Need help to start exploring 'Vinyland'

Locomotive

Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
52
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18
Location
Mumbai
Hi All,

I have inherited some 30 vinyls and a cosmic cogram2000 player from my dad and mamaji. also i have just purchased a brand new "Dark side of the moon" vinyl. I am dying to find out if a vinyl actually sound better than a cd but i cannot get the vinyl player to play.

Well the player is still working but i think i will need a phono box to get any sound out from my amp (there is no phono input in it). but i am not sure if i should invest money into a phonobox without being absolutely sure that my TT works. Could you suggest anybody in Mumbai who could check and service it?

also does anybody use this TT. Is it any good? I am debating whether i should buy a new one. I am eyeing either a denon 300 DF or a Project debut 3 but both are expensive and i do not want to dive right in before being absolutely sure that i would enjoy vinyls.

are there any cheaper alternatives like used or ex demo TTs

You input would be really helpful.

Thanks
Sabya
 
today i went to Profx showroom at the Atria mall to audition the Denon 300f turntable. Well my main intention was to see for myself if vinyl actually sounded as good as a CD. My test album was Pink Floyds "Dark side of the moon".

First up was the Vinyl. I started with the first track. WOW i was just taken aback by the fantastic quality of the sound. I had always been a bit sceptical that the vinyl would as good as CDs, let alone better. It was a complete revelation. But was it better than a CD??

Next i played the CD. the output of the CD was much louder than the vinyl so i turned down the volume a bit. But it also sounded brilliant. we were using some serious audiophile equipment and the sound was just stunning. But i just could not tell the difference between the two media.

so the scores were level.

after two more rounds both me and the salesman felt that perhaps the bass in the Vinyl sounded a bit more mellow than that on the CD (which was relatively a bit boomy) after a while I also realised that the cymbals in the CD was a bit 'harsh'. well actually i am being a bit harsh here, :eek: it was only in a relative sense and there was no way i would have said this was i only listening to the CD. Anyways after a while the vocals also began sounding a bit better to me.

In fact after about half an hour i felf that the Vinyl was better recorded than the CD:eek:hyeah: I was completely sold.

but there was once niggling issue of the vinyl having a lot of crackle. The denon salesman said that they had not tested the player yet and there may be some problem with it as the vinly was brand new.

now I would try out other vinyl players to see if that crackle still persists.

but i need more advice from you all regarding my Cosmic. how do i check if it is capable of producing a good sound.

Please help
 
Dear Locomotive,

You may contact Mr. Pandurang at Jamnadas Rutonsi, Opera House at 022 23611166 for checking/repairing your Cosmic TT.

Regards,
Suresh
 
locomote your way to dn road, there's a guy there who sells and repairs tt's babu quereshi 317 dn road 23, sk shopping center, prospect chambers. if going from vt to rhythm house, then on the left hand side path. somewhere opposite the bank on the other side of the road if i remember right. hsbc?

crackle is due to your lp. even new ones need to be washed. you can refer to the many threads here on the forum. :)

also please store your lps vertical and not flat so they dont get warped. also very prone to collecting dust which will cause crackle. one generally uses a carbon fibre brush to dust the lp and remove some ofthe static that causes crackle too.
 
Thanks Stevieboy, the cracking was not like static or the clicks that everyone associates with vinyls, it sounded more like distortion. and it could be heard only in the higher frequencies. but i may be wrong as i have not really heard much vinyl.

I just spoke to Norge. they do sell a Phono box. has anyone used it? is it any good?
 
hi
Thanks for showing interest in TT, I'm using TT for last 25 years along with all modern music systems like dvd, ipod etc. Records are still nostalgic to me. If you have cosmic(its a rare one so don't throw it, rather try to repair). Let me know the following things-

1. Whether it is sniping or not?
2. what is its RPMs 33, 45 and 78? You find it through its speed selector.
3. Its output section. Watch the back of the TT and see there is two RCA(probably) output left one is white and right one is red (L/R).
4. Whether its output stage is PHONO or LINE LEVEL.
5. The TT you have had a AMPLIFIER section or not? If it have got VOL COTROL, TONE CONTROL etc. then it is an AMP version. So you don't need to second AMP to enjoy the sound. Just you have to connect two speakers to enjoy the music provided that AMP section and RPMs are OK. You may upload a front and back side image to make me understand better.

