Sound quality and HDMI

Audiolab 6000CDT Dedicated CD Transport

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear All

Finally settled for Diamond 9.2 Speakers and also got the centre speaker9cc. Will get the sub and surround later.
I have used the speakers for 15 hours total till now.When I play audio CD in my DVD player (connected by HDMI cable to Onkyo 606) I feel something is missing in the SoundQuality.

Spoke to speaker dealer who suggested changing from HDMI to coaxial cable.

My query is should I go for the change in connection by co axial -cable?
Is that a better option than HDMI cable connection?

Thanks in advance.

ame
 

venkatcr

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
7,167
Points
113
Location
Chennai
Spoke to speaker dealer who suggested changing from HDMI to coaxial cable.

My query is should I go for the change in connection by co axial -cable? Is that a better option than HDMI cable connection?

There are three ways of doing this.

(1) Use a high quality two channel audio cable. Connect the Front R&L/Mixed of the DVD Analogue output to the Front R&L analogue input of the AVR.

Set the DVD Player to one of the following options:

a. If you want pure stereo set the down mix mode to 'Stereo' or 'V.Surround'
b. If you are interested in Dolby Pro Logic, set the down mix mode to 'Lt/Rt'

This method can be used to listen to Redbook CDs.This is the best method for standard Redbook CDs. Use a high quality cable.

(2) Use ether a 75-ohm coaxial digital audio cable with RCA style connectors, or an S/PDIF optical digital cable.

This method can be used to listen to multichannel audio on DVDs. Remember to set the DVD Output to Raw/Bitstream or the AVR will not understand the signals coming in.

(3) Both the above methods are useful when the decoding in the AVR is of high quality. If the decoding in the DVD Player is better, you can use a 6 or 8 RCA style cables to connect the individual channels of the DVD Player to the individual input of each channel in the AVR. In this case, the DVD Player will send data in analogue form to the AVR that will just amplify it for your listening.

Cheers
 

biyer

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2009
Messages
147
Points
18
Location
Pune
Dear All

Finally settled for Diamond 9.2 Speakers and also got the centre speaker9cc. Will get the sub and surround later.
I have used the speakers for 15 hours total till now.When I play audio CD in my DVD player (connected by HDMI cable to Onkyo 606) I feel something is missing in the SoundQuality.

Spoke to speaker dealer who suggested changing from HDMI to coaxial cable.

My query is should I go for the change in connection by co axial -cable?
Is that a better option than HDMI cable connection?

Thanks in advance.

ame


This may be due to differentces in DAC quality between AVR and DVD player.

Nope dont change your cable you will only be wasting your money as it would be the same digital signal (bit for bit) travelling through the cable's.

Instead try connecting the analog outs(only for stereo music) of your dvd player to the AVR aalso maintain ur digital connection at the same time(just for movies and other materials encoded in DD or DTS).
Switch between the two for music or movies.
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear venkatcr

Thanks for your inputs.I am still a bit confused:)

If I understand correctly there are 3 options to improve SQ for me now.

1.Change the connections as per Mr.Venkat's three options.

2.Change the source of sound.(either by installing a) CD player or b) by using a DAC converter.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

ame
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear biyer

Thanks for your response.

Can you please explain how to --"Instead try connecting the analog outs(only for stereo music) of your dvd player to the AVR".

There seems to be quite a bit of info on analog connectivity options for a newbie to decide.:)

Thanks in advance.

ame
 

marsilians

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Messages
2,609
Points
83
Location
117.192.87.109
Dear biyer

Thanks for your response.

Can you please explain how to --"Instead try connecting the analog outs(only for stereo music) of your dvd player to the AVR".

There seems to be quite a bit of info on analog connectivity options for a newbie to decide.:)

Thanks in advance.

ame


YOur AVR has inputs called "CD" usually with red & white connectors. Your CDP/or DVDP has connectors called "Audio" which again are red & white in most cases. Connect like colours by an analogue (RCA connectors) cables.Thats it. Switch your AVR to CD input and play and you should be able to listen to the sources.
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Mr.Venkat

In your valuable article you have mentioned-

"PREFERRED ORDER FOR CONNECTIONS.
One question that many people will have is which is the best connection? I am listing below the order of connections from the worst to the best:

Audio Connections:

Analog left/right - Standard audio hookup; red/white RCA connectors.
Optical Digital - better than analog, same quality as coaxial; red light shines through ends when in use.
Coaxial - better than analog, similar quality as optical; typically orange RCA connector on each end.
5.1 channel input - superior when connecting DVD-Audio or SACD; 5 RCA-terminated cables.
HDMI - carries both audio and video"

Am I missing something here?

ame
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Mr.Venkat

In your valuable article you have mentioned-

"PREFERRED ORDER FOR CONNECTIONS.
One question that many people will have is which is the best connection? I am listing below the order of connections from the worst to the best:

Audio Connections:

1.Analog left/right - Standard audio hookup; red/white RCA connectors.
2.Optical Digital - better than analog, same quality as coaxial; red light shines through ends when in use.
3.Coaxial - better than analog, similar quality as optical; typically orange RCA connector on each end.
4.5.1 channel input - superior when connecting DVD-Audio or SACD; 5 RCA-terminated cables.
5.HDMI - carries both audio and video"

Why are you then suggesting changing from HDMI ?

