Playing Speaker Poker with mpws NAD356

[corElement]

Popcorn produces too much distortion while listening to music!

 

[ruenigma]

Popcorn produces too much distortion while listening to music!

good one!

 

[mpw]

venk,

we auditioned the floorstanders v7.. not referring to the BS v7 which i suspect would sound better ( if the person is not looking for too much bass and has a smaller room )


mpw

I was surprised by comments on paradigm 7 series. Is it because nad being bass heavy. Mine sounds good with denon

 

[mpw]

agree jau.. the pricing also made me forget them ( Rs 2.05 L MRP ) ( besides the great sound which made me forget they were there )

mpw
======================================

Denom, That was my reaction too when I listened to Synchrony 2 FS. I had gone there to check NAD CD player actually. Initially they connected it to some Image series bookshelf which I did not like at all (price was 25k-30k). So I asked then to connect better speakers and by chance Synchrony was ready , so they connected it. During audition I forgot about CDP and fell in love with the speakers. The overall sound was just perfect for my taste and my kind of music. That is a real speaker where you forget bass/mid/highs but you just enjoy music as a whole . As I had gone for CDP, I didn't try other speakers though.

 

[mpw]

denom - firstly thanks for a long and detailed post. I would not have found so much time at all considering we returned late at night and i was under the pump )

this round of auditions has amazed me. the first time - about 2.5 yrs ago when i finally bought the titans ( i did not know much then.. but got lucky with the Titans ).

At this point.. i must pay a tribute to the way the Titans are built ( the looks dept and presentation esp on stands ) and they way they sound with their large drivers. The only thing.. i wished they had better tweeters but at the price you pay.. there is nothing ( to my mind ) that comes close.

IMHO.. the Titans on stands Vs Dali lektor6 would be a nobrainer ( with NAD C356 ).. the Titans with RX6 ( again a no brainer ).. the Titans win hands down (for me ). I love them very much but must now look ahead.

Look forward to hearing the Tannoy DC6T and if ok with Hemant the Mercury M3 ( i like the spec very much.. 2 way FS (not 2.5 way )).

But whenever i have gone in with huge expectations ( like for lektor6 ).. i have been let down. ( again - i repeat - this is not a commentary on the speaker but just the combo with the amp )

rgds,
mpw

 

[corElement]

The lektor is a low end series, why did you have high expectations of it? hehe

 

[denom]

@denom: Next time you go hunting speakers remind me to put some pop-corn in the oven and brew some coffee. Man it takes time to go over all the juicy tidbits.

Now lets go over some of the speakers that I've heard with the C356.

1. The synchrony FS (both 1 and 2): Both sounded hollow underpowered and recessed with the C356 as well as the C375 I am still surprised you enjoyed them. We had a bunch of ears with us some well marinated like Flash, Vikoma and mbhangui and some greenhorns like Kratos and me. All of us found the synchronies missing something.

It was only after I heard them with some "really" able amplification (read the mighty C375 as PRE and a Threshold T-200 power) did they sing to their potential and gosh are they awesome!

2. The T6 on the other hand managed to impress most of us. Vikoma even owns a pair and I still love those.

3. Revel M12: Well haven't heard these but their bigger siblings the M22 and I was blown away (This was not with the C356)

This typically proves how susceptible are we humans (ok just us audiophools) to subjective listening AND still enjoy it

PS: Thanks for the detailed observations and don't forget the popcorn reminder next time

:lolopcorn & coffee IMHO have NO synergy:lol:


As far as points 1) & 2) are concerned:

A) Room, Source & Cables should be taken into consideration, keeping the NAD356 constant. Since the whole exercise was to find the right synergy with the NAD356, which as of now mpw does not intend to upgrade from, we had to keep this in mind during each audition. Am sure with the right amp(read as synergy) for each speaker, they may sound different, hence 1 has to keep this in mind w r t our findings. Having said that, I find the NAD356 to be quite a capable amp & hence I would say that whatever has been reflected w r t the pairing of the speakers with this amp has shown us atleast 75% of what each speaker is all about, which I personally feel is more than enough to judge any speaker. (My opinion, YMMV)

B) If we want a concrete conclusion, we should together check these out yet again, both @ Lakozy & @ the place in Pune where you guys heard them, with same set of music

denom - firstly thanks for a long and detailed post. I would not have found so much time at all considering we returned late at night and i was under the pump )

rgds,
mpw

hyeah: I try to write my thoughts down ASAP, lest I forget as we sure listened to a lot of speakers that day :yahoo:

 

[denom]

That was a pretty good read, thank you for taking the time to write all that up for everyone.

