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AV reciever will help in improving quality DTH qlty?

Mogami Cables

npejaver

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.
 

spirovious

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.

For budget upto 35k,onkyo 606 can upscale to 1080i,
upto 50k Onk 706,denon 1909 upto 1080p.
I was told AVR can improve DTH,but not as good as DVDp does to DVDs.

Other option is-
Video to VGA (PC/HDTV) Scaler > Maplin
 

moserw

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Depends...
@npejaver - 20K seems a tad high to me. You are better of buying a 29" CRT for around 10K instead that will rock for SD/Tata Sky content.

The problem is SD content will look bad on Full HD LCDs. Nothing much can be done about it except to wait for HD content to start on TV/DTH etc.
 

prakasse

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.

Hi,

AVR's does video upscaling. But the one in mid-end receivers doesn't do a great job to invest money on it.

And at your budget of 20K, we can't expect AVR to do a very good job in upscaling.

One model is Pioneer 1018 which has got good results for video upscaling, but in terms of audio the reviews are not up to the mark. It was available for 500 USD some time back.

Onkyo 875/876 uses latest Reon technology for upscaling. Some of our forum members also use it(I think it is Venkat). Write to him for his comment on its performance(for video upscaling) and lets see if it worth for 1500 USD :)

Thanks,
Prakash.
 

mridulgoel

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.

Hey Buddy

I know, there will be a lot of conflicts with my below comments...but as you asked...

No Reciever/Amplifier/Scaler can upgrade the picture quality...
it just convert the signals into digital mode, or enhance the digital picture into smaller microns, to look picture so called better...

But, if you do a test, or kind of survey, you will find out that actually, there is nothing that has happened, apart from being converted to digital, and the pixels becoming digitally upscaled, which in one or the other way of no use, and looses naturality of the original picture...
If you observe the upscaled picture you will see that the color variations are very less, that is suppose there is a Rose, you select one Petal of, now, observe the same petal in the original 720p version, then upscale it to 1080i version...
In 720p version there will be atleast 100 color variations of Red to white, where in 1080i the color variations will be countable and only static..

Its the same concept of HD Ready TV and a Full HD TV...

So, its just a new way of selling products...
and people like Denon, Cambridge, and all biggies, never give importance to the upscaling part of the Receiver, where guyz like Onkyo and all, count there system the best because of this...

Check it out...
 

venkatcr

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.

One of the easiest way to improve the quality of the signal is to throw away the cable between the set top box and TV, and replace it with a good component or composite cable. For some reason, these companies provide really cheap cables that create crosstalk and signal loss. Try a branded cable such as Bandridge, and you will see an appreciable improvement in sound and picture quality. I had the same issue and a cable change brought about near DVD quality from my DTH connection.

Cheers
 

venkatcr

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MridulGoel said:
I know, there will be a lot of conflicts with my below comments...but as you asked...

I don't want to get into a fight, but Mridul, there are too many errors, omissions, and contradictions in your statements.

MridulGoel said:
No Reciever/Amplifier/Scaler can upgrade the picture quality...it just convert the signals into digital mode, or enhance the digital picture into smaller microns, to look picture so called better...

Which signal are you converting into Digtal mode as you call it? Whether you are watching a DVD or a TV show, the signals are already digital in nature. The days of Analog TV transmission are gone.

When you say 'enhance the digital picture into smaller microns', I assume you are talking about pixels. The number of pixels is a hardware factor of the TV manufacture and cannot be increased or decreased in random by any software or program. Yes, you can populate lesser number of pixels than are available on a TV. But you cannot 'enhance into small microns', or, in others words, increase the number of pixels or make alterations to the size of each pixel.

MridulGoel said:
But, if you do a test, or kind of survey, you will find out that actually, there is nothing that has happened, apart from being converted to digital, and the pixels becoming digitally upscaled, which in one or the other way of no use, and looses naturality of the original picture...

I am sure the design engineers at Sigma Designs, Anchor Bay, Fardoudja and other companies will all be ready to commit suicide if they read this statement of yours. I have explained in detail in many threads how scalers work and what they do. At the most minimum, a scaler will duplicate pixels to fill an entire screen with an enlarged image. This is usually done in computer monitors and in the early stages of LCD and Plasma displays. Without getting into details, let me tell you that modern scalers undertake some or all of the following tasks:
  • Deinterlacing
  • Aspect ratio control
  • Digital zoom and pan
  • Adjustments of Brightness, contrast, hue, saturation, sharpness, and gamma
  • Frame rate conversion
  • Color point conversion
  • Color space conversion (Component to RGB or RGB to Component)
  • Mosquito noise reduction
  • Block noise reduction
  • Detail enhancement
  • Edge enhancement
  • Motion compensation
  • Primary and secondary color calibration that includes hue, saturation, and luminance controls.