If you want to buy a new TT, you can do so easily. But some things are to be consider before buy. Those are-

1. Power supply; AC 220/50 Hz or universal power supply..
2. Drive mode; belt drive or direct drive.
3. Output; PHONO and/or LINE level. Any TT having LINE LEVEL OUTPUT can easily attached to any modern AMP or HOME THEATER or YOUR EXISTING MUSIC SYSTEM HAVING AUX INPUT. It sounds lovely.
4. Price; if you only want to play and enjoy then you can have one with $100+ if you manage it from USA through your friends/relatives with all modern facilities e.g. computer connectivity through USB.

You can directly order to Shop in the US from India @ 20North - Millions of products, Thousands of brands which cost price+import duly + shipping. A simple one can cost 6000 to 8000 in INR. you may visit the site.

Thanks
DG
 
Thanks for your interest. I can understand why you are so passionate about Vinyls :)

Mine is a cosmic Cogram 2000 TT.

1. Whether it is sniping or not?

sorry did not understand what you mean. The belt is a bit loose so keeps falling off but when the disc is rotating it seems fairly smooth. when connected to the amp ther is no sound apart from a very low hum (lack of phono stage i guess)

2. what is its RPMs 33, 45 and 78? You find it through its speed selector.

33 and 45

3. Its output section. Watch the back of the TT and see there is two RCA(probably) output left one is white and right one is red (L/R).

there is a RCA cable coming out from the back panel. its in quite a bad shape. I will try to get it replaced.

4. Whether its output stage is PHONO or LINE LEVEL.

no phono stage

5. The TT you have had a AMPLIFIER section or not? If it have got VOL COTROL, TONE CONTROL etc. then it is an AMP version. So you don't need to second AMP to enjoy the sound. Just you have to connect two speakers to enjoy the music provided that AMP section and RPMs are OK. You may upload a front and back side image to make me understand better.

No amplifier. there are no control buttons at all. the top face has a speed selector, an eject level, and a lever with the tone arm that raises it. thats all. the tone ram has a counterbalance at one end and there is a screw type button that says anti skating. also all these levers and the main record holder are on a black metal tray that is separated from the wooden body by some sort of dampers. The back panel is absolutely devoid of anything.


i want to make this TT work before getting a new one. its fun to just watch the sheer elegance with which all the mechanical bit work in this 30 year old TT. also with its wooden body it would look fantastic if restored well :) if it cannot be restored then i will surely buy a new one.
 
If you are planning get better sound than digital, then dont bother repairing the cosmic. I am sure the Denon player you checked out was not doing justice to the vinyl. To extract the best out of a vinyl, you need at least a half decent player (1k $) with some decent tonearm/cartridge/phono-preamp and setup properly on a vibration controlled shelf. You can check out the used market for some fabulous players too.
 
If you are planning get better sound than digital, then dont bother repairing the cosmic. I am sure the Denon player you checked out was not doing justice to the vinyl. To extract the best out of a vinyl, you need at least a half decent player (1k $) with some decent tonearm/cartridge/phono-preamp and setup properly on a vibration controlled shelf. You can check out the used market for some fabulous players too.


squarewave,

i'd beg to differ strongly. sure, as you go up the chain, the sound gets better, but you can experience the magic of vinyl even with a 7k second hand player. as long as your stylus is clean and not too old. a lot of people can't afford mega bucks record players and there are tons of less expensive options at many pocket friendly price points that outdo cd's bigtime. i've got a 3k hmv player back home picked up from the street that plays only halfway through the record due to a faulty tonearm and to my ears that humble player playing through some unknown cheapo speakers the size of my hand, without even an amp (it has a built in amp) outdoes big buck cd players and dacs i've heard (read reimyo, wadia). all depends on whether you dig the vinyl sound or not, vinyl sound comes through irrespective of price points :)

regards
 
7k second hand player - well that's exactly the price for which I got my technics sl-1700 :) It does need some improvements though.

