Schiit Modi Multibit Now in India

[humblebee]

Analogy needs to be simple...if its to be told to everyman.
Like audio.
Not everybody is a science guy or very analytical.

Can't help but to ask this noobish question, how did you arrive at the 1000w monoblock recommendation?

This is a topic in itself ...so I edited it out...but now that you asked...

I started a topic to address this problem here -
http://www.hifivision.com/amplifier...lifier-power-required-good-dynamic-range.html

So basically, taking it from jls001's reply of 64 watts...

- 192khz upscaling will require more power...lets say twice the power...so 120 watts amp
- Calculated for 85 db speakers so as to cover all kinds of spkrs..will require 4 times the power...so 500w
- An amp that gives 500w would be advertised as 1000 watts (50% efficiency)...
- You want to have this much power at half volume for low distortion and good quality...so -6db means 4 times power ...so 4000w
- Good amps have about equal the power in reserve...so 2000w

Thats 1000w monoblocks.
You're welcome.

 

[srisaikat]

I have beeen seeing this thread but haven't said much...
But now looking at your comment, anubisX, I can't help but say this...
Try to understand what multibit is. You will be astonished at the discovery...mainly how they differ from delta sigma dac..which are like 99% of dacs.
And when you identify the component of sound to listen to...you will also understand what has been lacking in digital sound that wasn't so in audio cassettes.
Even LP lovers say that the sound is more real than digital...(many reasons for this but one important is...dynamic range).
98% of dacs have D-S implementation to convert from digital to analog...which gives us roughly 2-5 bits of dynamic range (read this up on schiit website, I think its on mimby faq page)
For comparison...digital music is 16 bits of dynamic range.

Did you understand?
To give an analogy, take a photo of Full HD resolution and display it on FullHD screen.
Now reduce its size to 1/4 in a photo editing software and save it with a different name.
Now display this photo on FullHD screen at full screen size...how will it look?
Stretched, inaccurate etc...

Thats what is happening to music through dacs.
(Now this is not a totally accurate analogy as photos too have a dynamic range which is a different thing...but it gets the point across...that 4 bits of dynamic range is stretched back to look like its 16 bits...but the 12 bits are lost forever.)
Why did cassettes sound better, because they have 8 bits of DR. LPs? 10 bits.

The other 1% of dacs try to have a dual dac configuration where one dac does 4 bits and the other does 4..and its added to get 8 bits.

So...the questions that you want to ask are...
- Can I hear and compare DR of music across 2 systems?
- Is the rest of the system able to do justice to a dac of high DR?
(Which is a very big topic in itself)
- In situations like these, when you come across a high quality thing, sometimes it doesn't give a hit straight away...taste has to be acquired and learning has to be done...

There it is.
I believe I had something useful to share...
Yes?

You have lot of misconception here. One of them is dual dac configuration, it is used to cancel out the noise (out of phase), not for the sake of 4 +4 bit.

The 4 bit theory is partially true as DS DAC works on different principal/ manner. High frequency modulation here used to convert 16 bit signal to analog. Problem is here with that high frequency which is being remain out of the human hearing spectrum still cause some uncomfortable noise or feelings to human ear.

End output result would be greater or difference would be too much instead of subtle if your theory was perfect. But end result or sound signature of a nice DS DAC and Multibit DAC is not that great to justify your concept.

 

[prem]

I have had the Yggdrasil. It's a good dac. But that doesn't mean multibit dacs are the only way to go. Most of the studio dacs on which all recordings are mastered are not multibit. For that matter they are mostly delta sigma dacs. It all boils down to implementation

Schiit is good with dynamic shading and tonal density but a good NOS dac creates a better sense of space. Some high end dacs like DCS do all of it.

