Planning for an HT upgrade : From 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in a 150 Sqft room..

[elangoas]

Hi All,

Planning for an upgrade, from 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in my living room..

Room dimensions : 14ft (W) x 11ft (L), 150 Sqft room..
Screen : DIY 100 inch Acoustic Transparent screen, 16:9 Aspect ratio ..
Projector : Xgimi H1, 1080p (DLP-LED projector)..
Current AVR : Denon x 3300
Speakers : Taga Harmony Platinum series..
Subwoofer : Quad DIY sealed passive subs, powered externally..
Power amps : 12 Channels (8 Channel Sonodyne Power amp + 4 Channel power amp) has both RCA & XLR inputs..
Acoustics : 100 cuft of Uncompressed rock wool spread evenly on the ceiling, approx 40 Sqft of acoustic foams on front wall (besides the DIY screen)..

Tentative upgrade : Denon x 6700 / Marantz 8015 / Marantz AV 7706 (to be announced) / 13.2 capable processor from any other popular AVR brand..

Denon x 6700 and Marantz SR 8015 both have support for front wide speakers and have 13.2 pre-outs.. I believe the upcoming processor from Marantz (AV7706) too would be 13.2 capable..

The DTS X Pro support on the above models makes an interesting, possible speaker layout in my room..

What interests me in upgrade..

- Pre-amp mode on the AVR, which gives the flexibility of AVR acting as a processor on budget.

- Support for front wides (I can't do a surr back in the room as i sit against the back wall, but can accommodate front wides, and native support from both Dolby Atmos and Dts X formats)..

- Provision for 6 height speakers and an interesting speaker layout for Dts X..

Dts X Pro seems a look alike of Auro 3D speaker layout from the above image..

How much of a difference would it be between a premium AVR like Denon x 6700, Marantz SR 8015 Vs a standalone multichannel processor (Marantz AV7705, 6) ?..

 

[RajithKumar]

Hi All,

Planning for an upgrade, from 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in my living room..

Room dimensions : 14ft (W) x 11ft (L), 150 Sqft room..
Screen : DIY 100 inch Acoustic Transparent screen, 16:9 Aspect ratio ..
Projector : Xgimi H1, 1080p (DLP-LED projector)..
Current AVR : Denon x 3300
Speakers : Taga Harmony Platinum series..
Subwoofer : Quad DIY sealed passive subs, powered externally..
Power amps : 12 Channels (8 Channel Sonodyne Power amp + 4 Channel power amp) has both RCA & XLR inputs..
Acoustics : 100 cuft of Uncompressed rock wool spread evenly on the ceiling, approx 40 Sqft of acoustic foams on front wall (besides the DIY screen)..

Tentative upgrade : Denon x 6700 / Marantz 8015 / Marantz AV 7706 (to be announced) / 13.2 capable processor from any other popular AVR brand..

Denon x 6700 and Marantz SR 8015 both have support for front wide speakers and have 13.2 pre-outs.. I believe the upcoming processor from Marantz (AV7706) too would be 13.2 capable..

The DTS X Pro support on the above models makes an interesting, possible speaker layout in my room..

What interests me in upgrade..

- Pre-amp mode on the AVR, which gives the flexibility of AVR acting as a processor on budget.

- Support for front wides (I can't do a surr back in the room as i sit against the back wall, but can accommodate front wides, and native support from both Dolby Atmos and Dts X formats)..

- Provision for 6 height speakers and an interesting speaker layout for Dts X..

Dts X Pro seems a look alike of Auro 3D speaker layout from the above image..

How much of a difference would it be between a premium AVR like Denon x 6700, Marantz SR 8015 Vs a standalone multichannel processor (Marantz AV7705, 6) ?..