regards

squarewave,

i'd beg to differ strongly. sure, as you go up the chain, the sound gets better, but you can experience the magic of vinyl even with a 7k second hand player. as long as your stylus is clean and not too old. a lot of people can't afford mega bucks record players and there are tons of less expensive options at many pocket friendly price points that outdo cd's bigtime. i've got a 3k hmv player back home picked up from the street that plays only halfway through the record due to a faulty tonearm and to my ears that humble player playing through some unknown cheapo speakers the size of my hand, without even an amp (it has a built in amp) outdoes big buck cd players and dacs i've heard (read reimyo, wadia). all depends on whether you dig the vinyl sound or not, vinyl sound comes through irrespective of price points :)

regards
 
Well I have ordered for a Shure M97xe cartridge. I have read loads of good reviews for this cartridge. Also could not resist a killer deal on 20north.com. Just waiting for it to come in my hands.

In the meanwhile I have got a used ceramic cartridge fitted to the player. The sound is not that good. Vocals sound good though and its great for listening to Ghulam Ali gazals..but the dark side of the moon sounds very bad.

However I have not given up on it. I am quite hopefull that with the shure cartridge it will sound good. if not then perhaps i will start looking for a replacement (actually i quite like the looks of the old cosmic player so really hope it sounds good).
 
a quick word on my opinion on the the two shops I went to,

Past Collections - fort, Mumbai

My first impressions were good because Quereshi was quite good to talk to on the phone. However when i went to his shop i was extremely disappointed. to start with he was very rough with my player and dismissed it as junk without even looking at it properly. He kept insisting that i buy one of his players (a cheap phillips direct drive one) for 7k. also he said that he would tale over a month and 7-8k to repair my player as everything was spoilt.

Luckily in order to make his point he did open the bottom panel and showed me what each component did. I promtply came back home opened the player and started checking out what could be wrong. the sheer simplicity of the record player was striking. finally i did find the fault. because the screws bolting the motor to the plinth were missing the motor was misplaced due to which there was a loose connection. the moment i fixed the motor right everything started working like clockwork :eek:hyeah: it was a great moment seeing the 30 year old relic come back to life :) and all the automatic functions started working perfectly :yahoo:

but in the whole process i managed to ruin the cartridge. i did not know then how valuable it was. Anyways i called up quereshi again to check if he had a cartridge, and again he tried to rip me off by quoting a price of 5000 for some used cartridge. (i eventually ordered the Shure cartridge for 4000)

so I would never go back to him for any repairs. but he did have an interesting record collection. Might just check that out but i wont be surprised if he tries to rip me off again.
 
Panduranga - Opera House, Mumbai

in contrast Panduranga Bhau came as a breath of fresh air. he was as classic as my Player actually. Old, soft spoken and barely a businessman :) i found him quite knowledgable (at least compared to me) and willing to help. he told me that he did not have the original cartridge but could source it for me for about 1200 but it might take him some time. instead he offered me a ceramic cartridge for 650rs but warned me that the sound might not be as good.

I have asked him to sourse a belt for me as mine has become a bit loose. lets see when i get it.


Speaking of which could anyone please suggest me any place where i could buy a belt quickly?
 
I do not know which place to buy it from in Delhi. Also I read that some batch of shure carts had some issue which was resolved later. Can't recall the source as I was generally searching the web. Indian stocks can be quite old.
Can you please tell me at what price is it available and can it be sent to Delhi/ noida?

edit - is this the contact info?

sungroup : suninfonet Pvt. Ltd.
Dey's Sound Equipment Services,
7, Chandni Approach, Kol-72
Ph:22127206
Contact: Arindam Dey
 
Last edited:
Yes, Well the price quoted in Calcutta for it is 4800. I am still waiting for some update on 2m red otherwise I will go for it. The contact detail for shure delhi dealer is Mr sumit 9811197908, 23866044
Thnaks.
 
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