Finally got a Vintage HMV Gramophone Player for playing 78s

[hildebrand]

I was searching for an HMV Gramophone player to play 78 rpms for sometime.
I was having a feeling since sometime after listening at various friends' places that the 78s are best played on gramophone players as they're meant to be played with those steel needles that "excavate" the tracks. Turntable needles can get damaged by these. Getting real mint records is rare and was asking around for a gramophone.

Finally I got a nice working gramophone of HMV make. It is of winding type and has a horn. Obviously no volume control but I love it.

A simple setup with a nice new looking soundbox too. The wood seems very good and I love the sound signature. I bought some steel needles also with it.

Nice to have an antique device in working condition like this in the drawing room. Thought I will share this news with you all here. :yahoo:

Hope to have some good listening pleasure with it.
I just might make my hand muscles stronger with the winding too :lol:

Here is a clip of one of my favourites playing on it for your listening pleasure:-
Clip of Chandni Raat (1949) song Chhaya Meri Ummeedon Pe on Gramophone - YouTube

Will be glad to show it at the next SIRC Bangalore session in March to those interested.

 

[reubensm]

how does it sound vs amplified sound on your garrard?

 

[hildebrand]

I have not heard many 78s on the Garrard but I feel it takes away something from the sound for them when played. There is something richer and warmer perhaps, more raw maybe even imperfect about the gramophone which is more charming. Reproduction is better here in some ways. The thicker needle also makes a difference I guess.

 

[reubensm]

I have not heard many 78s on the Garrard but I feel it takes away something from the sound for them when played. There is something richer and warmer perhaps, more raw maybe even imperfect about the gramophone which is more charming. Reproduction is better here in some ways. The thicker needle also makes a difference I guess.

well said, that's how 78s were intended to sound in the first place

 

[hildebrand]

well said, that's how 78s were intended to sound in the first place

That's absolutely right. Listening reminds me of that scene in mirch masala where a kajjan song is played by naseer's character. Villagers' reaction was hilarious. It also showed the effect and fragile nature of the records!

 

[Record Player]

Congrats. Had a look at the video and truly this sounds so pure or raw I must say. Classics will sound great on this!

 

[hildebrand]

Congrats. Had a look at the video and truly this sounds so pure or raw I must say. Classics will sound great on this!

Thanks. Yes I put the video to demonstrate. Hope to add to my 78 collection now.
Don't know any vendors other than Seetaphone and Balaji though. Condition is always a concern for 78s and price too sometimes. Classics will be great surely!

 

[TaureanBull]

I also own a HMV gramophone. But sadly, I had only couple of needles and they have rusted and no longer usable. Any idea from where can I source the needles?

Any tuning/repairing shops? The sound box has become little loose.

 

[hildebrand]

I also own a HMV gramophone. But sadly, I had only couple of needles and they have rusted and no longer usable. Any idea from where can I source the needles?

Any tuning/repairing shops? The sound box has become little loose.

I assume you are in Delhi now.
New Gramophone House near Lal Qila (New Gramaphone House (Since 1930), Vinyl Records, LP Records, Bollywood Vinyl Records, Hindi Vinyl Records, Punjabi Vinyl Records, Indian Vinyl Records) stocks needles for gramophones. You could go there and buy. I think he can arrange for repair also.
In jama masjid area also some shops maybe there (shah music centre and others).

 

[Tanoj]

Congrats Bro

the gramaphone reminds me my school days, when we used to have a big box like a jewel box and the horn was built inside , i found this in a storage room which was there in basement of our house for may be 10 yrs

there were few records, and this was used by my grand father and uncle,

the spindle rod, to key it was missing and no one knew how to play it, cos they did not play it since long time, and they were thinking the horn is missing too,

later i opened the gramaphone some how and then was amazed to learn that the horn was there inside the box facing its out to the front, a small window need to be opened to let the sound come out

I found the Spindle/key in the same box, my aunt remembered that we need to key it, i was wondering where is the pugpoint ... no clue that it does not need power

finally we turned it on , the platter started spinning, placed its head on the "Segal's record" and it started sining ... Long after you gone .... kidding it was "so ja rajkumari so ja, song" ....

it was warm sounding, i still have its head, the gramaphone is gone... not sure were

My uncle was overwhelmed to listen to his gramaphone singing after years and it was priceless ... moment captured

 

[hildebrand]

Wow Tanoj. Thanks for sharing such a heartwarming story.
Must say So ja rajkumari is a great song to begin record journey. I hope I will get it one day!
Hope to catch up soon! The "Mehbooba" is still waiting for you ;-)

 

[Simon Wires]

Just curious!!! Which make is the sound box? Would be nice if you could upload a close up shot of that.

