Mega IC Shootout

[jls001]

Update:
Got another IC yesterday to muddy the waters further - the Mogami 2803. The cable is being burned in. Will post impressions after proper burn-in. Initial impression is that it beats all cables tested thus far on most parameters, with a further layer (or two) of grit peeled away, but the muck in the bass should hopefully crytallize with more hours. And the slight edginess in the highs should mellow down, too.

And I didn't expect the cable to be this thin! Or this rigid

 

[jls001]

Update:
The 2803 is sounding better by the day. Bass has tightened substantially. The HF grit has also been tamed considerably. Need to try out on the analog chain too to hear if it improves things.

Also, the rest of the gang that mini GB-ed this cable are going bananas over the improvement that this cable had wrought in their respective systems. Gentleman, please feel free to chip in with your listening impressions.

 

[Nikhil]

Joshua,

Can you share which RCA plug you're using for the Mogami 2803 cable?

Regards.

 

[captrajesh]

the rest of the gang that mini GB-ed this cable are going bananas over the improvement that this cable had wrought in their respective systems.

Whoa, didn't know about this! Could you share the details of where this was sourced from?

 

[jls001]

Can you share which RCA plug you're using for the Mogami 2803 cable?

It's Amphenol APRC (with fancy white barrel)

 

[sann]

Could you share the details of where this was sourced from?

Hello Captain,
It was sourced from Mogami Japan(mogami-wire.co.jp), came through their Srilankan Distributor.
FM svaze took all the pains of importing.
-sann'

 

[captrajesh]

Now it emerges that the top contenders are the Gotham GAC2, the Mogami W2549 and the Mogami W2803. However Jls001 & Record Player etc. have also made interconnects with the Mogami W2806 cable:

http://www.hifivision.com/audio-vid...-italian-reference-diy-rca-interconnects.html

http://www.hifivision.com/audio-vid...rence-diy-rca-interconnects-4.html#post612549

Have you guys compared the top contenders i.e. W2803 and GAC2 with W2806? Also, there is one more company called Canare. Has anyone made cables with them too?

You guys would be doing an eoman service if you could tour these cables amongst experienced FMs located in different places so that these could be put to test.

I was browsing the website of Mogami but couldn't locate the W2803 cable. All I got during the search was was this page where it is mentioned as under:

For the very highest quality recording applications, Mogami original high-end Neglex audio cable Part No. W2803 or Part No. W2497 constructed with patented Double - Cylindrical structure should be used.

However neither of the cables are listed on the Mogami website. However, I've located W2497 on Redco Audio site where it is listed as "High-end Unbalanced Interconnect Cable" and sold @ $ 3.65 per foot: Mogami W2497 | Redco Audio

Is it that the cables have been withdrawn by Mogami to be sold to OEM cable guys? Looks likely but I'm not sure. Does anyone has any information?

 

[sann]

Hello Captain,

Here it is:
http://www.mogami-wire.co.jp/sales/neglex/2803.html

Looks like they dont have the sales page in English, please translate, the mail order link is at the bottom.

Regards,
sann'

 

[jls001]

??????????????????

I tried Google translate and the result is hilarious
Goes to show that machine translation has a long, long way to go before things become coherent and seamless.

But the gist seems to be that the 2803 is a very high resolution cable (I completely agree here). I'm quite surprised that characteristic impedance is stated as 50 ohms. I thought it would be 600.

Also it seems to suggest that 2497 is a coaxial cable with characteristic impedance of 75 ohms, and can double for video duties.

Here's the link to the Mogami catalog for 2014. Please do a search for 2803 within the PDF doc. It gives an interesting insight into how and why 2803 and 2804 came about. Also, within the catalog there is a proper English version of the text provided in the link from sann.


https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&s...rNk-FkFTtw69bUPvA&sig2=EwW3twB6Hv9R3M3nXfjpsg

Adding some photos of the cables:

1) Gotham GAC-2 showing model number

2) Gotham GAC-2 showing part number

3) Gotham GAC-2 showing URL:

4) GAC-2 with REAN NYS373 RCA termination:

5) Gotham GAC-2 with Neutrik ProFi termination:

6) Reference Lab RMIC05:

7) Reference Lab RMIC05 stripped and prepared for soldering:

8) Ref Lab RMIC05 - completed cable:

9) Helukabel Helusound 400031 DMX/AES Cable label:

10) Helukabel Helusound 400031 DMX/AES - Completed Pair

11) Mogami W2549 label:

12) Mogami 2549 with Amphenol APRC RCA

13) AudioArt IC3:

14) Crimson Audio RM Music Link - label:

15) Crimson Audio RM Music Link - Pair:

 

[captrajesh]

Thank you for sharing the pics. Are the Crimson Audio RM Music Link cables terminated with Eichmann Bullets?

 

[jls001]

Thank you for sharing the pics. Are the Crimson Audio RM Music Link cables terminated with Eichmann Bullets?

Yes, those are Eichmann Bullets.

 

[captrajesh]

I have made two pairs of interconnects using Mogami 2549 cables, one pair with these and the other with Neutriks. The ones with Eichmann Bullets had incredibly low capacitance and sounded better when we did a one on one comparison.