 

[rajivaryan1984]

Dear Friends,
I have been regularly reading your posts and really got to know lot of things about DAC. I really need help from you guys as you guys are real experts and one thing for sure that your guidance will not go wrong. Therefore, please suggest me the right option.
My current set up is Samsung 55 Inches 3d Smart TV, Denon AVR X2200 with Dali Zensor 5 Floor standing, Dali Zensor Vocal as centre, SVS as subwoofer and Dali Zensor 1 as Surround and Pioneer BDP 180 as my Blu-ray Player. When it comes to movies I am pretty much satisfied from my 5.1 effect. But when it comes on playing music from Pioneer BDP-180 like I have who lot of collection of original Audio CDs / Flac & Wav files I was not getting that crystal crisp clear music and that clarity feeling is always missing. All these while after reading a lot of forums and Blogs I got to know that Pioneer BDP 180 has got a very good DAC and should work properly as it has to be connected to the AVR via ARC Analog cable as currently in my setup the connection is via HDMI Cable which might be one of the issue. Though I have ordered for a branded quality cable from Amazon yesterday and will wait to use the same to check if there are any changes in the music quality but I need your expert advice and guidance :--
1. Do I need to use any of the DACs like Arcam iDAC / Modi 2 Uber / Modi Multibit or any other DACs? Please recommend
2. Kindly Suggest how the DAC will be installed and configured from the BDP-180 to Denon AVR and what all configuration or settings has to be done on AVR.
Request for your valuable suggestions ??

 

[guddu478]

Dear Friends,
I have been regularly reading your posts and really got to know lot of things about DAC. I really need help from you guys as you guys are real experts and one thing for sure that your guidance will not go wrong. Therefore, please suggest me the right option.
My current set up is Samsung 55 Inches 3d Smart TV, Denon AVR X2200 with Dali Zensor 5 Floor standing, Dali Zensor Vocal as centre, SVS as subwoofer and Dali Zensor 1 as Surround and Pioneer BDP 180 as my Blu-ray Player. When it comes to movies I am pretty much satisfied from my 5.1 effect. But when it comes on playing music from Pioneer BDP-180 like I have who lot of collection of original Audio CDs / Flac & Wav files I was not getting that crystal crisp clear music and that clarity feeling is always missing. All these while after reading a lot of forums and Blogs I got to know that Pioneer BDP 180 has got a very good DAC and should work properly as it has to be connected to the AVR via ARC Analog cable as currently in my setup the connection is via HDMI Cable which might be one of the issue. Though I have ordered for a branded quality cable from Amazon yesterday and will wait to use the same to check if there are any changes in the music quality but I need your expert advice and guidance :--
1. Do I need to use any of the DACs like Arcam iDAC / Modi 2 Uber / Modi Multibit or any other DACs? Please recommend
2. Kindly Suggest how the DAC will be installed and configured from the BDP-180 to Denon AVR and what all configuration or settings has to be done on AVR.
Request for your valuable suggestions ??

It may be helpful:

http://www.hifivision.com/amplifiers/65585-requirement-dac.html

 

[humblebee]

You have lot of misconception here. One of them is dual dac configuration, it is used to cancel out the noise (out of phase), not for the sake of 4 +4 bit.

The 4 bit theory is partially true as DS DAC works on different principal/ manner. High frequency modulation here used to convert 16 bit signal to analog. Problem is here with that high frequency which is being remain out of the human hearing spectrum still cause some uncomfortable noise or feelings to human ear.

End output result would be greater or difference would be too much instead of subtle if your theory was perfect. But end result or sound signature of a nice DS DAC and Multibit DAC is not that great to justify your concept.

There are dacs that do this. Earlier it was limited to high end dacs but it has now been implemented in cheaper ones. One dac from iFi has this technique. ..I think idsd one.
DS dacs do a lot of things that make unnatural changes to sound...not just what you said...but I will limit things for simplicity and understandability here. Key thing being...1 bit signaller is used to simulate dynamic range...and is mostly limited to 5 bits, and introduces lots of distortion.
Mike Moffat of Schiit audio says that 5 bit thing himself.

You might be imagining a lot of difference but it will mainly be that DR will be more realistic...remember that 4 bits has been stretched back to 16.
This in practice....when arijit is singing "Andhera tera maine le liye, mera ujla sawera tere naam kiya". (Channa Mereya song from Ae Dil Hai Mushkil)..it sounds flat..doesnt evoke that emotional response. At least for me as it used to do in the days of cassette...also im a bit extra sensitive to sound.

