your requirements and more.:yahoo:
visit ONKYO SIGHT & SOUND INDIA
It has the latest TX SR-307 receiver at it's heart.
It also has a music optimiser which enhances Compressed Music (like mp3,Wma etc), which I think will be beneficial for you as you listen mostly to mp3's.
A Very competent setup.Do audition it as well as the H/K+JBL combo.
My ideal HTiB would be the Onkyo receiver + JBL speakers.:D
sorry for confusing you more.

Cheers,
Samuel
 

K Venugopalan

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Thanks a lot, gap g j, Yogesh, Samuel for sharing your valuable knowledge.

From the inputs received, shortlisting boils down to 3 makes: Onkyo, HK/JBL and Yamaha, within 30k max:

Onkyo - S3200 - 25k, S5105 - 27k & S5205 - Price to be found out - All models to be auditioned. S3200 - Passive SW and No Speaker A/B Drive

HK/JBL - AVR 133, Speakers 140 - Auditioned and found satisfactory. Rear side inputs/outputs are to be checked. Hypercity offer is 25 k along with DVD Player (model to be checked)

Yamaha YHT-195 - Auditioned and found satisfactory. Vijay Sales offer @ 23k. Only 6" driver for SW is a concern

Please highlight if I missed out any other models/brands.
 
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