LFE issues with Yamaha HTR-6160

[goose]

Dear All - Have a Yamaha HTR-6160 (purchased from the US recently) and when I set it up here I'm having issues with bass output from the sub.

Have connected the front channels to a pair of Energy C-100 bookshelves and a Yamaha YST SW-216 10" sub.

I'm playing music in 2ch stereo / straight enhancer mode.

The problem is the bass from the sub-woofer is very weak.

I've done the following:I have set the spkr impedance to 8ohms as required.

When I connect the optimizer mic and run the YPAO auto-set up the system picks up the front spkr distances (14ft; room size: 16ft x 14ft)) and level etc almost spot on but it picks the sub as being at 23ft once, (or 1ft every time I run the auto-setup it throws a different value) and sets the sub volume level to 20% and when I listen to this set up, it sounds quite tinny with not even a hint of bass at all. I tried setting the sub-volume to ~60% and re-ran the auto-setup and this time again it got the fronts right, but returned in error/warning that the sub is too loud where infact I again have to put my ear into the bass reflect port to make out if the sub is working at all!

In manual set-up, have set front speakers to small and have set the sub-woofer volume (behind the sub) to slightly less than half (~45%) as recommended in the user's manual.

Wrote to Yamaha customer support and their response was:

"Thank you for your inquiry regarding the Yamaha HTR-6160 A/V receiver. We understand the information that you are looking for. Try setting the the front speakers to large and the bass output to both. In our testing we have found this configuration to provide the most bass output"

Though as per the OM, Yamaha recommends to set spkrs with woofer dia < 6.5" to small, I tried setting the fronts to LARGE and LFE/Bass out to BOTH, still no change. The sub is quite dead.

Have set all other spkrs to NONE.

Have set the LFE/Bass out to SWFR.

Set the cross over @ 80Hz.

Under the Basic Set-up menu, set the spkr volume to ~80% for fronts and ~70% for the sub-woofer.

Have used the GEQ and set the level for each of the 7 frequencies as +3bd, +2db, +1db, 0db, +1db, +2db, + 3db.

Under tone controls I've adjusted the Bass to +6db and Treble to +6db.

However the sound output by the front speakers is clean and strong with no signs of weakness.

I have checked if the sub-woofer works OK by connecting it to my Yamaha RX-797 stereo receiver and confirmed it works fine.
I don't know what else I'm missing but with the above setting when I play 2ch music via my DVD player (Model: Denon 1940CI, connected via RCA jacks to the 2ch DVD audio input behind the receiver), there simply just isn't any bass from the sub at all. To get any decent bass I'll have to turn the sub volume to almost 100% at which point the bass is blurred.

I can try and open the receiver out and see if all connectors are inserted tight, but beyond that don't know what to do.

Please can you suggest what might be wrong, I'm getting worried if there might be something wrong with the pre-amp/connections in the receiver.

thanks

G

 

[venkatcr]

Please understand that when you play 2 channel music, the system is working as a 2.0 system. In other words, there is no data that is going to the sub. So how will you get any sound from the sub? To understand if the sub is working properly, the HT system, in a set up mode, will generate a continuous signal for each channel. In this mode, it will also create a signal for the LFE/Sub. If that works well, then your sub is working all right.

To further ensure that your sub is working well, play a movie, or a media in which you are sure output is going to the sub.

Cheers

 

[Imrahn]

Does the model have pre-outs?If so, try connecting the sub to front=outs and see.

 

[goose]

Apologies, double posted the same content by mistake!

 

[goose]

Please understand that when you play 2 channel music, the system is working as a 2.0 system. In other words, there is no data that is going to the sub. So how will you get any sound from the sub?

@venkat sir:
I would've thought that the LFE circuitary in the receiver does this job of LF seperation (depending on the crossover frequency set) and sends the signals higher than the set xover limit to the fronts and sends the LF signals to the sub irrespective of the no of channels fed.

If there needs to be a separate LF channel feed as you mention, then I would assume that if you were to connect a CD player and via RCA jacks to the receiver (into the assigned CD inputs) and have satellites for fronts then your music would sound almost dead with no bass at all then? But this is hardly the case right?

To understand if the sub is working properly, the HT system, in a set up mode, will generate a continuous signal for each channel. In this mode, it will also create a signal for the LFE/Sub. If that works well, then your sub is working all right.