MridulGoel said:
If you observe the upscaled picture you will see that the color variations are very less, that is suppose there is a Rose, you select one Petal of, now, observe the same petal in the original 720p version, then upscale it to 1080i version... In 720p version there will be atleast 100 color variations of Red to white, where in 1080i the color variations will be countable and only static..

Its the same concept of HD Ready TV and a Full HD TV...

I just don't know what to say. A scaler reduces color saturation? Even the most incompetent designer will leave the color saturation alone if he can't improve upon it.

MridulGoel said:
So, its just a new way of selling products...and people like Denon, Cambridge, and all biggies, never give importance to the upscaling part of the Receiver, where guyz like Onkyo and all, count there system the best because of this...

(i) Other than the lowest models, Denon has high end scalers from companies such as Fardoudja, Anchor Bay and others in all their receivers.
(ii) Cambridge Audio is a very small player in the AVR market. The market in controlled by Denon, Onkyo and Yamaha. Companies such as Meridian have been having scalers for years. Do you know that Merdian has a scaler that can convert a 1080P signal by 10 times? And they have a projector that can actually display that level of images?
(iii) In the year 2007-2008, Onkyo sold over 55% of the world's AVRs. In addition, Onkyo's Integra and Pro range of processors and amplifiers are stuff of legends. I dont understand how you can call them a 'smallie'.
(iv) One AVR manufacturer who does not have scalers built in is Maramtz, but their reasons are differemt. It has nothing to do with the capabilities of a scaling engine. They reasoned that DVD Players that scale were available in abundance, TV displays have inbuilt de-interlacers and even scalers, and Blu-Ray were around the corner - so why bother with scaling in the AVR also?

Cheers
 

marsilians

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Mridul

I had a hard time understanding your post. From Venkat's replies, I think I know what you might be saying but I am still at a loss re: your suggestions/assertions. Its one thing to make a post but it may cause more harm/confusion if the facts are not right as it appears in your post.

I just don't want people to make decisions on lack of facts or erroneous ones. It may end up being an expensive exercise.
 

mridulgoel

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Dear @LL

I mentioned first thing before answering the post...
That there will be a lot of conflicts on my comments...

Anyways, whoever is going in for the Upscalers, go in and
do the test i have recommended, and then place your comments...

Venkat and Marsilians
Even i dont wanna get into fight...
But Venky, please dont place the copied comments to me...from net or from books...Be Practical...
Its always better to be technical on your practical knowledge...

And if you dont believe my above comments, then just do a excercise, goto Onkyo, Meridian, and anyone else you think have best upscalers...Get to talk to anyone from there Designer team and ask the same question, lets see what response you get...

I have spoken to the designer team of Onkyo, they could not reply me...
Technical Trainer of Denon, flew down to Bangalore, interacted with him, he was not able to answer, and accepted these things being a sales point...

Buddy, if you proove this story, tht means you are changing the technology...
That means no person should go in for Full HD TV, and should buy a HD Ready TV, and use upscalers to get the best of the pictures...

I think manufacturers will die of this shock...

Anyways, its all personal way of thinking...
I have my personal prooved results, and other may have there own...

So, guyz please do the test, and see the results by your own eyes...
 

pradeep_meher1

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Hi,
I have s Samsung 40 inch series 5, and frankly tata sky looks pretty bad on it... wondering if the dth box is connected to the tv through a av reciever would it improve video qlty? If yes which brand would you suggest. Can get a receiver from US and have a budget of Rs20,000.

Hi,

Using AVR is a good option if u can afford it. Otherwise u can try some of the scalers available in the market such as:

eBay India: XCM 1080p Mega-Cool VGA Box (item 280337911692 end time 27-Apr-2009 21:19:47 IST)

eBay India: PSP PS2 Component (Y/Pb/Pr) + VGA + Audio - HDMI Scaler (item 120387443676 end time 12-Mar-2009 16:53:03 IST)

Hope this helps u.

Thanks
 
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