Norge Amplifier

[vinyl]

Okk.. Will do so...I really want to bring this unprofessionalism of Sonodyne south city mall's showroom to everyone's notice and escalate the issue...i hv also read couple of posts in this forum where the fellow members are also not satisfied with their attitude...

Sonodyne guys are not much concerned with home audio sales, perhaps they think that they are doing a favour to the customers by selling their products to them.

 

[akhilkhanuja]

Hi guys, I myself on a pair of Sonodyne Sonus 2504 V3 FS currently running with a Denon avr 1312. Bought a pair of Yamaha ns 8390 floor standing speakers few days back and hence need one more avr or stereo amp. Is Norge 1000 gold a good idea? Sonodyne SIA 320 is no more in production and my budget is 22000 max. I am from Kolkata.

 

[Amitkg]

Yes, Norge 1000 Gold is a good choice. Yamaha NS series is on brighter side. Hence, you better go for Norge Mosfet Ref 2000 - Norge Audio, it is on warmer side. As it is always said that one should listen to the combo before sealing the deal. AFAIK, Norge has no dealer/distribution network in Kolkata.

 

[subhashis_1980]

You can go for Mosfet Ref 2000, with your budget than the norge 1000.

In Kolkata, there is no dealer network fo Norge. So you cannot demo it as such. You will have directly order them from Shyam Bajaj.

Few pointers:
- You may need to add additional speaker protection circuit in Norge since Norge does not have it normally. Check with Shyam Bajaj once. If you get it modified from Ashok Mandal, it will cost around 1100 but I think it would be great if you ask Shyam Bajaj to incorporate it
- Remote comes separately, you have to pay 2.5k extra, do mention it while ordering
- Shayam sir is octogenarian(around 82 yrs of age), so check with his assistant Laxman parallel with the order.

 

[akhilkhanuja]

"additional speaker protection circuit" - If i dont get it, will my speakers blow? Who is Ashok Manda... Sorry to ask all these questions but i am new here !!

 

[subhashis_1980]

Hi Akhil,
You see..whenever you put on the amp and you hear a thud sound. It means that the amp is sending the signal directly to speakers.

For bigger brands amps you won't find it happening due to this "speaker protection circuit"(Denon 1312 has it). Also if there is any problem in your amp - then it will protect your speakers. Now Norge to keep their prices low and competitive they don't have these circuits in their system by default. It doesn't mean that your speakers will blow if you use it without this circuit.

But you see there are instances where amps without the protection circuit due voltage fluctuations, pest problem(cockroaches, rats), overheating or otherwise had blown up the speakers - doesn't mean that it's destined to but there are incidents. So its better to have a safety mechanism.

Ashok Mandal is an very highly regarded hi-end audio equipment expert and mechanic, who does free lancing from his home in Picnic Garden at reasonable costs.

But then you will have to get the amp from Shyam Bajaj, send it to Ashok da and then get it back from him, instead ask Shyam Bajaj whether he can put the additional circuit there itself in his Mumbai shopfloor before sending it accross.

one suggestion, if I may add with 22k budget have you tried getting a more branded Amp. I am not taking anything away from Norge - I bought one my self(Norge 1000) but then my budget was around 10k ended up spending around 16-17k and I am very happy with it.

 

[akhilkhanuja]

Hi everyone, took time off yesterday and visited 2 places in kolkata - Yamaha showroom/Mr biswas to audition yamaha ns 8390 speakers with As500 and with the cheaper budget amp r-s201. Then went to profx kolkata to listen to yamaha R-s500 (successor ro as500) with some Polk fs speakers (rti @7).

1)mr biswas was all praise for the yamaha as500. Listened to the yamaha ns 8390 on both as500 which is around 33000 after discount and then with r-s201 which is 19800 after discount. Didn't find the oomph in sound on any of them. I like more pronounced bass in my tracks which both didn't give. Walked out saying i'll get back to him. Thorough gentleman Mr biswas is.

2) Profx kolkata - yamaha r-s500 and Denon pma 720ae - The Denon sounded alright with the Polk Tsx and then Rti-a7 towers, but when the amp was changed to Yamaha, the Soundstage sounded bigger, open, natural/wider. That's best how I can explain with my current level of knowledge. Stil I found something amiss. So walked out asking more time to think.

