Solar Power for my AV Room

I have been exploring solar power for the house but my experience with tata solar (ofcourse there have been a lot of advances since then) has left me slightly sceptical about the viability and efficiency of solar power. Hope I am wrong.
Cheers,
Sid

Nearly a decade back living in Bangalore we had solar heating for water for the entire home, but it was seldom hot, mostly warm. Maybe a little hot for the first person into the shower, but even then not for very long.

Granted Bangalore is more cloudy and colder than more other places, but solar is not really a solution for hot water.
 
Granted Bangalore is more cloudy and colder than more other places, but solar is not really a solution for hot water.

You waste more cold water in order to get hot water.

Especially when you live in multi-storeyed apartments, and you are staying a ground level. The existing cold water in the pipes need to clear first.
 
You waste more cold water in order to get hot water.

Especially when you live in multi-storeyed apartments, and you are staying a ground level. The existing cold water in the pipes need to clear first.
In Pune, I live on 1st floor of 7 storied building. We have 125 litre of solar water heater with 1 panel installed on common roof. I never felt any problem of wasting cold water. First person to fill bucket with hot water tap till it flows hot water. Its after 3/4th of bucket, we get hot water and upto 65 ? hot. It accidentally burnt a distant relative who started shower using hot water knob. Now that whole pipe from roof to first floor is coated with glass wool and asbestos sheet. It protects heat upto 2 hrs in pipe before pipe water cools again.
We all use hot water in quick succession, and for family of 4, sun for 2-3 hrs provides us hot water for 2 days. Its 13 years we are using it with minor replacement of leaking hose pipes and some rusting pieces of open pipes. After purchase price of 25K in 2003, it turned out to be good bargain. :)

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Nearly a decade back living in Bangalore we had solar heating for water for the entire home, but it was seldom hot, mostly warm. Maybe a little hot for the first person into the shower, but even then not for very long.



Granted Bangalore is more cloudy and colder than more other places, but solar is not really a solution for hot water.



I suspect that the technology has evolved, in heating and preserving that hotness, since that time.
I agree that during cloudy days the water is not piping hot , but still decently hot for a bath! Also some solar water heaters are much better than others, I've noticed.
 
In Pune, I live on 1st floor of 7 storied building. We have 125 litre of solar water heater with 1 panel installed on common roof. I never felt any problem of wasting cold water. First person to fill bucket with hot water tap till it flows hot water. Its after 3/4th of bucket, we get hot water and upto 65 ? hot.
We all use hot water in quick succession, and for family of 4, sun for 2-3 hrs provides us hot water for 2 days. Its 13 years we are using it with minor replacement of leaking hose pipes and some rusting pieces of open pipes. After purchase price of 25K in 2003, it turned out to be good bargain. :)

Incidentally all people are not conservative. I have seen this where there are 200+ flats with more than 500 liters solar tank on individual building. Society audited from third party and found near about 20% wastages due to negligent occupiers wasting cold water throughout the day and first persons.
 
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What should be the minimum power my solar plant be to run a decent home theater with PJ, receiver and good speakers
 
SIDVEE wrote :I have been exploring solar power for the house but my experience with tata solar (of course there have been a lot of advances since then) has left me slightly sceptical about the viability and efficiency of solar power. Hope I am wrong.

I have been using a Solar heating system for about 9 years now. We usually get Hot water for most of the year, except perhaps a week or two during heavy cloud/ rains during the monsoon. I am located in Pune.
Sadly, my friend who installed it is no more. it is quite different from the newer models I see being put up recently.The only thing I am required to do is fill "pure" water, about 10/12 ltrs, in the outer solar water tank every 6 -8 months.
This past month, I had to replace a blocked air vent/pipe, which was caused by exceptionally dirty water Tube well/tanker supplied, as also the Syntex water tank.

If there is an expert on Solar heaters, I need to find out about a corroded rod located near the Hot water outlet: the manufacturer ( Solarz/Solray of Bangalore) is just not traceable and I cannot understand what that rod( about 18" long) actually does. The system is working fine without it currently.
 
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my tata solar water heater (it is 5 years old now, I think it cost 50-60k) is totally useless in monsoon and winter I would say 5-6 months of the year when we need it most. It was always like this even when new.

Nearly a decade back living in Bangalore we had solar heating for water for the entire home, but it was seldom hot, mostly warm.

I had installed a Solar Water Heater in the Duplex house when I was in Hyderabad which, I gave away to a friend when I moved to Chennai because I had to reside in a puny apartment. Though I had bought it more on impulse thinking of shifting it to my own duplex flat which I had sold off due to some domestic issues, I've done a thorough research.

Tata Solar had come up with a Solar Water Heater with plastic panels which are not very efficient. The best in business are the 'Evacuated Tube Water Heaters'. These have 12-15 long glass tubes with inner and outer layers. The inner layer is coated with black heat absorbent material and the space between the tubes is vaccum i.e. the air is sucked out. The Tank is made of strainless steel outer and inner drums with very thick insulation in between.

