My new HT setup with Rs.2.5 Lakhs

[reignofchaos]

As a Be-718 owner, all I can say is do not buy these speakers and pair them with an AVR. It would be gross injustice to them. They need a serious power amp to get the best out of them. I use a McCormack DNA (Jim Merod: McCormack DNA-125 Amplifier) and I strongly believe that even an amp of this caliber doesn't do complete justice to the speakers. They are just *that* good.

 

[subhash]

Thank you so much.

If I go with Dancer Mini - 1 (Costs around 1.75 Lakhs + VAT and I am yet receive the final price details from Sridhar), it might eat up my whole budget with little left for AVR/Amp. Will that be right decision? Please suggest

Also, could you please suggest a few AVRs (Does Denon 2310 has 7.1 pre-outs?) which has got required pre-outs and also a few decent Power Amps to match with?

I do agree with your comment on surrounds but its temporary setup and I can replace with appropriate speakers later.

--1.75L --usher spkr
--53k for denon 2310 ( as suggested by aneel), chk out for pre out options
--@ 20-30k u shud get hold of a good 2 channel power amp in the used market
-- budget may have to be stretched for a center channel/sub/source/cables

i wud advice u to go about it slowly / in stages

--whatever speakers u use a sub is definetly required for 5.1/ 7.1 set up
--coming to source --do not go for a cheap dvdp, go in for a bdp as it will score over dvdp
--for cd play back u wud have to invest on a cdp for good results , may be @ a latter` date
--and cables too

 

[sud98]

Periyar,

Although an AVR would compromise the usage of the Be 718, you need to know that you are buying for primarily viewing movies. Although, you might have liked what you hear and tastes may change, remember your focus is watching movies. So a compromise in hearing 2.0 music may not be such a bad thing. There is no end to spending so it might be that you may decide to hear a lot of music but dont be in a hurry. The 2.0 goal (as Asit pointed out) is a different animal to the HT world (unless you have loads of money). So buying a BDP which is an allrounder makes a lot of sense rather than the Cdp and amp. Maybe you might really feel the compromise and invest in these, my advise would be to stick to your overall goals and you will be happier.

So invest in the Be718 and center. You would probably need a good sub for movie watching and use the sony as the surrounds. Keep tinkering with it with time and it may make you happier.

 

[ashishkesarwani]

I don't agree with your 1st statement in which you have done an audition of Polk Audio Rti A7 at the Pro Fx showroom, as I also own these speakers and they demand a lot of power to perform. In your statement you have mentioned that during the movie presentation the bass was good but during the music session these speakers lacked Bass performance. The AVR with which it was paired was Denon 3310 according to your post, now here I would like to make a point for all Polk (would be) owners and those even at ProFX that these speakers need descent amout of power from either an AVR or integrated amp and I have come to know about this the hard way:
Earlier I had a modest setup of Sr705 Onkyo and wharfedale tower based speakers, now the time came when I decided to just upgrade my speakers with Polk but during my auditioning I couldn't audition RTIA7 but it was RTIA5 which has just 1 tweeter and 1 mid woofer, I somehow liked the sound signature of these speakers during audition so I blindly ordered its step up model. The day came when I went to take the delivery of those speakers but I couldn't believe my eyes as with the packing on they were really huge speakers and even a car like Innova could not accomodate my entire 5.1 speakers from Polk so I had to let go of packing then and there and this helped me to a certian extent to accomodate my speakers. The disappointment came when I connected the entire series to my existing AVR i.e SR705 and it was sounding all right with movies and with the sub on, but when it came to music on pure direct mode the AVR could not provide the juice required by these huge speakers and the result was that as I increased the volume the AVR started to clip (meaning Bass was flatened out), then there was an option with this AVR to biamp the front speakers to which I decided to give a try and it worked this time. So my setup was running smoothly this time around but in my mind I knew that its running in a compromised fashion and I could get much more out of these speakers. Then I guess that God must have read my mind and I got a call from a dealer from whom I had bought those speakers that he has got a very good deal on a Nr905, and since the time I have incepted 905 in my setup I never looked back. The bass is tight and punchy, and for movies the sound is Wow. This reciever is so dynamic that even if you forget to turn on your sub, it doesn't let you feel its absence.
I am sorry for this long post but I wanted you to explain that for these speakers you really need power and that too in abandance. I would request you to go to pro fx showroom once again and ask them to connect these speakers with the Denon High end Pre and Power combo this time.Also while listining to music use Pure direct mode rather than the stereo mode as pure direct mode disables all the audissey and crossover settings of the AVR. Audition it once again as stated above and then update us.