 

[akhilkhanuja]

The person at profx said that the Denon although is more Bassy, but has more restricted kinda sound whereas the yamaha is more "natural" and brings vocals etc to life. He also said the Denon Pma 520/720 isn't there in supply and may be a newer model will still come.

After guidance given by couple of members about Norge 1000 not having speaker protection circuit, I called up lakshman of Norge and raised my concern. He gladly accepted and said they shall add it by charging 500-1000 maximum. So overall Norge 1000 gold will end up coming at 14500/ maximum.

Since my budget was/is strictly within 18-22k AND the fact that I didn't find enough oomph in the much acclaimed yamaha as 500, what are the worthy options?

Norge 1000 @ 14500/-
Denon Pma 520 @ 24000/- (high current 45 wpc @ 8ohms)

Promises shop in kolkata swears by Onkyo 9050/9030/9070 between 22-35k range. I had auditioned the same with jamo fs speakers and found them nice. The owner there badmouths pretty much every brand except onkyo. Are the above mentioned onkyo models high current? IS "HIGH CURRENT" just a marketing label?

Pls guide me, I'm going mad.

 

[subhashis_1980]

Akhil
I am not a big fan of onkyo. When you went to promises did u try the NAD ? Not sure on prices. Also check SKS traders for Cambridge audio.

Now in my opinion if ur budget is around 22k then why stop at Norge 1000. Go for MOSFET ref 2000- as someone mentioned it's more warmer.

Don't be confused. Take a informed decision. Take ur own sweet time. It's your ears and your money.

 

[Amitkg]

The person at profx said that the Denon although is more Bassy, but has more restricted kinda sound whereas the yamaha is more "natural" and brings vocals etc to life. He also said the Denon Pma 520/720 isn't there in supply and may be a newer model will still come.

After guidance given by couple of members about Norge 1000 not having speaker protection circuit, I called up lakshman of Norge and raised my concern. He gladly accepted and said they shall add it by charging 500-1000 maximum. So overall Norge 1000 gold will end up coming at 14500/ maximum.

Since my budget was/is strictly within 18-22k AND the fact that I didn't find enough oomph in the much acclaimed yamaha as 500, what are the worthy options?

Norge 1000 @ 14500/-
Denon Pma 520 @ 24000/- (high current 45 wpc @ 8ohms)

Promises shop in kolkata swears by Onkyo 9050/9030/9070 between 22-35k range. I had auditioned the same with jamo fs speakers and found them nice. The owner there badmouths pretty much every brand except onkyo. Are the above mentioned onkyo models high current? IS "HIGH CURRENT" just a marketing label?

Pls guide me, I'm going mad.

Onkyo 9070 between 22 - 35K range!!!!
Are you sure?
IMO, Onkyo 9070 is in the different league altogether.

 

[sarith]

Now Norge to keep their prices low and competitive they don't have these circuits in their system by default. It doesn't mean that your speakers will blow if you use it without this circuit.

To keep price low and competitive doesn't seem to be the case. Extra profit sounds good. Considering the things used to make the amp and the asking price for it, adding a speaker protection wouldn't cost much.

But you see there are instances where amps without the protection circuit due voltage fluctuations, pest problem(cockroaches, rats), overheating or otherwise had blown up the speakers - doesn't mean that it's destined to but there are incidents. So its better to have a safety mechanism.
ask Shyam Bajaj whether he can put the additional circuit there itself in his Mumbai shopfloor.

It's better to have a protection and the annoying thump would be gone too.

 

[Amitkg]

To keep price low and competitive doesn't seem to be the case. Extra profit sounds good. Considering the things used to make the amp and the asking price for it, adding a speaker protection wouldn't cost much.


It's better to have a protection and the annoying thump would be gone too.

Extra profit or rather extra greed is the name of the game. A featured packed, quality (that includes remote, speaker protection) AVR or integrated amplifier is available at 299$ in US. But here in India, a purely Indian company is not able to include basic features I.e remote/speaker protection in its amplifier that costs 15k, forget aesthetic. Where do we falter? Why do we falter?

 

[sarith]

Extra profit or rather extra greed is the name of the game.

