Sugden A21 Se -Simply Magical

Wharfedale EVO 4.4 Floorstanding Speakers
Probably was quoted 1.5L for A21a Series 2 . My bad, got confused between the two :(. I think the A21 series 2 model has 25W compared to 30W of A21 SE.

PS: Like the fact that indian prices are on par with UK prices :).
 
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Hi all,
Thanks for all your comments on the Sugden ..
I would need advice on the cables (interconnect and Speaker cables).
I am currently using VDH thunderline from Asus Xonar STX card to my amp and hearing some kind on sibilance .('SHHH') Turning the volume up also give more of an attacking sound.This issue was also there when I used MF m3i.I am surprised as the Dyns x12 and Sugden are a warm combination , so there is definitely a flaw in either the interconnect or the source , I can't change the source immediately , so I tried out connecting my spare LG blue ray player for experimentation.This actually gave me better results with low frequencies , but the Mid band became less airy.Is there any temporary solution to this problem as I can't immediately buy a Dac.:cool:
Sugden users , can you please let me know the break in time of the amp.
 
My Sugden Mystro took about 50hrs to break in. Regarding the attacking sound, more than cable, changing the opamps in your STX should give you more satisfactory results. I have the xonar essence one dac and it too is bright and attacking like your STX. I ordered the same opamps as the ones they give with essence one plus edition and put them in. My impression was in line with the description in the table at the URL below. As I said earlier in this thread, I am now planning to upgrade to OPA627 famous for its laid back sound :D.

ASUS - Xonar Essence One Plus Edition

For the sibilance, try to change your ICs/cables to cheapest ones you can find and see if it fixes it. If so, you maybe up for a cable change :).
 
Kushanava said:
Hi all,
Thanks for all your comments on the Sugden ..
I would need advice on the cables (interconnect and Speaker cables).
I am currently using VDH thunderline from Asus Xonar STX card to my amp and hearing some kind on sibilance .('SHHH') Turning the volume up also give more of an attacking sound.This issue was also there when I used MF m3i.I am surprised as the Dyns x12 and Sugden are a warm combination , so there is definitely a flaw in either the interconnect or the source , I can't change the source immediately , so I tried out connecting my spare LG blue ray player for experimentation.This actually gave me better results with low frequencies , but the Mid band became less airy.Is there any temporary solution to this problem as I can't immediately buy a Dac.:cool:
Sugden users , can you please let me know the break in time of the amp.
Click to expand...

Breakin time will not be more than 30 Hrs. I have heard a Sugden with a Dyn 42 as well as an ATC40..the bass struggled with the ATC 40 but for a reasonable room the Dyns played well although could not blast loud.
But yes the sound is Warm and laid back

Sibilance could be due to the Content (many songs do have sibilance as is) and source..very rarely due to Amp/Speaker.

vDH should not be a problem..in fact you should be thinking of low inductance cables like Nordost or Goertz with this amp..i had very good success with Goertz.

I would think the source is your best bet on getting better sound..
 
Hi all,
I have been playing with my setup for a while now with the cables and stuff.Still I think my system is only 65% without a dac.
I am in a dilemma on whether to get a DAC or move into a speaker upgrade first.Actually I need both since I would be moving my bedroom setup to a larger room (20*12 sq ft).

The Dynaudio's are lovely sound but going up their chain will require me to change my amp.So i would like to keep the amp as the base of my system and start looking into the speakers.

I am considering a budget of 1.5L.I may only stretch if there is a significant :eek:hyeah: offer.

The Brands I am looking at is
1.Proacs
2.Rethm
3.Focal

I only have Focal speakers available in kolkata.So i would like some one to throw some light on Rethm Speakers + Sugden ; Proac + Sugden.
How different is the Dynaudio Contours from a Proac or rethm sound ?

I prefer a musical sound , not too analytical (studio like) sound.
 
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Proacs and JM labs with go well with a sugden. So will a Spendor.

For Pure class A amps you should use a speaker which can run it hard...running a Rethm will make your amp steaming Hot as the rethm does not need more than 2W in most cases !
Also since those 2 W better be the best you can give ..you will find more resolution coming when you pair it with SETs .

Anyway If you are used to a Dyna sound you will need to really listen to a Rethm before you go for it..it has a very different presentation. those who love it cannot live without it and vice versa.
 
arj said:
Proacs and JM labs with go well with a sugden. So will a Spendor.

For Pure class A amps you should use a speaker which can run it hard...running a Rethm will make your amp steaming Hot as the rethm does not need more than 2W in most cases !
Also since those 2 W better be the best you can give ..you will find more resolution coming when you pair it with SETs .

Anyway If you are used to a Dyna sound you will need to really listen to a Rethm before you go for it..it has a very different presentation. those who love it cannot live without it and vice versa.
Click to expand...

Ya , you may be right on that Sugden requires something to put a teeth into ..but i was surprised by the way they paired with Audionote ..Extract from Review "Note AN-E SPE/HE speakers I reviewed previously, which at 98dB sensitivity, have proved a marriage made in Heaven for the A21SE."
Sugden Audio A21SE Integrated Amplifier Review | Dagogo | A Unique Audiophile Experience

That is were i thought they would pair well with the rethms
 
Focals are usually termed to be bright ..Which focals do you think should be considered for demo under 1.75 L which would have warmer/neutral signature when paired with sugden.
 