IMO Since you already have the required power amps.Better to wait for AV processor and get it.
For me Auro 3d & Dts Pro layout looks to be good.
But in your case ,since you sit against the back wall ,the rear heights may not be workable IMO since it may deviate from Dolby/Auro/Dts X guidelines.
Instead I feel u can plan for Front Heights & Top Middle configuration (Above ur MLP ,which u already have I remember).
The center heights (As per dts X pro /Auro spec) can be tried in case the AVR/processor manufacturer has enabled as an option in the Amp asign menu for the above said layout.
In the base layer u can plan for 7 speakers with Front wides as you mentioned.

For your final question ,since processors have dedicated units and higher output voltage in pre section ,definetly is a added advantage ,and power amp get an higher gain factor .

 

[elangoas]

Better to wait for AV processor and get it.

Cost is the only factor.. Else AV processor it would be..

But in your case ,since you sit against the back wall ,the rear heights may not be workable IMO since it may deviate from Dolby/Auro/Dts X guidelines. Instead I feel u can plan for Front Heights & Top Middle configuration (Above ur MLP ,which u already have I remember).

True.. I was thinking of rear heights, mounted high on the wall near ceilings (above the surrounds speakers)..

For your final question ,since processors have dedicated units and higher output voltage in pre section ,definetly is a added advantage ,and power amp get an higher gain factor .

Ok. But, i recollect an article from audioholics articles, where they tested the pre-out voltage from Denon AVR and it seemed to have more than required voltage.. So was also taking that into account..

Or do you mean XLR outputs have higher gain over RCA outputs..

 

[RajithKumar]

True.. I was thinking of rear heights, mounted high on the wall near ceilings (above the surrounds speakers)..

if u do that then it is called surround heights which Auro3d uses in their layout . Still if u prefer do that ,then u r deviating the dolby Atmos spec .Th may be like cheating the AVR to consider it like rear heights .I don't know whether u may get the true immersiveness as per the director intented.
In case if u set amp assign as surround heights ,then during ATMOS playback ,only front heights will be playing not the surround heights.
Since Atmos has more content and market leading currently I believe ,stick to Atmos spec.


Regarding the pre-out voltage of AVR ,only Bench test will reveal the secrets I beleive ,the manufacturer will however claim higher values.Please check that whether that the article is a Bench test report or not.
Processor will have balanced XLR output ,which is superior and advantage for urself ,since you have power amps with XLR input.

What I understand ,Now the 2020 models have pre-amp mode which will be active only in case if u run all channels with external power amplifier .(I'm not 100% sure).
If that the case,why one need to select AVR instead buy a processor, if budget is not a constraint.
Also read in some article that Denon 2020 model AVR has some issues .Lets wait and watch.

 

[Spinekar]

Hi All,

Planning for an upgrade, from 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in my living room..

Room dimensions : 14ft (W) x 11ft (L), 150 Sqft room..
Screen : DIY 100 inch Acoustic Transparent screen, 16:9 Aspect ratio ..
Projector : Xgimi H1, 1080p (DLP-LED projector)..
Current AVR : Denon x 3300
Speakers : Taga Harmony Platinum series..
Subwoofer : Quad DIY sealed passive subs, powered externally..
Power amps : 12 Channels (8 Channel Sonodyne Power amp + 4 Channel power amp) has both RCA & XLR inputs..
Acoustics : 100 cuft of Uncompressed rock wool spread evenly on the ceiling, approx 40 Sqft of acoustic foams on front wall (besides the DIY screen)..

Tentative upgrade : Denon x 6700 / Marantz 8015 / Marantz AV 7706 (to be announced) / 13.2 capable processor from any other popular AVR brand..

Denon x 6700 and Marantz SR 8015 both have support for front wide speakers and have 13.2 pre-outs.. I believe the upcoming processor from Marantz (AV7706) too would be 13.2 capable..

The DTS X Pro support on the above models makes an interesting, possible speaker layout in my room..

What interests me in upgrade..

- Pre-amp mode on the AVR, which gives the flexibility of AVR acting as a processor on budget.

- Support for front wides (I can't do a surr back in the room as i sit against the back wall, but can accommodate front wides, and native support from both Dolby Atmos and Dts X formats)..