Most welcome. Idea is to share ones views with fellow FM's of our beloved forum

 

[mpw]

was wondering why the synchrony 2 tower would play so well with the NAD C356 ( 4 ohm, 88dB ) while the synchrony 2B ( which also played very well, 86dB, 4 ohm ) while we felt the synchrony 1B ( 86dB, 4 ohm ) felt like it needed more power.

the synchrony 2 is a tower speaker and 4 drivers while the synchrony 2B is a bookshelf with 2 drivers.

rgds,

 

[corElement]

@ Denom, When is your planned audition of the TL BS? Am already excited about it. All are welcomed for the audition and share the experiences in the forum.

Oh you made a bs version of your atl's?? PICS!

 

[jaudere]

mpw & Denom, have you auditioned Paradigm studio series with NAD 356? I heard the lowest in the series, Studio 10. Specswise it goes down only upto 62hz but still The experience was wholesome when I heard it paired with Marantz pm 6003. I did not miss anything in the music. It may be worthwhile try since mpw liked Titans. The price of Studio 10 was 39k without bill/warrantly 1 year back. I expect Studio 20 to be even better.

 

[mpw]

the paradigm studio 10 is mrp 55k now and studio 20 is 71k !!

The studio 10 is good but i suspect the studio 20 will be even better.. if only the prices were more tempting.. i would have to invest in stands too !! Budget atleast 10k more..for these..

mpw

 

[Nikhil]

PSB T5:

Whoa.. whats all the hullabaloo about these??? A couple FM's have bought these speakers recently & was wondering if these really are that good. In a nutshell, the sound is FORCED upon you, no separation, no imaging, narrow sweet spot & yeah lots of BASS that just hits you the minute you hear them. What a surprise! We give it a decent run, thinking we should give them a chance OK, but hmmm NO!

PSB T6:

Thinking somethings awry here, we switch over to the T6s, BUT again much of the same as heard in the T5s, slightly improved in areas, with wider sound stage & more BASS! Having heard much of the same as the T5s, we decide to look at something else as atleast I speak for myself, them T5 & 6s did not impress me at all (considering the price range we are talking about here)

Thanks for the write up denom and mpw!
Ha ha ha ... wow!

Really surprised at your review of the T5 and T6. About the T5 - if anything the bass is reserved IMO due to the smaller 5" drivers. I don't think bass is tight enough but I also listen to a lot of vocal & instrumental tracks and I liked the T5 for how well it handled both male (Cat Stevens, Dylan, James Taylor etc) and female vocals (Beth Hart, Mary Black, Adele etc). Guitar instrumentals (Spanish guitar, flamenco etc) sound really well detailed. The fact that they sounded too bassy is for me ... puzzling.

About the NAD+PSB mating - if there's anything to it I haven't been able to hear it either. But I haven't head too many NAD amps either.

I now have to come over to Mumbai/Pune to hear what you guys have over there! Completely "blown" by this review!! :lol:

 

[mpw]

nikk,

it just goes to show :-

a. YMMV
b. Audio is as subjective as the persons ear
c. There is no right or wrong
d. Synergy matters
e. Selection of the equipment ( speakers or amp ) is best done by testing with your own eqpt and your own ear ( not even reviews ). For example.. i could laugh if you said the T5 was a great speaker.. but thats just my ears and you have yours..

as simple as these..

Ours is not , by any stretch of imagination, a definitive compilation..

i wish i would learn to put in couple of smileys of diff types.. maybe i must learn soon..

enjoy..

BTW .. if you can make it to Mumbai to join us on Saturday to have a go at the tannoys.. that would be nice..

)

regards,
mpw

 

[denom]

Thanks for the write up denom and mpw!
Ha ha ha ... wow!

