LG C9 User Thread (No Price Talk)

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Marakk said:
Ah! Clear in Vivid and Standard mode interpolates more than it does in accurate modes. That's why in 2020, LG changed it to Cinema Clear and Natural. You can try custom trumotion to De-Judder 5 in accurate modes and see how that feels.
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I tried custom at 5 but still the motion is not good as in vivid. Stutter doesn’t change. Wish in other modes we get the motion as smooth as in vivid mode. If u have aqua man in HDR play the middle scene where hero and heroine go to Italy. The scene starts with the camera zooming in fast from the ocean and the heroine gets down from a truck and watches the surroundings with excitement. The camera moves slowly around her. The stutter is horrible on that scene. When the hero walks behind her his face literally flashes cause of the stutter. And also the camera moves left to right showing flowers and pple eating food. There also the stutter is so bad and you feel the screen is flashing. But in vivid it’s very smooth. I would use vivid mode but the expert controls is disabled so I can’t disable dynamic contrast. With dynamic contrast set high it gives a cartoonish look to the image. If only I can disable it I will use vivid
 
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Love4sound said:
I tried custom at 5 but still the motion is not good as in vivid. Stutter doesn’t change. Wish in other modes we get the motion as smooth as in vivid mode. If u have aqua man in HDR play the middle scene where hero and heroine go to Italy. The scene starts with the camera zooming in fast from the ocean and the heroine gets down from a truck and watches the surroundings with excitement. The camera moves slowly around her. The stutter is horrible on that scene. When the hero walks behind her his face literally flashes cause of the stutter. And also the camera moves left to right showing flowers and pple eating food. There also the stutter is so bad and you feel the screen is flashing. But in vivid it’s very smooth. I would use vivid mode but the expert controls is disabled so I can’t disable dynamic contrast. With dynamic contrast set high it gives a cartoonish look to the image. If only I can disable it I will use vivid
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That stutter is a part of 24 fps content. Can't be helped. I notice it in cinemas too, including the scene you mentioned which I saw at IMAX. High contrast scenes have this problem even more. You have to differentiate between the inherent fault of the content itself versus what can be attributed to the fast response of OLED panels. To my eyes, Clear in accurate modes resembles what I see in theaters.
 
Marakk said:
That stutter is a part of 24 fps content. Can't be helped. I notice it in cinemas too, including the scene you mentioned which I saw at IMAX. High contrast scenes have this problem even more. You have to differentiate between the inherent fault of the content itself versus what can be attributed to the fast response of OLED panels. To my eyes, Clear in accurate modes resembles what I see in theaters.
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Yeah but if I watch the same scene in vivid the motion is very good. And similarly many sceneS like this in other movies as well. But in vivid mode all the scenes are very smooth. Just curious how come the variation when motion is set to clear. I did my research in google apparently so many c9 and lg oled owners complain the same that LG has failed only in this area
 
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Love4sound said:
Yeah but if I watch the same scene in vivid the motion is very good. And similarly many sceneS like this in other movies as well. But in vivid mode all the scenes are very smooth. Just curious how come the variation when motion is set to clear. I did my research in google apparently so many c9 and lg oled owners complain the same that LG has failed only in this area
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Smoothness doesn't mean good motion when the content itself is supposed to have stutter. 24 fps has inherent stutter in it, especially fast moving pans and tilts. If a display displays that inherent stutter as smooth, it means that way too much processing and interpolation has been done.

Like I said above, Clear behaves different in Vivid compared to how it does in Cinema or ISF. 2020 had it split into two.
 
Marakk said:
Smoothness doesn't mean good motion when the content itself is supposed to have stutter. 24 fps has inherent stutter in it, especially fast moving pans and tilts. If a display displays that inherent stutter as smooth, it means that way too much processing and interpolation has been done.

Like I said above, Clear behaves different in Vivid compared to how it does in Cinema or ISF. 2020 had it split into two.
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Yeah I understand that it’s how 24fps is but that doesn’t look good and that’s where the tv tech comes in .Here clear is good in vivid and if the same smoothness is there in other accurate modes it would have been good. Cause some scenes it looks bad for me especially the slow panning shots.Lg could have done better.If motion is good and stutter is minimised in vivid mode the same should have been in other modes as well. This is clearly a miss in LG IMO
 
Love4sound said:
Yeah I understand that it’s how 24fps is but that doesn’t look good and that’s where the tv tech comes in .Here clear is good in vivid and if the same smoothness is there in other accurate modes it would have been good. Cause some scenes it looks bad for me especially the slow panning shots.Lg could have done better.If motion is good and stutter is minimised in vivid mode the same should have been in other modes as well. This is clearly a miss in LG IMO
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Lol. Filmmakers' union would hate you for saying that. They are lobbying for the reverse. Anyway, try de-judder 6-7 then. See where that takes you. Standard might also have similar motion to Vivid. Check that too.
 