Anyways, I will be giving my dac a listen today.
Courier guy didn't bother to deliver and sent msg that nobody found at home, twice on 2 days...so I had to go and pick it up myself. Nope...no sorry either.

I have had the Yggdrasil. It's a good dac. But that doesn't mean multibit dacs are the only way to go. Most of the studio dacs on which all recordings are mastered are not multibit. For that matter they are mostly delta sigma dacs. It all boils down to implementation

Schiit is good with dynamic shading and tonal density but a good NOS dac creates a better sense of space. Some high end dacs like DCS do all of it.

Sure its was a written word (what i wrote) but that doesn't make it as serious as the college books...take it easy...

But yes, to people who are a bit extra sensitive to sound...I will hold my ground...lack of dynamic range does rob songs of that appeal to me.

 

[srisaikat]

There are dacs that do this. Earlier it was limited to high end dacs but it has now been implemented in cheaper ones. One dac from iFi has this technique. ..I think idsd one.
DS dacs do a lot of things that make unnatural changes to sound...not just what you said...but I will limit things for simplicity and understandability here. Key thing being...1 bit signaller is used to simulate dynamic range...and is mostly limited to 5 bits, and introduces lots of distortion.
Mike Moffat of Schiit audio says that 5 bit thing himself.

You might be imagining a lot of difference but it will mainly be that DR will be more realistic...remember that 4 bits has been stretched back to 16.
This in practice....when arijit is singing "Andhera tera maine le liye, mera ujla sawera tere naam kiya". (Channa Mereya song from Ae Dil Hai Mushkil)..it sounds flat..doesnt evoke that emotional response. At least for me as it used to do in the days of cassette...also im a bit extra sensitive to sound.

You are carried away by a tricky comparison between DS Dac technique vs Multibit R2R DAC technique. I personally also like Multibit R2R DAC, but do not have to believe any bizarre comparison to fortify my likes or dislikes. Remember the context of comparison here, Schiit wants to market their Multibit DACs.

For example, if you compare between a BUS and Aircraft just based upon the mileage, will it be fair? Their ultimate object may be same, both carries passenger to their destination, but you know why they are so different. So marking the DS DACs only as 4 or 5 bits DAC is quite small part of the story, not whole. Latest SABRE ES9038 is offering dynamic range of 140dB. Can you imagine?

DS Dac Chip adopts different technique to convert 16bit digital files to analog. Ultimate goal of both techniques are same. You know the SABRE ES9018 is just a single bit DAC, but no other DAC can hardly match the details retrieval of this chip. You have to hear the female voice with a nice SABRE ES9018 based dac, then play same file with whatever multibit DAC you prefer. You will get an instant answer. Apart the best female vocal and hyper detail retrieval, the ES9018 is generally harsh sounding one, but it have best possible Dynamic Range in market in recent time (not at this moment as SABRE already released or going to release ES9038 with DR of 140dB). The Point here is single or 4/5 bit mechanism is different here, not so relevant with DS DACs.

You know Dynamic Range can be measured, and there is no great difference found over DR on an specific file which we get either from DS dac or Multibit R2R DAC. But that do not ensure that quality is same as it is a relative term.

Still there is difference and that difference lies in Instrumental TIMBRE, at least to some high sensitive ears R2R sounds truer. But I feel one should not buy the commercial lines to convince others without much readings or research.

Wish you best luck with your new purchase.

Regards

 

[kartikay]

Analogy needs to be simple...if its to be told to everyman.
Like audio.
Not everybody is a science guy or very analytical.



This is a topic in itself ...so I edited it out...but now that you asked...

I started a topic to address this problem here -
http://www.hifivision.com/amplifier...lifier-power-required-good-dynamic-range.html

So basically, taking it from jls001's reply of 64 watts...

- 192khz upscaling will require more power...lets say twice the power...so 120 watts amp
- Calculated for 85 db speakers so as to cover all kinds of spkrs..will require 4 times the power...so 500w
- An amp that gives 500w would be advertised as 1000 watts (50% efficiency)...
- You want to have this much power at half volume for low distortion and good quality...so -6db means 4 times power ...so 4000w
- Good amps have about equal the power in reserve...so 2000w

Thats 1000w monoblocks.
You're welcome.