- Provision for 6 height speakers and an interesting speaker layout for Dts X..

Dts X Pro seems a look alike of Auro 3D speaker layout from the above image..

How much of a difference would it be between a premium AVR like Denon x 6700, Marantz SR 8015 Vs a standalone multichannel processor (Marantz AV7705, 6) ?..

It never ends
All the very best

 

[Love4sound]

Buying the 6700/8015 for the pre-amp mode makes no sense. Better to buy a processor if you are going to use external amp for all channels.

 

[sandeeprawat]

Hi All,

Planning for an upgrade, from 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in my living room..

Room dimensions : 14ft (W) x 11ft (L), 150 Sqft room..
Screen : DIY 100 inch Acoustic Transparent screen, 16:9 Aspect ratio ..
Projector : Xgimi H1, 1080p (DLP-LED projector)..
Current AVR : Denon x 3300
Speakers : Taga Harmony Platinum series..
Subwoofer : Quad DIY sealed passive subs, powered externally..
Power amps : 12 Channels (8 Channel Sonodyne Power amp + 4 Channel power amp) has both RCA & XLR inputs..
Acoustics : 100 cuft of Uncompressed rock wool spread evenly on the ceiling, approx 40 Sqft of acoustic foams on front wall (besides the DIY screen)..

Tentative upgrade : Denon x 6700 / Marantz 8015 / Marantz AV 7706 (to be announced) / 13.2 capable processor from any other popular AVR brand..

Denon x 6700 and Marantz SR 8015 both have support for front wide speakers and have 13.2 pre-outs.. I believe the upcoming processor from Marantz (AV7706) too would be 13.2 capable..

The DTS X Pro support on the above models makes an interesting, possible speaker layout in my room..

What interests me in upgrade..

- Pre-amp mode on the AVR, which gives the flexibility of AVR acting as a processor on budget.

- Support for front wides (I can't do a surr back in the room as i sit against the back wall, but can accommodate front wides, and native support from both Dolby Atmos and Dts X formats)..

- Provision for 6 height speakers and an interesting speaker layout for Dts X..

Dts X Pro seems a look alike of Auro 3D speaker layout from the above image..

How much of a difference would it be between a premium AVR like Denon x 6700, Marantz SR 8015 Vs a standalone multichannel processor (Marantz AV7705, 6) ?..

Just buy a movie hall

 

[alphacentury100]

Go for the Pre/Pro bro, that will have better sound quality than using an AVR as Pre amp. The Marantz AV7705 and AV8805 are good options to begin with.

 

[elangoas]

If that the case,why one need to select AVR instead buy a processor, if budget is not a constraint.

Better to buy a processor if you are going to use external amp for all channels.

Go for the Pre/Pro bro, that will have better sound quality than using an AVR as Pre amp. The Marantz AV7705 and AV8805 are good options to begin with.

Sure.. AV processor is also what i would prefer, but given the very high cost in India, makes me look for other inexpensive options..

Regarding the pre-out voltage of AVR ,only Bench test will reveal the secrets I beleive ,the manufacturer will however claim higher values.Please check that whether that the article is a Bench test report or not.

The below text is from Audioholics website, on the review of Denon x 3300 AVR and measurement of RCA Pre-outs voltage.

Here is the link to the article - https://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/denon-avr-x3300w-1/measurements

Denon AVR-X3300W Preamplifier Measurements

One thing I really love about Denon receivers is they NEVER skimp on their preamp out circuits. Like past models, the AVR-X3300W had an ample amount of drive. I measured a whopping 4.5Vrms unclipped output, which is more than double the voltage needed to make virtually any amplifier reach full rated power. Yamaha please pay attention and step your game up particularly with your AV receivers in this price range that clip above 1.6Vrms. A preamp output of less than 2Vrms is unacceptable in my book.

Just buy a movie hall

Good one.. Adding more speakers at home, for sure is exciting..

For modest room size, 13.2 set-up should be great one..

 

[Love4sound]

Sure.. AV processor is also what i would prefer, but given the very high cost in India, makes me look for other inexpensive options..