This is how the unit looks like:
ETC.jpg

Image courtesy: www.vulcansolar.in

This is how the vaccum tubes look like:
2009103184410.jpg

Image courtesy: http://www.kelebe.com

These are the various components of the unit:
etc_pic.jpg

Image courtesy: http://www.sunwize.co.in

I need to find out about a corroded rod located near the Hot water outlet: the manufacturer ( Solarz/Solray of Bangalore) is just not traceable and I cannot understand what that rod( about 18" long) actually does. The system is working fine without it currently.
If you are referring to the pipe connected to the outlet and jutting above, that is the air/stream escape vent. You better replace the corroded tube with a new one to prevent any accident. If the tube gets blocked, the built up pressure can cause an explosion.
 
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... The best in business are the 'Evacuated Tube Water Heaters'. These have 12-15 long glass tubes with inner and outer layers. The inner layer is coated with black heat absorbent material and the space between the tubes is vaccum i.e. the air is sucked out. The Tank is made of strainless steel outer and inner drums with very thick insulation in between.

Hello Rajesh, after a long time. I fondly remember our listening sessions whenever I drive past your erstwhile puny apartment. Yes, it was a but cramped --- expecially for a guy with big tastes in audio gear :eek:hyeah:

To the point: we use vacuum-tube solar water heater for pressurised system. The water does not enter the tubes: instead they have a copper heatpipe at their centre which feeds the heat into the main tank. Yes, we only have a few days a year without hot water and mostly it is scalding hot. For a couple, though, it is pure gadget-love/convenience. It will certainly never pay for itself.

My next new toy will be a 1Kva solar electricity off-grid setup. It will be off-grid, as it must provide power-cut backup. More-or-less about to order from Sukam.

I am not really expecting to save money, but if a few Rs get saved that is bonus.

My wish of letting the sun pay for itself by powering the ACs is still a long long way away from being affordable. :cool:
 
Hello Rajesh, after a long time. I fondly remember our listening sessions whenever I drive past your erstwhile puny apartment. Yes, it was a but cramped --- especially for a guy with big tastes in audio gear :eek:hyeah:

Thank you for bringing up those fond memories Thad.:thumbsup: Hope you've come out of the trauma of the deluge.:)

we use vacuum-tube solar water heater for pressurised system. The water does not enter the tubes: instead they have a copper heatpipe at their centre which feeds the heat into the main tank. Yes, we only have a few days a year without hot water and mostly it is scalding hot. For a couple, though, it is pure gadget-love/convenience. It will certainly never pay for itself.
Is it different from the one I tried to explain in my post? I thought even the inner tube is glass. Visually it appeared so and was jet black. It could well be anodised copper for all you know. BTW how much did it cost? Probably that could be indicative of the material as copper is far more expensive than tempered glass. My system cost 20 odd thousand including installation way back in 2005.
My next new toy will be a 1Kva solar electricity off-grid setup. It will be off-grid, as it must provide power-cut backup. More-or-less about to order from Sukam.
I'm not sure if still exists but there was a substantial subsidy from Government of India sometime back. The vendor would be able to give better information.
 
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My next new toy will be a 1Kva solar electricity off-grid setup. It will be off-grid, as it must provide power-cut backup. More-or-less about to order from Sukam.

I am not really expecting to save money, but if a few Rs get saved that is bonus.

My wish of letting the sun pay for itself by powering the ACs is still a long long way away from being affordable. :cool:

Wow that is co incidental, even I am looking for a solar panel system (off grid)


THis website gave a lot I mean a lot of info on solar rooftop systems ..
https://www.bijlibachao.com/using-renewables/solar

My avg monthly electricity bill is 3-4K, summers it touches 7-8K, coz my AC runs like fan in summers :D(I am in Delhi NCR). I was just wondering, if a 2KVA solar unit will run 1 TON 3 star AC and few other things like 3-4 LED lights and laptop, that would me more than sufficient to cut summers. Then if I take a loan for like 3-4 years, and instead of paying the bill I pay the installment, would I be able to recover my money in 3-4 years when my installments end. I then would be generating electricity for free at that time.

Does this even make sense at all, or am I missing something completely here?? Need help on this from the FM who have installed this kind of system
 
Rajesh, I think that the unpressurised systems allow the water into the tubes, where it heats and rises. The pressurised systems have the heat pipe: it is about 1/4-inch diameter. You cannot see it through the black glass, it is only visible when assembling or replacing a broken tube.

Ours also cost about 20-something-K. it is 150 Litre. It is our second; the first one suffered serious corrosion leakage after just a few years :mad:

I believe subsidy is available for grid-tie solar systems. These systems power your house, and feed back into the grid. People report the delight of watching the meter run backwards during full sunshine! One can think of it as selling power to the local EB. One can also think of it as using the EB as "storage," drawing the power back when there is insufficient sunlight.

The whole thing needs approval, probably a new 2-way meter, and, although it is very much possible, it can be a longish bureaucratic process.

Grid-tie systems do not provide back-up power when there is a power cut. The possibility of them feeding live power into the dead mains, which may electrocute EB workers, is too dangerous. I would of thought isolation would not be a great technical difficulty, but I don't think it is available here. Grid-tie? No EB means no power.