I generally dont get into a discussion but felt to chime in after reading above post. Please dont take it personal I am just trying to clear the confusion here as
I found some issues with above calculation.
- Lets start with initial no. of 64W. For a 15dB increase in SPL level one needs to provide 2^5times of power meaning 32W (if starting power no. was 1W, which is normally the case when we take speaker sensitivity as our starting point).
- Sampling (up/down) happens at DAC stage, I am not sure how it will affect Amplifier power calculation.
- Any speaker irrespective of the size will use same power if their sensitivities are same. Most of the time what differs is the current sinking into the speakers. At lower impedance levels current supplied by Amp needs to be increased to maintain same SPL(power levels) for the speakers. So I dont think one needs to increase Amplifier wattage for considering multiple speaker, but look for amplifiers which are rated at driving lower impedance based on minimum impedance specified for a particular speaker.
- Amplifier efficiency is the ratio of output_power/input_power, so a 500W amplifier will consume 1000W power (affecting your electricity bill a lot), where 500W is getting dissipated as heat. It doesnt mean that you are getting half of advertised power. So no need to double power if advertised efficiency is 50%.

Here are some links to calculate amplifier power or SPL levels based on Amplifier power.
Amplifier power / SPL calculator for home theater THX reference level - Acoustic Frontiers
Peak SPL Calculator

 

[humblebee]

Coming back on track...I post some impressions here...
But first...I will respond to your posts kartikay & srisaikat...but all is cool...you have your opinions and I have mine. And I know what I hear and what I feel..so my choices (not bias) go with my knowledge hand in hand without any regrets.

Please take this as you will with a pinch of salt..

Impressions (general)...
- Clarity across the board...even the last row of players can be heard without distortion
- A lot of heft gets lent to the songs..not just to singers but to instruments etc
- After some initial errors of choosing DirectSound drivers which give it glare, I chose Speakers output on Potplayer. All glare is gone. Its a natural wrmth here.
- Smoothness of 192khz that I expected isnt there..I will have to reconfirm on upsampling...but definitely more smooth than my previous sound...almost to the extent of being non intrusive. Since im very sensitive to this (44.1 is taxing) so tried upsampling in windows, then player...got too much heft, as if sitting in front of concert level equipment (but with limited volume) you know that feeling of energy, although not that much

Plz see that
- Overall difference is not earth shattering...but im out to single out and handle some serious discrepancies in digital music..my equipment is moderate, my choice not very exclusive...but what did i lose after cassettes...I want to solve this problem.
- There are many other factors like imaging, Instrument separation etc that can be said to be positive attributes. ..but im not after them too much...Im after removing the imp negative attributes...like noise, balance, timing, smoothness, DR..solving these 5 have been hard enough and costly enough for this modest person.
- You need to know what to listen for

OK now, Inner dialogue while listening to newer songs...
- Channa Mereya...yes now its correct...the change in volume goes hand in hand with aliveness of singers voice
- Zombie, Cranberries (one of my fav) ...what have you been listening to? The singer seems to say to me
- Woh Jahaan (Rock On 2)..Shradhha IS an amateur singer...sigh...oh my the effects they use to pump up her voice..must be AutoTune...
- Besabriyaan (MS Dhoni) ...Arijit has a range...hes OK

Comboburrito zindabad! OK now lets listen to older songs...

Cassette era songs....
- Saat Samundar...yes, the song is back and reminds me of older days
- Be My Lover, La Bouche..better than my older system
- Cotton Eye Joe, Rednex..same here..sounds better
(This is where I realise that im not able to analyse very well and im getting lost in the music..OK thats my sign)
- Chalte Chale Mere Ye Geet Yaad Rakhna (also a fav)............................

 

[srisaikat]

Congrats!

If you are happy with the end results then no need to bother with behind technologies, here many people are happy with their DS Dacs (Chord Hugo, PS Audio, Resonessence Labs, Benchmark, Arcam irDAC, Emotiva DC-1 etc....etc...). Let them live with that.

End result is most important, Just keep sharing your musical experience.