Am I missing something here?

ame
 

venkatcr

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
7,167
Points
113
Location
Chennai
Why are you then suggesting changing from HDMI ? Am I missing something here?

The order is correct and you are not missing anything.

When you using a DVD Player and an AVR for standard Redbook CD, you are using only two channels. Ame was complaining that the sound was not good. When you use a digital connection, the Digital to Analogue Conversion (DAC) is done by the AVR. In some cases (such as Oppo Players), the DAC is better in the player. When this is true, you can do the DAC conversion in the player itself, and send the music in analogue form to the AVR. The AVR will just amplify the sound for the speakers.

To send the music in analogue form from the DVD Player to the AVR, you cannot use HDMI, optical, or coaxial digital as all these are digital carriers. The only connection you can use is the RCA based Audio cable that has a Red and White color codes. This is used for the front two channels.

Keep in mind this is valid only for two channel music when you are playing a standard Redbook CD. And that too when the DVD Player has better DAC.

For multi channel sound and for video the list you refer to is the best in terms of performance.

Cheers
 

marsilians

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Messages
2,609
Points
83
Location
117.192.87.109
Venkat,

Oooooh, you know that you are opening a big can of worms with the recommendation below. I will stay on the sidelines and watch :)


Dear Mr.Venkat

In your valuable article you have mentioned-

"PREFERRED ORDER FOR CONNECTIONS.
One question that many people will have is which is the best connection? I am listing below the order of connections from the worst to the best:

Audio Connections:

Analog left/right - Standard audio hookup; red/white RCA connectors.
Optical Digital - better than analog, same quality as coaxial; red light shines through ends when in use.
Coaxial - better than analog, similar quality as optical; typically orange RCA connector on each end.
5.1 channel input - superior when connecting DVD-Audio or SACD; 5 RCA-terminated cables.
HDMI - carries both audio and video"

Am I missing something here?

ame
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Mr.Venkat

Thanks for the response.

Well when I replaced the HDMI cable(free one that came with my Sony DVD player ) with a Profigold HDMI cable, --there was an improvement indeed.

"Keep in mind this is valid only for two channel music when you are playing a standard Redbook CD. And that too when the DVD Player has better DAC."

The DVD player I am using is Sony DVP NS708HP and AVR is Onkyo TXSR606.

Is there any way to find out which one has better DAC?

Thanks again for answering newbie questions.

Appreciate the help.

ame
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Friends

While reading the Onkyo TX SR606 manual found the following
"When choosing a connection format ,bear in mind that that the AV receiver does not convert digital input signals for analog line outputs and vice versa."

Does this mean that Onkyo TX SR 606 does not have DAC?

ame
 

marsilians

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Messages
2,609
Points
83
Location
117.192.87.109
Dear Friends

While reading the Onkyo TX SR606 manual found the following
"When choosing a connection format ,bear in mind that that the AV receiver does not convert digital input signals for analog line outputs and vice versa."

Does this mean that Onkyo TX SR 606 does not have DAC?

ame

It most definitely has a DAC.
 

venkatcr

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
7,167
Points
113
Location
Chennai
The 606 most certainly has 192K/24 Bit DACs for all channels. Now which is better? I am not able to find out the specs for Sony so cannot say straight away, but my gut feeling is that the 606 will be better, but I could be wrong.

Borrow a good quality stereo cable and try the DAC of both the DVD Player and the AVR by switching the connection for the same set of songs. That way you can settle for what your ears like.

Cheers
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Venkat

Thanks once again.

Since I dont have any friend to borrow a cable ,I might buy one. Can some one suggest a good brand/spec/ of analog audio cable ?

I am planning to get a DAC. What cable connection would be best in that scenario?

Regards

ame
 

venkatcr

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
7,167
Points
113
Location
Chennai
Since I dont have any friend to borrow a cable ,I might buy one. Can some one suggest a good brand/spec/ of analog audio cable ?

I am planning to get a DAC. What cable connection would be best in that scenario?

There are lots of cables available from various companies. If you are looking at DAC, look at ARX01A, ARX04A, ARA040, AR8111, or AR7401. There is also a PCA091 which I think is very expensive.

Cheers
 
Last edited:

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear Venkat

I think i did not clearly state my query.

" I am planning to get a DAC. What cable connection would be best in that scenario?"
By DAC I meant digital to analog converter. This is my next buy and hopefully permanent fix for improving SQ.
Hope this clarifies.

ame
 

ame

New Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2008
Messages
48
Points
0
Location
Mumbai
Dear All

Yes, since we were discussing cable options and brands DAC seemed like the cable brand.:)

Well their brand recollection is strong as evident by our mistakes,if you ask them they might like to call DAC(the converetr) something else:D

ame
 

venkatcr

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2008
Messages
7,167
Points
113
Location
Chennai
ame; said:
" I am planning to get a DAC. What cable connection would be best in that scenario?" By DAC I meant digital to analog converter. This is my next buy and hopefully permanent fix for improving SQ.

Sorry for that.

The DAC convertor comes between the source (such as a CDP or DVD Player) and the amplifier such as the AVR.

You connect the source to the DAC using a digital cable such as optical or coaxial. From the DAC to the amplifier you use an analogue cable such as an RCA audio cable.

Cheers
 
Top