Marakk said:
Lol. Filmmakers' union would hate you for saying that. They are lobbying for the reverse. Anyway, try de-judder 6-7 then. See where that takes you. Standard might also have similar motion to Vivid. Check that too.
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Yeah I checked all these you have suggested and no improvements with stutter. De-Judder at 6-7 introduces SOAP and more artifacts which is worse then stutter. In my old Sony tv there are 5-6 motion modes like clear, smooth, natural, cinema mode etc. I use standard and it does an excellent job in getting rid of the stutter. Also I know the stutter is an issue with the Oled being fast and accurate with their pixel shifting but still when lg managed to give very good motion in vivid mode I expect the same in other modes as well. Also many feel the same in lg community and complained that LG isn’t taking any initiative to solve this and that Sony motion is slightly better with stutter
 
Love4sound said:
Yeah I checked all these you have suggested and no improvements with stutter. De-Judder at 6-7 introduces SOAP and more artifacts which is worse then stutter. In my old Sony tv there are 5-6 motion modes like clear, smooth, natural, cinema mode etc. I use standard and it does an excellent job in getting rid of the stutter. Also I know the stutter is an issue with the Oled being fast and accurate with their pixel shifting but still when lg managed to give very good motion in vivid mode I expect the same in other modes as well. Also many feel the same in lg community and complained that LG isn’t taking any initiative to solve this and that Sony motion is slightly better with stutter
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Getting rid of the stutter is soap opera effect. What you're seeing with Clear in Vivid is soap opera effect.

Many are also totally happy with not using any interpolation or using Clear. Appeal to many doesn't fit here in the argument.

I'm talking about what we can say without subjectivity. 24 fps has inherent stutter. Higher frame rates have minimal stutter, such as 48 fps and above, that too on really fast moving shots, if at all. Removing stutter from 24 fps soap opera effect. You can't have both. It's not possible. There's no way to remove stutter from 24 fps content without introducing soap opera effect, as the difference between them is the amount of stutter present.

So if any setting is removing stutter in even moderately brisk pans and tilts, it's introducing soap opera effect.
 
Marakk said:
Getting rid of the stutter is soap opera effect. What you're seeing with Clear in Vivid is soap opera effect.

Many are also totally happy with not using any interpolation or using Clear. Appeal to many doesn't fit here in the argument.

I'm talking about what we can say without subjectivity. 24 fps has inherent stutter. Higher frame rates have minimal stutter, such as 48 fps and above, that too on really fast moving shots, if at all. Removing stutter from 24 fps soap opera effect. You can't have both. It's not possible. There's no way to remove stutter from 24 fps content without introducing soap opera effect, as the difference between them is the amount of stutter present.

So if any setting is removing stutter in even moderately brisk pans and tilts, it's introducing soap opera effect.
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SOAP? No way I didn’t notice any soap in vivid mode or in my Sony tv. May be that stutter is minimum and not noticeable in Sony or in vivid mode in the c9. But the stutter I am referring to is very bad and some processing should be done to eliminate them cause it feels like the screen is flashing or flickering. Motion interpolation could have been better in the c9.


LG OLED C9 TruMotion De-Judder causing a lot of artifacts

My C9 with firmware 03.60.04 is causing a lot of artifacts if I enable the TruMotion De-Judder option.It seems the current implementation does have some pretty severe issues with some content.It doesn't matter which level of De-Judder I use, even a value of "1" causes some really nasty artifacts.
lgcommunity.us.com lgcommunity.us.com
 
Love4sound said:
SOAP? No way I didn’t notice any soap in vivid mode or in my Sony tv. May be that stutter is minimum and not noticeable in Sony or in vivid mode in the c9. But the stutter I am referring to is very bad and some processing should be done to eliminate them cause it feels like the screen is flashing or flickering. Motion interpolation could have been better in the c9.


LG OLED C9 TruMotion De-Judder causing a lot of artifacts

My C9 with firmware 03.60.04 is causing a lot of artifacts if I enable the TruMotion De-Judder option.It seems the current implementation does have some pretty severe issues with some content.It doesn't matter which level of De-Judder I use, even a value of "1" causes some really nasty artifacts.
lgcommunity.us.com lgcommunity.us.com
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You need to understand what is soap opera effect. It's just higher frame rate content. Interpolation turns 24fps to higher frame rates by making frames in between.

