MC or MM cartridge for playing used LPs

[mahiruha]

Hello,
I am thinking of getting a cartridge specially for playing used LPs. I want to know is it better to go for a high end MM cartridge or MC cartridge as most of the old LPS has unavoidable surface noise. Is it true that with low output MC the surface noise becomes more pronounced as compared to high output MM cartridges.
Thanks,
Mahiruha.

 

[Hiten]

Wouldn't MC cartridge extract more detail (In these case used Lp which may have scratches). I would suggest if possible get new LPs or use moderately priced MM cartridge with couple of styluses and play with slightly more tracking weight.
Regards

 

[Gerry_the_Merry]

Some discussion that has already happened

AudiogoN Forums: Who needs a MM cartridge type when we have MC?

 

[arj]

Some discussion that has already happened

AudiogoN Forums: Who needs a MM cartridge type when we have MC?

that is one pain of a thread to go through !!
My feeling is MC tracks such records better (to be very generic) but there will always be exceptions

 

[stevieboy]

Hi Mahiruha,

Stylus profile would play a far greater role than MM or MC. A spherical tip would be your best bet.

Regards

 

[Sunderpalanivel]

I have very little experience in TT set up, but from what I know a MC cart will sound a lot better than MM. But you can't compare a high end MM with low quality MC. In this case you are better off with MM. But if you do go for reasonable MC like Dynavector then that will be the best bet. But you have to consider that you will need a MC phono which is usually expensive than MM phono. I don't believe in moderately priced phonos that has a switch for MM / MC. I would and have gone for a MC phono, after all if someone is giving a lot for little then its not going to be very good. In this case again you will be better off with MM cart and MM only phono. Its important to note that, your cart's performance will be limited to the performance of tonearm.

 

[Dr.Bass]

Honestly this is one hell of a topic. It is something even I am trying to understand. Is it the MC/MM design, the cantilever, the stylus tip or the compliance I dont know. The lowest surface noise I have ever heard is on my current ZYX cartridge. It is an MC with medium compliance. But to make your life easier I generally find Ortofon cartridges to have low surface noise, so you can choose any of their designs based on your budget and sonic preference.

 

[sachu888]

Hi Mahiruha,

Stylus profile would play a far greater role than MM or MC. A spherical tip would be your best bet.

Regards

+1,It only depends on stylus profile and tracking force applied. Elliptical would also do the job,but micro line,Shibata,and JICO SAS would cause problem on some scratched records.

Regards,
Sachin

 

[sachu888]

I have very little experience in TT set up, but from what I know a MC cart will sound a lot better than MM. But you can't compare a high end MM with low quality MC. In this case you are better off with MM. But if you do go for reasonable MC like Dynavector then that will be the best bet. But you have to consider that you will need a MC phono which is usually expensive than MM phono. I don't believe in moderately priced phonos that has a switch for MM / MC. I would and have gone for a MC phono, after all if someone is giving a lot for little then its not going to be very good. In this case again you will be better off with MM cart and MM only phono. Its important to note that, your cart's performance will be limited to the performance of tonearm.

Mc carts are often low to mid compliance that requires mid ti high mass arms.Low output MCs are considered to be good,but again it depends on your tonearm and phonostage.There are few budget options for switchable MM/MC Phonostages like CA-640p,NAD PP2 etc,but they will just perform OK.Phonostage is a very important thing in Vinyl rig and one should always consider better options.

Regards,
Sachin

 

[tek]

I use a high output mc cart and i play a lot of used records. The nude stylus (i think) is so fine that it just gets deep in the groove, and i find less surface noise than with my MM cart. Although, worn grooves will be more distinctly noisy. Also it might be worthwhile to invest in a record cleaning machine if you play a lot of used LPs.