 

[subhash]

@ a price of 1.75L u cud also look at some awesome tower spkrs which cud outperform the standmounts

 

[Asit]

@ a price of 1.75L u cud also look at some awesome tower spkrs which cud outperform the standmounts

The Usher Mini 1 Dancers are floor-standing speakers, if those are the ones you are referring to, but somehow I thought they cost much less than 1.75L. It's the BE-718's (nicknamed the tiny dancers) which are the bookshelf speakers. But do not get fooled by their size. They are quite heavy, literally and figuratively .

Regards.

 

[periyar]

@ a price of 1.75L u cud also look at some awesome tower spkrs which cud outperform the standmounts

Subhash -

Thanks. Thats what I am also exactly looking for. Usher is definetly a very good/ultimate speakers but as Asit mentioned, I would like to get exposed to more options before I choose one. All your valuable suggestions/inputs are welcome.

BTW, am getting to understand the importance of adding AMP (at least to drive my front speakers initially) to my setup along with the AVR. I checked out that 2310 has got only 3 pre-outs and I suppose it will be for two fronts and one center. Will that be sufficient?

You have mentioned in the previous response to go for 7.1 pre-outs. I've seen it in Marantz SR 7003 but not sure it's 6 or 7 pre-outs. It will cost a bit and may stretch my budget for at least Rs.20K more. Is there any other good & affordable AVR has got that many number of pre-outs? What if I settle down for 5.1 pre-outs to drive my fronts, center, surrounds and Sub. Please suggest.

Regards,

 

[periyar]

The Usher Mini 1 Dancers are floor-standing speakers, if those are the ones you are referring to, but somehow I thought they cost much less than 1.75L. It's the BE-718's (nicknamed the tiny dancers) which are the bookshelf speakers. But do not get fooled by their size. They are quite heavy, literally and figuratively .

Regards.

You are right Usher Dancer Mini-1 is floorstander with one subwoofer and a tweeter - same drivers as its in BE-718 (monitor speakers). I have auditioned both and it was phenominal experience with that Amp. Now I got the name of that its Operreta amp.

 

[periyar]

I don't agree with your 1st statement in which you have done an audition of Polk Audio Rti A7 at the Pro Fx showroom, as I also own these speakers and they demand a lot of power to perform. In your statement you have mentioned that during the movie presentation the bass was good but during the music session these speakers lacked Bass performance. The AVR with which it was paired was Denon 3310 according to your post, now here I would like to make a point for all Polk (would be) owners and those even at ProFX that these speakers need descent amout of power from either an AVR or integrated amp and I have come to know about this the hard way:
Earlier I had a modest setup of Sr705 Onkyo and wharfedale tower based speakers, now the time came when I decided to just upgrade my speakers with Polk but during my auditioning I couldn't audition RTIA7 but it was RTIA5 which has just 1 tweeter and 1 mid woofer, I somehow liked the sound signature of these speakers during audition so I blindly ordered its step up model. The day came when I went to take the delivery of those speakers but I couldn't believe my eyes as with the packing on they were really huge speakers and even a car like Innova could not accomodate my entire 5.1 speakers from Polk so I had to let go of packing then and there and this helped me to a certian extent to accomodate my speakers. The disappointment came when I connected the entire series to my existing AVR i.e SR705 and it was sounding all right with movies and with the sub on, but when it came to music on pure direct mode the AVR could not provide the juice required by these huge speakers and the result was that as I increased the volume the AVR started to clip (meaning Bass was flatened out), then there was an option with this AVR to biamp the front speakers to which I decided to give a try and it worked this time. So my setup was running smoothly this time around but in my mind I knew that its running in a compromised fashion and I could get much more out of these speakers. Then I guess that God must have read my mind and I got a call from a dealer from whom I had bought those speakers that he has got a very good deal on a Nr905, and since the time I have incepted 905 in my setup I never looked back. The bass is tight and punchy, and for movies the sound is Wow. This reciever is so dynamic that even if you forget to turn on your sub, it doesn't let you feel its absence.
I am sorry for this long post but I wanted you to explain that for these speakers you really need power and that too in abandance. I would request you to go to pro fx showroom once again and ask them to connect these speakers with the Denon High end Pre and Power combo this time.Also while listining to music use Pure direct mode rather than the stereo mode as pure direct mode disables all the audissey and crossover settings of the AVR. Audition it once again as stated above and then update us.