 

[omishra]

Yes, in the end one has to be happy. We get lost into technology and forget the essence of music. IMO Music is first.
Now away from my system, I can say FM radio on mobile is also loveable.

 

[Audio_Freek]

Yes, in the end one has to be happy. We get lost into technology and forget the essence of music. IMO Music is first.
Now away from my system, I can say FM radio on mobile is also loveable.

Exactly, If you Like a Dish Just find the right Place to have it or do it at Home. But if you start creating the Habit of tasting individual ingredients instead of the Whole Dish then whole purpose would be waste.

Music Listening need a Mood,You could be relax or happy or upset.hyeah: .

When you start to live for others then what is purpose of living.I have seen people who upgrade system, Just because the new version is available or feel guilty for using Old system .

 

[humblebee]

On smoothness...yes its just OK for me. Reason being limited tap length of 4000 on this dac...cost issues.
But most of the folks should find this quite smooth. Its comparable to smoothness you get on upsampling from 44.1 to 88.2.

I found some issues with above calculation.

- 3db SPL increase is 6db increase, so 2^10, or 1000w. Its specified by jls001 in that post.

- Sampling...again specified in that post...look up time domain optimization. ..Rob Watts of chord dac explains this logic well here -
Chord Electronics Hugo TT DAC & headphone amplifier review | DAR__KO

- Speaker efficiency...calculation of 64w is for 87 db spkr, with 9 db jump. But from 85db spkr, jump to 97db SPL is 12db SPL. So for extra 3db spl or 6db is 4 times the power

- Amp efficiency...if marantz says my amp is 40wpc, it will give actually 20wpc. 1st point in that thread.

Plz take this up on that thread.

@srisaikat
It is unclear to me what your points are.

- You say 4+4 is used for dual dac. I say yes, that also. But also what I said. There is no 'you OR me is right' here. Both are right.

- Schiit is lying for sales....its not that simple...its a brand with high integrity and customer focus. Lying will undo what they have done.

- High DR by others...I said that 4 bits has been stretched back to 16 bits...so theoritical or simple measurements will show 125db snr easily...but actual bits used or "matching of energy of sound or liveliness of singer with perceived loudness" will not substantiate it. This takes time to perceive and ... one doesnt have to really if you are happy with what you have.

- Timbre...is a positive attribute, and not an attribute that im trying to solve.

- Buying into commercial lines...no we should not do that. Im only following areas that I feel. And guided by knowledge. Thats not something that only companies can understand ! Or even lie about openly.

But I don't really understand your post...if you don't agree with me...you dont have to read. Whats the point of this discussing....? Either you understand what im saying ... or be happy

 

[kartikay]

@humblebee, please see my replies inline and I again state nothing is personal. I am just trying correct some misconceptions. All this info is present in open domain and is also taught as part of Electrical engineering curriculums, I learnt the same during design of audio amplifiers as part of my MS curriculum.

- 3db SPL increase is 6db increase, so 2^10, or 1000w. Its specified by jls001 in that post.
>> dB is a logarithmic scale, so a 3dB increase means 10*log (P1/P2) == 3dB, which translates to P1/P2= 1.995 ~ 2, this is pure math not an opinion. For detailed info:
The Decibel (dB) Scale & Audio Rules 101 | Audioholics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel

- Sampling...again specified in that post...look up time domain optimization. ..Rob Watts of chord dac explains this logic well here -
Chord Electronics Hugo TT DAC & headphone amplifier review | DAR__KO
>> I read whole article but nowhere they mentioned about increase in Amp power because of upscaling. But even if there is an increase in power because of Upscaling, that increase in power consumption is for DAC. Once Digital to analog conversion has happened, the signal is in frequency domain ranging from 20-20KHz (even more if one believes that they can hear beyond that range) which will require some amount of power as Amp is needed to provide a current to speaker coil. Now power consumed by that speaker is P == I^2*Z, where I is the current flowing in that circuit and Z is the impedance seen by amplifier.