For a small stint I had the Sugden A21a and found them to be bright when paired with vintage B&W DM4. So you may want to take care as I could simply not tame it.

--
helium
Asus Xonar STX + Luxman M-06a + Wharfedale Denton 80th Anniversary LE / Vintage B&W DM4
 
heliumflight said:
For a small stint I had the Sugden A21a and found them to be bright when paired with vintage B&W DM4. So you may want to take care as I could simply not tame it.

--
helium
Asus Xonar STX + Luxman M-06a + Wharfedale Denton 80th Anniversary LE / Vintage B&W DM4
Click to expand...

Just saw your signature. How's the luxman playing ? Should be a good fit with your b&w .
Are you using a preamp ?
 
arj said:
Just saw your signature. How's the luxman playing ? Should be a good fit with your b&w .
Are you using a preamp ?
Click to expand...

Actually I like the Sansui AU-317 better with the B&W DM4. Luxman 'class A' works very well with the Dentons.

--
helium
Asus Xonar STX + Luxman M-06a + Wharfedale Denton 80th Anniversary LE / Vintage B&W DM4
 
sugden makes really good amps. The OP seems so happy with it. Cherish.

@heliumflight

As far i have experienced Luxmans works really good with b&w. At least with my 804s.
 
Tried to revive my old thread ..Though the thread speaks of Sugden , I have already started the discussion on the speakers for upgrade.Adding to these discussion , i am also penning my experience in short on listening to different systems in Perth.I have decided to listen to more systems so that I can form a reference when I listen to the Rethms.

Visited the Surrounds and the Frank Prowse stores today in Perth.
Surrounds: They only had the B&W on display.
Heard the B&W 804D driven by divialet and Naim CD player.The room was moderately treated with Wooden flooring.
Listening time 2 hrs.
Played some instrumental to start with mainly Fusion (Sakti track 2).
Followed by some vocals (Rabindra sangeet -Yatra 2 , Dali reference CD, Ghazals from Gulam Ali and Asha Bhonsle).The first expression was off Wow !!! what clarity and details.Great resolution too..Instruments were well separated and well placed.The bass was taught and very resolved..After 45 mins of listening I realized that I was getting attracted to the hifi attributes rather than listening to music.Slowly the Wow factor died down and I tried enjoy the music.I turned to some soft classical vocals where it had more subtle emotional crests and falls than great dynamics..This is were I felt the sharp edges in sound...The small nuances and harmonics were some how sounding dry , thin and flat , as if you are reading a poetry without emotion ... all the words are there , but somehow the expressions were lacking.After 1:30 hrs I realized that I couldn't listen more as it started to hurt my ears and I was continuously being drawn away from music.I realized these speakers are not for me or not for the kind of music , i like to listen too.But this gave me a good understanding of what resolution can be !!!

Frank Prowse: Today was my second visit .I wanted to listen to Vienna Acoustics Beethoven Grand for the second time.The last time I listened to them , I felt that there was something about them that attracted me.
Listening Time :1 hr.
The speakers were driven by Luxman 20 W class A amp and Luxman CD player.The setup had a totally different presentation compared to the B&W.They lacked the resolution of the B&W.The tone was more rounded and natural.These were really drawing me to the music with the vocals.The speaker to speaker sound-stage and instrument spacing was not as clean as the B&W but still quiet realistic.The only place where they had to bow to the B&W was bass.The bass seemed to be bloated.
The bass resolution was significantly lower and flatter.Not sure it was because of the lack of amplifier power or room booms.We tried to move the speakers forward , that significantly reduced the bass boom , but still didn't give the resolution.However , the sweetness of the tone seems to be the strength of these speakers .They were fun to listen to for all kinds of music.Given their prices they are beautiful speakers.Very musical and tonally rich and something close to what I like.However , the lack of bass control may make me look elsewhere.
 
Was it the Luxman 550AX ? That amp has a lovely warm sound but not enough power and control on the lower frequencies and that may be the reason why the bass was bloated...however the sound is gorgeous in the mids and highs and has a warm, lush presentation...They need high sensitivity speakers to get the best out of the amp...
 
panditji said:
Was it the Luxman 550AX ? That amp has a lovely warm sound but not enough power and control on the lower frequencies and that may be the reason why the bass was bloated...however the sound is gorgeous in the mids and highs and has a warm, lush presentation...They need high sensitivity speakers to get the best out of the amp...
Click to expand...

Can't remember the model number :sad:
 
Next Steps:
Audition speakers in Singapore: I am returning on 23rd Dec on Perth via Singapore.
I have a waiting time of 7 hrs for my next flight from Singapore to Kolkata.Thus thinking of spending 4 hours in Singapore.I am not sure if its easy to get on-arrival visa.

This journey is to tune my ears , and gain experience through listening to various systems. Would love your recommendations of systems I should / must audition within a $15k range.I am personally looking to hear the Harbeths & Proacs and if time permits then PMC and a Single driver speakers.
 
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