Thanks for sharing your experience and for the detailed explanation. Its very useful. Thats exactly I am also getting to understand the need of AMP in my setup. Mostly I need to change my requirements as follows,

AVR + Amp (At least Stereo initially) + Fronts + Center + Sub

 

[venkatcr]

I checked out that 2310 has got only 3 pre-outs and I suppose it will be for two fronts and one center. Will that be sufficient?

The 3 pre-outs you are talking about are two analogue outs for recording to be connected to a tape drive or any form of external recorder. The third one is a subwoofer out.

You have mentioned in the previous response to go for 7.1 pre-outs. I've seen it in Marantz SR 7003 but not sure it's 6 or 7 pre-outs. It will cost a bit and may stretch my budget for at least Rs.20K more. Is there any other good & affordable AVR has got that many number of pre-outs? What if I settle down for 5.1 pre-outs to drive my fronts, center, surrounds and Sub. Please suggest.

The Denon 3310 has 8 pre-outs as do all models above that.

When you are talking about powering externally all channels you are moving into the realms of surround sound processor and multi channel power amplifier. Unless you have a very large room and are ready to spend upwards of 300,000 this will no make sense. And unless you go in for something like an Arcam AVR600 or a NAD high end model, you may again be wondering why music is not that good.

A more sensible thing to do will be to settle for a reasonable AVR such as the 2310 for movies, and have an integrated stereo amp for music. This was you will have the best of both worlds.

Cheers

 

[subhash]

Subhash -

Thanks. Thats what I am also exactly looking for. Usher is definetly a very good/ultimate speakers but as Asit mentioned, I would like to get exposed to more options before I choose one. All your valuable suggestions/inputs are welcome.

BTW, am getting to understand the importance of adding AMP (at least to drive my front speakers initially) to my setup along with the AVR. I checked out that 2310 has got only 3 pre-outs and I suppose it will be for two fronts and one center. Will that be sufficient?

You have mentioned in the previous response to go for 7.1 pre-outs. I've seen it in Marantz SR 7003 but not sure it's 6 or 7 pre-outs. It will cost a bit and may stretch my budget for at least Rs.20K more. Is there any other good & affordable AVR has got that many number of pre-outs? What if I settle down for 5.1 pre-outs to drive my fronts, center, surrounds and Sub. Please suggest.

Regards,

in an avr apart from the sub out , there will be corresponding preouts for the number of channels the avr supports ,it cud be 5.1 / 7.1 preouts

this is for future upgrade ,ie connect more powerful external poweramps for each channel

the preout feature is usually seen in slightly higher end models , will be missing in entry level avrs

not come across an avr with only 3 preouts, kindly rechk on this

the purpose of having preouts for all channels is u cud add on power amps to all channels if you feel the need for more power (which eventually everyone does) , the other way to go abt it is to get a pre/processor and add on power amps , but the cost of pre/pro at the moment is high

 

[subhash]

if u cud wait for a while

chk out

Emotiva UMC-1 pre/processor , @ a very good price

also chk out Marantz AV 8003 pre /pro

power amps cud always be added slowly

with this u wudnt waste on the AVRs amps

and this will serve you with excellent results with music and movies

with a pre /pro u are not stuck up ,options are multiple

 

[anm]

I think you already have all the right advices. Here is mine:
I thought it was very cool to have a great projector, surround sound 7.1 etc. However, about 2 years down the line, I have realized that I can not watch too many movies given the time constraints. Lot of movies sound very decent from 2 FS speakers with decent bass. And most of the times I would not be able to play very loud with thunderous bass anyways due to late night, neighbor and/ or kid factor.