Stutter exists in 24 fps. Cinematography books detail motion speed in pans and tilts, taking into account that it exists and can be bad. Action films obviously ignore it more and more and nowadays.

If you remove stutter from 24 fps content, it becomes soap opera effect. You can't remove stutter from a brisk pan in 24fps content and still claim there's no soap opera effect. Can't happen.
 
Marakk said:
You need to understand what is soap opera effect. It's just higher frame rate content. Interpolation turns 24fps to higher frame rates by making frames in between.

Stutter exists in 24 fps. Cinematography books detail motion speed in pans and tilts, taking into account that it exists and can be bad. Action films obviously ignore it more and more and nowadays.

If you remove stutter from 24 fps content, it becomes soap opera effect. You can't remove stutter from a brisk pan in 24fps content and still claim there's no soap opera effect. Can't happen.
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I don’t see any SOAP in 24p contents played in my sony or in c9 in vivid with stutter mostly eliminated. As far as I know SOAP is the ghosting effect that u see in fast moving scenes which I noticed when motion is set to smooth. Not only me man many LG oled owners feel that motion could have been better. you are saying for sure stutter should be there.. It looks bad and tv’s with motion interpolation should make it look smooth to an extent. For example my old Sony tv with interpolation it doesn’t introduce much artifacts , SOAP and at the same time makes the motion looks smooth without stutter. You are correct technically when u say that’s how 24p is shot and will look but that is why we have motion interpolation to smoothen it to an extent and in that area I think LG should improve.60-70% clear works fine and does a good job. And in some movies you don’t even notice it. But the remaining 20-30% where you do notice it is bad.
 
Love4sound said:
I don’t see any SOAP in 24p contents played in my sony or in c9 in vivid with stutter mostly eliminated. As far as I know SOAP is the ghosting effect that u see in fast moving scenes which I noticed when motion is set to smooth. Not only me man many LG oled owners feel that motion could have been better. you are saying for sure stutter should be there.. It looks bad and tv’s with motion interpolation should make it look smooth to an extent. For example my old Sony tv with interpolation it doesn’t introduce much artifacts , SOAP and at the same time makes the motion looks smooth without stutter. You are correct technically when u say that’s how 24p is shot and will look but that is why we have motion interpolation to smoothen it to an extent and in that area I think LG should improve.60-70% clear works fine and does a good job. And in some movies you don’t even notice it. But the remaining 20-30% where you do notice it is bad.
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You are misunderstanding soap opera effect then. Playing 24fps films with interpolated frames to make it look like higher frame rates, which were used for filming soap operas, is soap opera effect. What's the biggest difference between motion of 24 fps content and 48 fps? The stutter should be in the top differences, if not the biggest one. So you can't remove stutter and then still claim there's no soap opera effect. That is the hallmark sign of soap opera effect. Everything is smooth, like it was in soap operas, which were shot at higher frame rates.

A brisk panning shot at 24 fps will have stutter. That's just the way it is. 48 fps for example will have minimal stutter on the same shot. If you remove stutter via motion interpolation, that's soap opera effect. Simple. Whether ghosting or artifacts happen or not is not soap opera effect. That's the quality of motion interpolation algorithm. So you're mixing up two different things.

Clear on Vivid is soap opera effect. Period.
 
Love4sound said:
I don’t see any SOAP in 24p contents played in my sony or in c9 in vivid with stutter mostly eliminated. As far as I know SOAP is the ghosting effect that u see in fast moving scenes which I noticed when motion is set to smooth. Not only me man many LG oled owners feel that motion could have been better. you are saying for sure stutter should be there.. It looks bad and tv’s with motion interpolation should make it look smooth to an extent. For example my old Sony tv with interpolation it doesn’t introduce much artifacts , SOAP and at the same time makes the motion looks smooth without stutter. You are correct technically when u say that’s how 24p is shot and will look but that is why we have motion interpolation to smoothen it to an extent and in that area I think LG should improve.60-70% clear works fine and does a good job. And in some movies you don’t even notice it. But the remaining 20-30% where you do notice it is bad.
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Please update to 4.80 firmware ... And try the "clear" motion on Isf bright/ dark room mode ... You may not notice any stutter
 
rajarshi_zma said:
Please update to 4.80 firmware ... And try the "clear" motion on Isf bright/ dark room mode ... You may not notice any stutter
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In ISF dark room yeah I am talking about HDR, SDR modes such as cinema, ISF technicolor. Mine is already updated to 4.80.
 
Marakk said:
I don't notice any changes with the new update in motion either. I checked with the 24 fps motion test and some scenes that I use for artifacts too.
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Actually I just update for the sake of updating. Everything is good as it is and don’t expect any changes. Let the tv stay this way for 5 more years
 
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