Off-grid systems require us to store the generated electricity. Car batteries are expensive enough. 150-amp-hour inverter batteries are twice the price.

sam9s, as I said, making the sun pay for itself is not yet very feasible unless you have quite a lot of money. I am not sure, but I think you need a minimum 3Kva system to power one AC. Possibly 5. Battery storage to run AC machines off-grid would be prohibitive in both cost... and space.

Inverter ACs and fridges are an easier load. The compressors only have to start up once, and are then permanently running.

Another idea for truly going solar is to convert as much as possible to 12v. Can be done for lighting, probably computers, etc. That eliminates the DC/AC inverter efficiency losses. All this stuff can be done if we have lots of money and, preferably when fitting out a new house!

I'm starting small, and it still going to cost just over a lakh :rolleyes:

And my next new toy on the list... would be a 3Kva portable generator. This would support just one AC machine. It would also run my 2hp drainage pump on those supposed-to-be-once-a-century deluge days. It's a mighty powerful thing... but no good without electricity! That's another lakh or so. Just as bad as having a hifi wish list!

Yes, Rajesh, thanks, we recovered from that deluge. Cyclone Vardha hardly caused us any damage at all, although we had a couple of oh-no-not-again hours when the rain was gaining on our petrol-operated pump. Of course there was no electricity: all the lines had blown down!
 
sam9s, as I said, making the sun pay for itself is not yet very feasible unless you have quite a lot of money. I am not sure, but I think you need a minimum 3Kva system to power one AC. Possibly 5. Battery storage to run AC machines off-grid would be prohibitive in both cost... and space.

Not for 1 TON AC 3 star. What my electrician says 1-1.5KVA is sufficient to run 1 ton AC and another 500va should be enough to run 3-4 LED a 32Inch LED TV and a laptop, that is all I need to cut the summers.

Space is also not an issue as the entire terrace is mine. Coming to cost, that is where I am a bit confused. As I said I already pay an avg bill of 5K and it shoots to 7-8K in summers. Why not take a PL (2-2.5L) for 4-5 years and instead of electricity bill pay the EMI, and get electricity 24x7 (which aint the case otherwise as I have 5-6Hrs cut every day in summers).

I just need help if the logic I am applying seem correct or am I missing something basic. Even if it takes 4-5 years to pay my EMI. Is isnt much considering that after that all my electricity generated will be free. Also batteries replacement cost will also come after 5 years.
 
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What my electrician says 1-1.5KVA is sufficient to run 1 ton AC and another 500va should be enough to run 3-4 LED a 32Inch LED TV and a laptop, that is all I need to cut the summers.
Hmmm... I could go for that. The question in my mind is how many batteries would you need

Or with a grid-tie system, you don't need batteries at all. The EB is your battery. The question is, how regular are power cuts in your area. How long do you want to run some, probably not all, stuff, during them?

Please share your thoughts, because mine are still confused --- and may be even when I go ahed with what I feel I can afford at this time.

Here's another piece of my hazy understanding: 24-volt systems are "better" than 12-volt systems. The higher the DC voltage, the less the current, the thinner the DC wiring can be, and the less loss. Only the smallest systems are 12v.

That means that, for a 24v 1-2kva system, we will need a minimum of two 12v batteries, connected in series. To increase the backup time on battery would then require adding more pairs of batteries in parallel so that the capacity increases but the voltage stays at 24. But there is a limit to how many batteries our solar power controller can charge. When I look at higher-kva systems, I see the voltage going up to 48 and 96.

Two 150amp-hour batteries is probably all I can afford at this time. Might be able to add another pair, say a year later.

One Kw of solar panel is about my lot for now. Again, it would be nice to add more later.

We do not work. Apart from a month or so around December, we have one, sometimes two AC machines running for quite a lot of every day. Our current bills can be over ten k :(

And I'm bad at sums!
 
Forget all that calculation, check this out ..

1kW-10kW Power Plant | SIRMOURI Solar Energy India | Price

A 2KVA COMPLETE system with everything (all accessories), panels, Solar PCU Inverter and 4 Batteries (150 Ah X 12 V) comes to 2 L. If I go for 2.5 KVA. My investment will be around 2.5L, for 5 years I will pay around 5K every month (Bank EMI) and zero electricity bill (as I will go off grid completely). After 5 years when my EMI finishes, I would be generating all electricity for free. Even with AMC of 4500/year (as per site), my per month cost would be 375 Rs. My TOTAL alloted/sanctioned load from electricity dep is 3KVA!!! on which I run every got damm thing, including 1.5 TON AC. So with 2.5 KVA setup I should be able to run 1 ton AC 3-4 LED a 32Inch LED TV and a laptop plus 100-200 W as buffer (router switch STB etc), that is all I need to cut summers.

Your thoughts ..... :)

I am not interested in On grid system as power cuts in summers at my location is high 5-6 hours every day.
 
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Will the off-grid system uses the solar energy first and switch over to grid once additional power is required?

Or is the other way round? I don't want to invest 3L on a off-grid system and use the energy only when the power in the grid goes out.
 
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