Yeah 6700 and the 8015 are inexpensive options

 

[buxx]

ASR did a review of the Marantz Pre .. Did not measure well..

 

[elangoas]

Yeah 6700 and the 8015 are inexpensive options

True.. Any idea on the last known best price of Denon x 6x00 series in India?..

ASR did a review of the Marantz Pre .. Did not measure well..

Yes, read that article.. But guess we don't have many choices.. If they had reviewed other AV processors too, then would have been good to know..

 

[sud98]

Hi Elango,

Best of Luck for your new adventure

For the life of me, I cant imagine how you will fit 7.4.6 esp. since your subs are already overhead and that too in a 150sqft room with the listening position against the back of the wall.

Check this pdf if you havent already from Dolby

https://www.dolby.com/siteassets/technologies/dolby-atmos/atmos-installation-guidelines-121318_r3.1.pdf

 

[Love4sound]

True.. Any idea on the last known best price of Denon x 6x00 series in India?..

Well being in chennai we do have another route to make it really inexpensive if you know what i mean

 

[VRavichandar]

Hi All,

Planning for an upgrade, from 5.4.2 to 7.4.6 set-up in my living room..

bug bite again! .
Yours is always a journey! All the very best!

 

[elangoas]

Hi Elango,

Best of Luck for your new adventure

Thanks Sudhir.. Sure. the Dts X Pro set-up seems exciting.. An option to expand more overhead speakers, which i always liked..

For the life of me, I cant imagine how you will fit 7.4.6 esp. since your subs are already overhead and that too in a 150sqft room with the listening position against the back of the wall.

This is my current room layout..

For now, i have 5 speakers in the bed layer, with a provision to add front wides.. The approx gap between Front Left & Surr left is 10 ~ 11ft.. That is a huge gap.. Front wides in-between them at 5.5 ft gap should fill the bed layer of speakers nicely.. So that makes it 7 speakers in the bed layer..

4 subwoofer mounted to ceiling.. No change to that for now.

But for the Dts X Pro, there are 3 height speakers on the front wall.. Similar to L-C-R, but high on front walls.. So that is also possible in my room.. Given the room width is 14ft.. Can space it nicely, like i have done for L-C-R..

If i wish to do as per the Dts X Pro layout, the only issue i see is with rear heights, which mounting to high side walls is the only option (compromised option) in my room, as i sit very close to back wall.. Only if i mount them to side walls, i can make space for a single center height..

Check this pdf if you havent already from Dolby

https://www.dolby.com/siteassets/technologies/dolby-atmos/atmos-installation-guidelines-121318_r3.1.pdf

Thanks for this.. Have checked this before. Will check in detail..

Well being in chennai we do have another route to make it really inexpensive if you know what i mean

You read me..

 

[elangoas]

bug bite again! .

It has been a long journey since Onkyo 5.1 HTIB..

Yours is always a journey! All the very best!

Ha ha.. Thank you very much.. Just exploring possibilities..

 

[buxx]

Just an input.. cramming more speakers is not going to improve the surround experience.

You really need to move your seating position a bit farther away from the back wall..
That alone will give some semblance of 7-Ch separation to the speaker bed layer ..

 

[elangoas]

Just an input.. cramming more speakers is not going to improve the surround experience.

Sorry, i differ here.. More the speakers, better the envelopment..

You really need to move your seating position a bit farther away from the back wall..

Don't have much choice to move.. It is a living room.. It is just at-best 6 inches away from rear wall..

That alone will give some semblance of 7-Ch separation to the speaker bed layer ..

I think, i should be able to have a decent of seperation between the bed layer, as it closely matches with Dolby layout speaker angles..

 

[elangoas]

For the life of me, I cant imagine how you will fit 7.4.6 esp. since your subs are already overhead and that too in a 150sqft room with the listening position against the back of the wall.

Here is an approximation.. My existing layout..




Speaker layout that can be modified to accomodate Dts X pro Layout