I earlier estimated my music:movie to be 60:40 - however, off late, it is like 90:10
So I would suggest that in your budget, go for a very good sounding stereo speaker pair with amp to match.

regards

Edit: Also, speakers + amp technology is not likely to change much in near future, as it is quite mature. AVRs on the other hand are outdated soon, and each has its own share of bugs.

 

[Raghav]

Denon 2310 does not have pre-outs. Denon 3310 / Marantz 5004 / Marantz 6004 have the pre-outs.

 

[unleash_me]

Denon 2310 does not have pre-outs.

Are you sure?

 

[Raghav]

Was till I saw your Image

Are you sure?

 

[periyar]

Denon 2310 does not have pre-outs. Denon 3310 / Marantz 5004 / Marantz 6004 have the pre-outs.

Thanks for letting me know. I have just checked at the Denon USA site. It seems that 2310 has got one pre out for Sub but 3310 has got 8 pre-amp outs.

 

[ajinkya]

There is some confusion between the 2310 Asian and American models. Check a local dealer/model to verify that the Asian version also does/does not have preouts. I remember a similar issue coming up in another thread.
If you want a good AVR with preouts, the Harman Kardon AVR 247 or 254 have them. The Marantz SR600x series also has them. the NAD T742 and upwards series have them. I do not know price points of all these in India. But looking at your situation, I think getting great speakers, a good stereo/power amp and a relatively mediocre AVR may be the right path, given your budget and tastes.

Another approach if you are only going to be using one source for movies and music (eg. a single CD/DVD player) is to buy a great 5.1 amp (parasound, rotel, emotiva, adcom) and good floorstanders. Supplement them with so-so centre and rear surround speakers. Buy a DVD player with 5.1 preouts (Oppo 980H, Marantz DV6001 and upwards). That way, you have the best of both worlds and in case you decide to upgrade to Blu-ray etc. in the future, you can easily swap out the DVD (which is cheap comparatively) while still having a great music setup. If you give about a lakh for the speakers and another lakh or so for the multi-channel amp, I am sure you can get a good combination for your music and movies. Leave the rest of the 50K for the DVD and surround/centre. This setup will compromise a bit on the movie side but will sound great for music. Finally, its a matter of what your tastes are...you will have to make some compromise if you want both movies and music...otherwise go for a great 2.0 setup now and upgrade gradually.

 

[iaudio]

This is an even more whackier workaround option, and I am sure to get flogged by forum members, but I want Periyar to have the Stereo music magic that he has fallen in love with!

Get a Logitech Z5500 at about 25k for movies, thump etc, its a 5.1 thx certified sub sat package. It will give you the boom/thump for your parties too and let you watch movies with reasonable effect(it decodes certain dolby dts stds too iirc)
Spend the rest of the 2.25 lacs for a fantastic 2 channel set up- Cdp, pre-power/integrated and speakers!
Howzzat?

I agree with anm, its music you will listen to mostly.
And personally, even I will tolerate compromise on HT side but not that much for music, eventhough my set up indicates otherwise!

 

[sgmrao]

Mr Periyar,

OPTION1

If you want only two floor-standers and one subwoofer with low bass from front speaker as you wanted you could go for

FOR( 2+1+1)

Focal-Chorus(Front)-826v From Focal(JM Labs,France)-250W(power RMS)
MRP Rs 1,18,000/pair

Chorus CC 800V(Center) 200 W--MRP--Rs 31,500/-

Subwoofer Chorus SW 800V 500W MRP Rs 63000/

Amplifier Denon AVR-3310 105W MRP Rs 99,000/-

Option 2
FOR (5.1 + AMP)
Even IQ 90s can match for your requirement its a 3-way speaker which means more detailed sound distribution. for that system the best suitable sub would be PRO-600 with 12" drive. And the suitable amplifier would be Denon Avr-2310 which has got very good features in it like it supports true HD,DTS Master Audio, its even got RS-232 which you could use it for home automation for audio and video.It has got very good up scaling facility.It has got pre-out. The whole package would cost you around Rs-2,46,00/-


As far as USHER DANCER MINI is concerned its only 2-way speaker , power handling is very less is around 90w, it has got one high frequency driver and one mid frequency where as KEF has got one High ,one mid and low frequency drivers with very good wattage,


You could have audition for Focal in the same PROFX showroom at M G ROAD.
CHEERS