- Speaker efficiency...calculation of 64w is for 87 db spkr, with 9 db jump. But from 85db spkr, jump to 97db SPL is 12db SPL. So for extra 3db spl or 6db is 4 times the power
>> As stated above, based on logarithmic scale an increase in 12db translates to 2^4 increase in power which translates to 16W if our reference point is 1W, which is the case when speaker sensitivity is specified as it is always specified as "X" dB at 1m when supplied with 1W. The calculation may change if nominal impedance stated is different than 8ohms or stated voltage levels are different than 2.83V. I am not sure how you are converting 3dB SPL to 6dB increase in power.

- Amp efficiency...if marantz says my amp is 40wpc, it will give actually 20wpc. 1st point in that thread.
>> Your calculation maybe true if a company specifies input power in their spec, but I havent seen that yet. If any company is doing that, then they are fooling their customers.
I have also attached screenshot showing Marantz PM6006 specification, it clearly states power nos. are for Output power, which means no need to divide the power in half. Also in physics efficiency is always defined as ratio of output_power/input_power. Btw here is a link to IIT Guwahati lecture which explains amplifier efficiency:
http://www.iitg.ac.in/apvajpeyi/ph218/Lec-19.pdf
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_efficiency

 

[jls001]

I am not sure how you are converting 3dB SPL to 6dB increase in power.

I believe what he wants to say is "doubling of SPL" needs 6 dB increase in power. "3 dB" and "doubling" are not interchangeable.

Regarding the doubt about some OEMs over specifying power rating of their amps, we should also know how they specify it. Usually the maximum power just before clipping starts, into a specific load, is considered the max power into that load. Some may specify the power at higher THD just to make the power number higher (like many class D chip manufacturers brazenly specifying max output power at 10% distortion). With the right instruments one can measure both max power and THD.

.... and now back to topic please.

 

[srisaikat]

@srisaikat
It is unclear to me what your points are.

- You say 4+4 is used for dual dac. I say yes, that also. But also what I said. There is no 'you OR me is right' here. Both are right.

- Schiit is lying for sales....its not that simple...its a brand with high integrity and customer focus. Lying will undo what they have done.

- High DR by others...I said that 4 bits has been stretched back to 16 bits...so theoritical or simple measurements will show 125db snr easily...but actual bits used or "matching of energy of sound or liveliness of singer with perceived loudness" will not substantiate it. This takes time to perceive and ... one doesnt have to really if you are happy with what you have.

- Timbre...is a positive attribute, and not an attribute that im trying to solve.

- Buying into commercial lines...no we should not do that. Im only following areas that I feel. And guided by knowledge. Thats not something that only companies can understand ! Or even lie about openly.

But I don't really understand your post...if you don't agree with me...you dont have to read. Whats the point of this discussing....? Either you understand what im saying ... or be happy

Are you out of ur mind? I never said "4+4 is used for dual dac", you said that. I said that dual dac is used to cancel out noise out of phase which is called dual differential configuration, not for the sake of 4+4.

I never said Schiit was lying, I said it was a tricky comparison. It's a partial truth to market R2R multibit DACs. By the way it's (multibit) a nearly 40 year old technology for Audio DACs. Schiit have very nice customer support that I can tell for sure (more than you) as I myself enjoyed that treat with my Gungnir DAC (You can Read my Old Post) with back and forth shipping on company .

But my logic was 1 bit or 4 bit is not so relevant when you adopt Sigma-Delta technique. If you think that a single bit DS DAC just wasting 15 bits of information out of 16 bits (or 12 bits waste out of 16 bits) then you have not read or never understood the Sigma Delta/Delta Sigma modulation. "4 bits stretched back to 16" - that's not the way DS Dac works. Tell me one thing why should it stretched back to 16 bits? Is it Digital to Digital Conversion? You are messing up with shallow idea/knowledge.

Sigma Delta/Delta Sigma modulation- "transfer high bit-count low frequency digital signals into lower bit-count higher frequency digital signals as part of the process to convert digital signals into analog as part of a digital-to-analog converter (DAC)." First Search and Try to understand these lines. It is almost like a power distribution system. Higher Voltage/lower current to Lower voltage/higher current. Just to super simplify the matter - Higher bit (say 16bit) lower frequency (say 44.1 kHz) signal can be converted to Lower bit (say 1 bit) Higher frequency (705.6 KHz) signal through Sigma Delta modulator and pass through various process/filter before convert it to analog audible signal. Though in practical field the relation is not that simple and converted to much higher frequency (at MHz level) as per algorithm requirements.