 

[mahiruha]

Hi,
thanks all for your inputs. I can see there is a mixed opinion. Specifically I am planning to get a Scheu Premiere TT to play only the used LPS . I will use my VPI classic to play the new LPs so that the Dynavector cartridge doesn't go thorugh too much experimentation of playing used Lps although they are cleaned in VPI RCM. Now with Scheu a popular choice of tone arm and cartridge is Classic 12" arm and Denon Dl 103 cartridge. What I want to know if Dl 103 is a good choice to play used lps or I can do a lot better with a MM cart. In that case what will be a good choice of cartridge with classic arm. I am familier with low priced MM carts like Shure Mx 47 , ortofon 2m red but they are fitted on my project TT. I don't really know how they perform on a high end TT. So I want poeples view regarding performence of MM carts on moderately high end tables.
Any other tonearm + cartridge suggestion is welcome.
Thanks.

 

[jls001]

If your arm can handle a low compliance cartridge, AND your phonostage supports MC, go for this one:

Denon DL-103 0.3mV Low Output MC Cartridge, JAPAN MADE | eBay

Asking $ 190 which is a good price for a Denon DL 103. A good MM like Ortofon 2M Red or Blue will cost as much.

In general, aim to buy the best your budget allows. In practice, stretch your budget to buy that item which you 'must' have.

 

[prem]

Hi Mahiruha


I use a EMT TSD 15 cartridge. Have no problems regarding surface noise. Also the cartridge tracks beautifully. New costs about $ 1500. I listen to a lot of old Hindi lps as well as new ones. So instead of buying a new record player you could consider a TSD 15

 

[mahiruha]

Hi Prem,
I have thought about it. But in that case I will have to go for a full EMT set up. There is no doubt that to play old old Lps EMT is one of the best solution. Is it possible to fit that TSD 15 cartridge in a scheu classic arm?
Thanks

 

[arj]

i believe Jochen already has a Scheu setup with an EMT on a Classic arm.

Cant the VPI take 2 tonearms ?

 

[prem]

Yes Mahiruha

You would be able to fit a TSD 15 cartridge on the Scheu. I think you can fit it on the VPI also.

 

[mahiruha]

Thanks Prem for the suggestion. The research is on. There are so many moving parts in a TT set up it is a tough ask to figure out individual components performance in isolation.

@ Arj: Yes you are right Jochen does have a setup SCHEU Premier Mk3 turntable with SCHEU Classic 12" tonearm and EINSTEIN TU-2 cartridge which is a stripped EMT TSD-15 cartridge . I will try and know more about it.

Vpi has recently started offering double arms. See VPI Industries Inc. - Classic 4 Turntable

But the issue with VPI is it has to be all from VPI stable. So playing around with different options is not on with VPI. That's where Scheu can be more fun.

Thanks.

 

[Dr.Bass]

Mahiruha, Denon 103 is very good to listen to older records but two things:

1. They are not forgiving of surface noise so if your old records have surface noise it can get bothering to the borderline.

2. It is not my personal experience but was reading that 103 is absolutely no no with unipivot tonearms. It needs a solid gimbaled high mass tonearm. My SME 3012 was not enough btw.

In general though I would suggest you look for a Rega RB300 or 700 tonearm (regardless of cartridge). I found it matching with many/most cartridges well and secondly they have that old school musical presentation which you really need for the kind of music you intend to listen.

 

[mahiruha]

Thanks Dr Bass for your suggestion. From the other thread I came to know you are very much into vinyls these days. Congrats on your set up. Well I was thinking about Denon Dl -103 to start with but later realized it won't be a good path to follow as it will not be able to beat my current set up. So I have to look for higher end cartridges. Although there are very good reviews of Scheu classic arm coupled with Denon Dl -103 but I am not considering that option.

I don't think anything wrong with denon Dl 103 and uni pivot arm combo. Uni pivot gives tone arm lot of flexibility to move freely along the path of the grooves results in better tracking. I think that's why VPI and Scheu are using it.

From the cartridges you have heard which one produced most lively experience with a good sounstage ?

As of now I am inclined towards EMT TSD 15 as it can be obtained with a spherical tip as well. Lets see. It is another journey.

 

[Gerry_the_Merry]

A TSD15 for playing used LPs to protect dynavector which will be kept only for new LPs?