Yes, the sub does murmur during the autosetup however as I said the system calibrates the levels to +2db (on a scale of +10db) and when you play something with these set levels there is no bass at all.

Will play a 5.1 movie a see if it works, but I guess I either have to connect a coaxial or optical or multichannel 5.1 cables b/w the DVD player and the receiver I guess to carry the entire gamut of signals across?

@ Imrahn - THe HTR-6160 is in essence identical to the RX-V663 and hence has pre-outs for all channels. I did connect the sub to the front pre-outs and there is for sure more bass coming out, however it's not clean & tight (sounds muddled).

anyway, thank you both for your suggestions.

 

[spirovious]

If you use direct mode,sub will be inactive.
With stereo mode you can get LFE/SW.
Again CO can be 100 to get good SW out.
If tracks are less Bassy,then sub out cannot be that deep.

 

[venkatcr]

Will play a 5.1 movie a see if it works, but I guess I either have to connect a coaxial or optical or multichannel 5.1 cables b/w the DVD player and the receiver I guess to carry the entire gamut of signals across?

What is the connection methodology you are using now?

between the DVD and HTR?
between the HTR and speakers?

Cheers

 

[goose]

DVD -> HTR : Philips RCA cables with gold plated terminal ends. (component for video and L/R for audio)
HTR -> Spkrs : 14 gauge copper cables.

 

[venkatcr]

So what you are transferring are just two channel analogue signals. You will not get any sound from the sub as you are not sending any data to the sub at all!!
Unless you are routing all signals through the sub. In which case, try something such as Neo-6.

Cheers

 

[ravidharap]

Dear all, we all know that active sub's accepts only one 1 input which is "Left channel",& till today L,R input ports are Part of every sub.even every sub's apm is dual chanel equiped with one & only 1 Woofer. To get the best out of movies n music go for passive subwoofer hooked to either alternate amp or "B" speaker of your reciever.
Thanks all.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[venkatcr]

Dear all, we all know that active sub's accepts only one 1 input which is "Left channel",& till today L,R input ports are Part of every sub.even every sub's apm is dual chanel equiped with one & only 1 Woofer. To get the best out of movies n music go for passive subwoofer hooked to either alternate amp or "B" speaker of your reciever.

I don't know what you are trying or meaning, but your information is completely wrong and misleading.

Cheers

 

[spirovious]

I don't know what you are trying or meaning, but your information is completely wrong and misleading.

Cheers

Some Sub has 2 LFE input ,one L & other R.They are mostly common for pre in.Like yamaha sub,single LFE has to be connected to Left & same he feels as SW out is from Left ch only.

 

[venkatcr]

Spiro, even my Hsu has L&R inputs and I know what they are there for. Frankly the statement is too confused and confusing for me to even explain.

Cheers

 

[goose]

Finally I fixed it ppl!

There's this good thread on a different forum running to 350odd pages that discusses issues/info related to the Yamaha RX-V663/HTR-6160.

Interestingly there was someone somewhere in the world who had experienced the exact same problem as I had and a system reset as recommended below did the trick for him/her as well as for me.

Here's the link to the thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=18405256#post18405256

And here's the reset procedure:

Follow this procedure to reset the AVR to its factory defaults:

1. Connect the power cable of this unit to the AC outlet.
2. Press the MAIN ZONE ON/OFF key while simultaneously pressing the STRAIGHT and AUDIO SELECT keys. 
Then the self-diagnostic function is activated.
3. Select the self-diagnostic function menu 23. FACTORY PRESET.
4. Select the PRESET RSRV.
5. Turn off the power of this unit and disconnect the power cable from the AC outlet.


Operation procedure of Main menu and Sub-menu
There are 24 main menu items, each of them having sub-menu items.
Main menu selection:
Select the main menu using PROGRAM knob.
Sub-menu selection:
Select the sub-menu using SCENE 2 (forward) / SCENE 1 (reverse) keys or PRESET/TUNING > (forward) / PRESET/TUNING < (reverse) keys

NOTE: THIS PRESET PROCEDURE IS DIFFERENT TO THAT MENTIONED IN THE OWNERS MANUAL AND DOES A COMPLETE FACTORY RESET OF THE RECEIVER. IT ALSO OPENS OUT A MENU TO 23 OTHER PARAMETERS THAT YOU ARE BETTER OFF NOT TO MEDDLE WITH INCASE YOU TRY THE RESET.