 

[reubensm]

Gentlemen, I am inspired, need to get into 78rpm. I just have 2 78s as of now, had 3 but my little son broke one of them, Dad had around 100 that were given away by him to a scrap dealer when we were shifting homes back in the late 1970s

 

[Simon Wires]

A must read before buying a gramophone..

Reproduction Indian Gramophones | Howard Hope Phonographs & Gramophones | Howard Hope

Circa 1900s-1960s: Genuine and Fakes - The Talking Machine

 

[ANILKUMAR]

Finally I got a nice working gramophone of HMV make. It is of winding type and has a horn. Obviously no volume control but I love it.

Congratulations!!!!
Just do two things for your own documentation purpose.

1. Remove the plate and lift open the top cover, Note the Serial number engraved on the machine and Country of make
2. Note the engravings on the sound box regarding make etc.

This information will help you to find the "year of manufacturing" etc.

You will be lucky if the make is Great Briton. HMV/Columbia Indian makes are not less in quality. But the metal used by HMV GB, is something extraordinary and can come alive even from a rusted condition after proper over-oil[coconut oil mixed with kerosene] and greasing. One of my friend in Chennai has given life to many discarded machines, he could collect from scrap dealers.

Target next:
1) a Portable wind-up gramophone like HMV model 102, so that you can control the volume by closing the upper cover or the sound box window. In these models the horn is placed in a box below the machine.
2) a BI-SONOR Phonegraph pickup/soundbox. This soundbox will convert the output to electrical signals , so that you can connect the same to a old philips/Murphy Tube radio input for enjoying the playback/volume control etc and of course for recording too.

3) If possible a RadioGram in working codition: You will have both 78 RPM player and Tube radio in one box.

Good luck!

Luckily, I could so far collect, a HMV -GB made gramophone with horn, two boxed ones (Victrola -USA made with Tungsten or Tungs-Tone needle [refer below for details]and HMV-GB made) and a life size Grundig radiogram with Grundig Tube Radio with FM and 4 Speakers(two in-built and two external boxes)
also a BI-SONAR Sound box Japan made.

From Wiki:

Tungsten or Tungs-Tone Needle: They are constructed from tungsten wire, which is held in a metal shank. Unlike a steel stylus, a tungsten stylus has a cylindrical rather than a conical shape, meaning that the cross-section of the stylus remains the same as the stylus wears down, which in turn means that tungsten styluses may be used for several plays.

Typically, a new steel needle is required for every record played on an old acoustic phonograph. This is because the record contains abrasive material. In the first few silent tracks this abrasion hones the steel needle to a profile that tracks the grooves properly. The needle continues to wear as it plays the record, so that by the end its diameter has increased to the point where the sharp edges may damage the grooves on subsequent plays.

One famous brand of tungsten stylus was the Tungs-Tone stylus, manufactured by the Victor Talking Machine Company in the 1910s and 1920s.

-Anil




Also you may refer to:HMV Gramophones Book - HMV Gramophones 1921 - 1936 - Help with Gramophones from Ian Calderbank UK;

 

[hildebrand]

Just curious!!! Which make is the sound box? Would be nice if you could upload a close up shot of that.

Simon,
It is an hmv make soundbox.

 

[hildebrand]

Gentlemen, I am inspired, need to get into 78rpm. I just have 2 78s as of now, had 3 but my little son broke one of them, Dad had around 100 that were given away by him to a scrap dealer when we were shifting homes back in the late 1970s

Oh Dear. Wish someone gave away to me.
Hope more and more get attracted to 78s!

 

[hildebrand]

Anil etta,
I am not able to lift the cover for some reason (something is holding it). To avoid breaking something I think I will not try to document too much
I have got twin steel needles of "The Twin" trademark. One Needle works for 2 Sides.

 

[Simon Wires]

Anil etta,
I am not able to lift the cover for some reason (something is holding it). To avoid breaking something I think I will not try to document too much
I have got twin steel needles of "The Twin" trademark. One Needle works for 2 Sides.

I only wish my apprehensions were wrong...

The punched embroidery works on the horn, and the extended cantilever holder (instead of the pipe originating from inside the sound box) and HMV sound box, and the turned wood pillars on the corner, which always go against the norms of antique..

I pray, im wrong..

We both just miles apart in Bangalore, my long postponed visit to your listening sessions, is now getting rushed up.. I would love to see this beauty!!

anyways, wou

 

[ANILKUMAR]

Anil etta,
I am not able to lift the cover for some reason (something is holding it). To avoid breaking something I think I will not try to document too much
I have got twin steel needles of "The Twin" trademark. One Needle works for 2 Sides.

Oh no dear. Do not try. Let it sit as the beauty as it is.