 

[jls001]

I have made two pairs of interconnects using Mogami 2549 cables, one pair with these and the other with Neutriks. The ones with Eichmann Bullets had incredibly low capacitance and sounded better when we did a one on one comparison.

The shield to conductor capacitance (K0 in Mogami parlance) for the 2549 is 75 pF/m, and conductor to conductor (K1) is 11 pF/m. It's interesting to know that the capacitance with the Bullets is lowered. How was this measured - shield to conductor or conductor to conductor? Or both? Do you recall the new values?

 

[jls001]

Update:
Got another IC yesterday to muddy the waters further - the Mogami 2803. The cable is being burned in. Will post impressions after proper burn-in. Initial impression is that it beats all cables tested thus far on most parameters, with a further layer (or two) of grit peeled away, but the muck in the bass should hopefully crytallize with more hours. And the slight edginess in the highs should mellow down, too.

And I didn't expect the cable to be this thin! Or this rigid

Update:
The 2803 is sounding better by the day. Bass has tightened substantially. The HF grit has also been tamed considerably. Need to try out on the analog chain too to hear if it improves things.

Just to put a closure to the Mogami 2803 story: let's just say that I like this cable so much that I have ended buying two more pairs to wire up both CDp and analog chains. It does tone right like no other cable I have had, besides being the most resolving, and bettering all my other cables in other parameters. Very good cable for a modest outlay.

It looks like other users are also equally impressed. A verbatim quote from one of them: "Can't believe. It has improved every aspect of music. The sense of space around the instruments, they are just floating there. Lot of details. Crisp and pristine highs. It's like system came back after a dry cleaning"

Just to clarify:
2803 is a coaxial cable, 50 Ohms characteristic impedance, and is inherently unbalanced, and not suitable for balanced applications. For those who may want a similar cable for digital applications, the 2497 is 75 Ohms coax.

 

[captrajesh]

How was this measured - shield to conductor or conductor to conductor? Or both? Do you recall the new values?

I got the plugs soldered through Mathew Syriac who helps his Dad run a Electronics / Computer repair workshop. They have all the required equipment. We have used so many gadgets in the past including a spectrometer on several of our equipments that I don't recollect how it was measured and what were the values but remember the capacitance to be incredibly low.

 

[omishra]

I listened to Mogami 2803 for 2 weeks. Initially I liked it, but after 2 week it confirmed it is the best. Now I changed all interconnects to Mogami 2803. It cost me equal to small HiFi System but it made my listening pleasure manifold - clarity, imaging etc.

 

[jls001]

I was about to buy the mogami 2497. But it seems, as you have shared, mogami 2803 would be a better option for unbalanced connections between the source-preapm and preamp-amp. Please current me if I am wrong.

I can buy mogami 2497 for about $1 a foot but not able to get my hands on the 2803. Could you point me to a source for these and what is the price?

Thanks.

I am yet to listen to the 2497 so can't comment on the sonics.

For 2803, do give magma a shout as he is now the Indian distributor.

 

[Record Player]

Have to agree here. The 2803 is outstanding! Currently using this on me 401 and its brilliant. Need to complete the entire chain now with the 2803. Finally an IC to settle down with .

 

[jls001]

One more question:

Mogami 2803 is single core shielded cable so its like single channel audio cable.

Mogami 2549 is dual core (two wires) shielded cable. So it can be used as a balanced cable. However I do remember reading a thread where it was used as unbalanced. One inner core wire was shorted with the shield and thus it was connected with the RCA male connector.

Or the two inner core wires can also be shorted and with the outer shield as the other polarity and the cable can be connected to the RCA connector.

Which one of these two are better? For making unbalanced RCA male to male cable, about 2 feet length.

Thanks. Sorry my language is layman's wrt DIY cables.

The way I make unbalanced cables when using balanced cables: use one of the cores as signal +ve (center pin of RCA) and short the other core wire to shield.

But one can short the two core wires and use as +ve and use shield as -ve. Difference: the core in this case will have half the resistance of single core. But we're talking about some small fraction of an Ohm. For example W2549 inner conductor has a DC resistance of 0.058?/m(0.018?/Ft) (see here). So doubling the cores will give us 0.029 ?/m. I honestly don't how that affects the audio May be some of our knowledgeable members can enlighten us.

A third option is to NOT use second core. Just leave it open/unsoldered.

Have a look at Rane Notes.

For making a balanced to unbalanced cable, see post # 8 here. This is the so-called the pseudo-balanced cable. I use it all the time

 

[Hari Iyer]

The way I make unbalanced cables when using balanced cables: use one of the cores as signal +ve (center pin of RCA) and short the other core wire to shield.

But one can short the two core wires and use as +ve and use shield as -ve. Difference: the core in this case will have half the resistance of single core. But we're talking about some small fraction of an Ohm. For example W2549 inner conductor has a DC resistance of 0.058?/m(0.018?/Ft) (see here). So doubling the cores will give us 0.029 ?/m. I honestly don't how that affects the audio May be some of our knowledgeable members can enlighten us.

A third option is to NOT use second core. Just leave it open/unsoldered.

Have a look at Rane Notes.

For making a balanced to unbalanced cable, see post # 8 here. This is the so-called the pseudo-balanced cable. I use it all the time

An op-amp based unbalanced to balance and vice-versa can be found in this link Balanced Line Driver & Receiver