Though I do not like your post still I had to read it, because I believe you are misguiding people on an open forum like HFV with some half or distorted truth.

 

[humblebee]

I believe you are misguiding people on an open forum like HFV with some half or distorted truth.

I take that as a serious charge on my integrity.
I have always openly shared my knowledge here and have been thankful and respectful, staying within my boundaries.
Still if after sharing and givIng all my collected knowledge this is what I get then I guess then I will just reduce or end my interactions on this forum.

I guess there will always be people who want to have the last word.
To them I will just say that not everything is understood in 2 days of interaction over the internet. Or by just reading up stuff
There is lots of knowledge (differentiate from information), lots of understanding that comes in time.
Patience is needed for that.

Anyways I still stand by whatever I said.

Peace
Live and let live
Best wishes.

 

[srisaikat]

@humblebee, please do not stop to share your impression about your DAC and other audio related purchases. Most of hifi lovers here always enjoy that part.

Just take little caution before make any bold statement/judgement about certain technology without proper study. I have no wish to personally hurt you, my sincere apology if I did so. That's the end on my part about this argument.

Regards

 

[amit11]

What a U-turn in listening impressions.

All these days the modi multibit was sounding detailed, clear and the lows were almost non-existent, which was affecting everything. I was all the time thinking that the modi will further burn in and the lows/bass will return. The music was not enjoyable most of the times.

Then yesterday suddenly stumped upon an issue. One of my cable malfunctioned and after removing observed that the wire on the solder was broken and possibly all these days only few strands were touching the rca. That could possibly have made the lows almost non-existent.

Now today after rectifying the cable issue, the impressions are almost reversed.

Lows are in fact there, very much there. Punchy bass.
Due to the bass, clarity and sharpness has reduced.
Still not likeable. The silent background, the sharpness and clarity found in original modi is what I am missing. My amplifier is Yamaha, and their signature sound as such has less bass. However for the first time even Yamaha's signature sound is not working, so much bass is there.

Still waiting for more burn in. As of now fits more for home-theatre kind of sound rather than music.

 

[amit11]

....now finally the system has started singing back...:yahoo:

From the moment the multibit was connected, there were mixed days of happiness, sadness, buyers remorse, a feeling that 'something is still not right', helplessness, depressed feeling, unease etc.

To get it sound right, I continuously rearranged all my items in the chain including speakers multiple times in the hope that sound will come ok. I had rearranged the speakers position, changed multiple cables from DAC to buffer, and from buffer to amp, tried all possible permutations and combinations of those cables. Manytimes removed the Yaqin buffer from the chain. Rolled the tubes from Sylvania NOS and the stock tubes, swapped the left and right tubes. Manytimes even the stock tubes sounded better than the Sylvania NOS tubes. Sometimes I felt even my backup DAC fiio d03k sounded better which costs 1/10th of multibit.

After all these many frustrating days, I think today I am feeling satisfied with the purchase. The output of 1.5 volt has changed to 2.0 volts in multibit and that has created so many frustrating days of system matching. Not sure what has happened finally, whether the DAC has burn-in, either my ears and mind have burn in, or the right permutation of interconnect is in place, but now I am feeling happy. Touch wood.

Right from day 1, i had a feeling that 'something is just not right' but no idea if there is anything which is wrong. I was surprised that none of my demo songs (few songs which I use for listening tests) I was enjoying the way I used to. Sometimes the sound was not correct, and sometimes all ingredients were there but still not that feeing of enjoyment. Was quite depressed.

So many changes in sound during all these days have faded away my listening memory of modi delta-sigma which had stopped working four months ago. But I can feel the enjoyment has returned. Couple of points for comparing purpose. These points are very much apparent during listening.

- multibit has more of low end. Bass has the punch which was missing in previous modi.
- multibit has a bit thicker vocals.
- In some songs I can hear sounds which I had not heard before.
- Instruments sound more natural. Timber is better compared to previous modi.



amit