Well, I wanted to type greed but went with 'extra profit' as there are a few Norge users in our forum and I didn't want to sound offensive

 

[omishra]

Guys i don't want to defend anybody. But try to build one with same parts and then compare cost. Let me explain power transformer itself cost 3.5K. Then amplifier kit itself i assume 2k. That alcheapo chassis with buttons etc, 1.5 K atleast. Miscellaneous 1K. Now you almost spent 8K. Now add labour 1K, considering quantity they sell. Add taxes, VAT 15% etc. Then freight charges ?500.
Let's calculate profit for both manufacturer and dealership. Both have to handle it by investing some money.
Do you think 15K unreasonable?
It's not designed in USA and manufactured in RPC in thousands of quantity. I have seen those Amps where service manual states some part but Chinese manufacturer put cost saving replacement which comes ahead after many years slow damage.

 

[frend2001]

Guys i don't want to defend anybody. But try to build one with same parts and then compare cost. Let me explain power transformer itself cost 3.5K. Then amplifier kit itself i assume 2k. That alcheapo chassis with buttons etc, 1.5 K atleast. Miscellaneous 1K. Now you almost spent 8K. Now add labour 1K, considering quantity they sell. Add taxes, VAT 15% etc. Then freight charges ?500.
Let's calculate profit for both manufacturer and dealership. Both have to handle it by investing some money.
Do you think 15K unreasonable?
It's not designed in USA and manufactured in RPC in thousands of quantity. I have seen those Amps where service manual states some part but Chinese manufacturer put cost saving replacement which comes ahead after many years slow damage.

Some point Om....

you are right. Considering the price, the package (Norge) is unbeatable.

And the best part is at Norge, they are ready to put in protection circuit at a nominal cost. So it's like win-win situation.

 

[20kHz]

I own a Norge 2060 and planning to get speaker protection circuit from DIYAUDIOCART. It's pretty cheap considering the purpose it serves. And I am sure any person with a little inclination towards electronics (and a solder iron,of course) can fit this.
Speaker Protection Circuits
I am just waiting to get some free time to do it myself.

 

[akhilkhanuja]

1> Hey Guys, The Cambridge Audio Topaz SR 10 is selling at Rs.26000 online...didnt ask SKS Traders yet.
2>What are your opinions about the Onkyo A9030 ? The "Promises" owner swears by Onkyo.

My budget actually only permits me to buy Norge 1000 Gold (with speaker protection @ 1k extra). But somehow Im not getting the courage to buy it. Reasons - No Sub Pre Out, No Tuner, and not enough reviews.

Then i stumbled upon CA SR 10/20. Will the CA SR 10 & CA SR 20 (with DAC) be better than Yamaha R-s201 ?? Both are rated at 80-85 WPC & 100 WPC resp @ 8 ohms & weigh aroung 8 Kgs if weight is an indicator of build quality. They both claim to have the Toroidal Transformer.

In case I stretch my budget to 24-25k levels, what will be the best Stereo Receiver or Stereo Amp with enough power to drive 2-Way Floorstanders or 3Way Floorstanders. I like my music loud and bass heavy.

For the last 2 yrs My Denon AVR 1312 has been giving me joy paired with Sonodyne 2504 FS. Will the Cambridge SR10/20 take things to another level??

 

[sarith]

Guys i don't want to defend anybody. But try to build one with same parts and then compare cost. Let me explain power transformer itself cost 3.5K. Then amplifier kit itself i assume 2k. That alcheapo chassis with buttons etc, 1.5 K atleast. Miscellaneous 1K. Now you almost spent 8K. Now add labour 1K, considering quantity they sell. Add taxes, VAT 15% etc. Then freight charges ?500.
Let's calculate profit for both manufacturer and dealership. Both have to handle it by investing some money.
Do you think 15K unreasonable?
It's not designed in USA and manufactured in RPC in thousands of quantity. I have seen those Amps where service manual states some part but Chinese manufacturer put cost saving replacement which comes ahead after many years slow damage.

A speaker protection comprising of a relay, an IC, couple of transistors, resistors and capacitors doesn't actually put a deep hole in any of their profit. Anyway, they seem to add speaker protection on demand, which is a good thing.

 

[sann]

Norge amps are being sold for decades without speaker protection. How many Norge users have blown their speakers so far?

The old gentleman fights day in day out with the rising cost of material and labour to keep the cost of products as low as possible, and he doesnt provide remote and speaker protection in the base package thats it.

Who is greedy seller or buyer?

 

[Amitkg]

@frend2001, No, I don't think it's unreasonable. Not putting a speaker protection circuit in a stereo amp is unreasonable. It's a basic feature. Can anyone imagine buying a car that is not fitted with seatbelt? Why does question of requesting/demanding/retrofitting of speaker protection comes, when it is considered very basic?