Really surprised at your review of the T5 and T6. About the T5 - if anything the bass is reserved IMO due to the smaller 5" drivers. I don't think bass is tight enough but I also listen to a lot of vocal & instrumental tracks and I liked the T5 for how well it handled both male (Cat Stevens, Dylan, James Taylor etc) and female vocals (Beth Hart, Mary Black, Adele etc). Guitar instrumentals (Spanish guitar, flamenco etc) sound really well detailed. The fact that they sounded too bassy is for me ... puzzling.

About the NAD+PSB mating - if there's anything to it I haven't been able to hear it either. But I haven't head too many NAD amps either.

I now have to come over to Mumbai/Pune to hear what you guys have over there! Completely "blown" by this review!! :lol:

Hi Nikhil,

I knew a post from you was coming sooner than later
1 Point I would like to remind you:
All our findings are based on pairing the speakers to the NAD356 constantly & our views are based on this & this ONLY!
Rest of the observations mpw has already touched upon in his reply to your post.

As for your company for next round of demo's, your MOST WELCOME!!!

 

[denom]

ruenigma & others, get your popcorn, coffee, etc ready, coz another longish post is about to hit you
:lol:hyeah:

Another holiday, another round of auditions, but this one has been the most fruitful, with mpw now almost certain of where he is headed (atleast I hope so)

Idea was to head to Alliance Four, to hear the Tannoy DC6T speakers, but mpw received a message from Alliance Four saying that the speakers have not yet arrived @ their shop.
Meanwhile, Lakozy informed mpw that they have a pair of Focal 816 & PSB Platinum M2 speakers(both demo pairs) available for demo.
We reach Lakozy & decide to hear the PSB Platinum M2s first
We immediately find the synergy with the NAD356 to be really superb. The Speakers perform admirably with whatever we throw at them, with mpw suddenly achieving a zen like smile on his face during the whole session with the M2s

Next we have the Focal 816 hooked up & now we give them a decent run, yet again with the same music that weve been listening to during all our demos.
Not bad speakers but felt that they lacked the punch & finesse in the low frequencies. These again are on the brighter side but do vocals pretty well.
Observation: The M2s are a great pair of speakers, which have been eluding mpw & me for quite a while, but then the reason being that these are a discontinued model, which the CEO of Lakozy, Mr. Harsh thought that we should listen to, based on our interaction with him the last time we were there.
Cost for them is Rs.90k (best price) keeping in mind that these are 8 year old speakers!
Having said that, can comfortably stick my neck out saying that these will eat pretty much any FS Speakers near that price range ALIVE & we heard quite a few of them during our recent audition sprees.
Having time in hand, mpw decides to call his friends @ The Den, Worli, to see if they have the Paradigm Studio 10 & 20s available for demo. Studio 10s were & so we head to The Den, for the next round :lol:
At the Den, we hear the following combo:
Paradigm Studio 10 paired with: NAD356 + Artora CDP + VDH AWG14 Speaker Wire+Audioquest Sidewinder ICs
The Studio 10s are very refined set of speakers, with good amount of everything in the mix, keeping the size of them in mind, but found the pairing with the NAD356 to be lacking. Also felt that the Studio 10s are power hungry & that a higher wattage amp would do more justice to them. Having realized this, we asked the demo person, Mr.Prakash, to hook up another amp with similar wattage to the NAD356. He had the Marantz KI-Lite, which @ 75W was nearest to the NAD356. Hooking up the KI-Lite showed us that the synergy of the Studio 10s was much better with the Marantz than the NAD356, but here too the volume on the KI-Lite was almost @ 12 oclock, to get the Studio 10s to sing. Also found the vocals to be far more alive & realistic, in this pairing.
Retail Price:Rs.55k/-(best price:51K)


Couple of more observations post auditions @ The Den.
* Best demo room found so far has been the one @ Lakozy, as it is not a treated one & has tons of stuff lying around, thereby making it similar to being one in our homes.

* 2&1/2 Way speakers found lacking w r t synergy with the NAD356. They just dont seem to be doing anything good in comparison to a 2 way or 3 way speaker.

* Auditioning a set of speakers can be fun but very tiring too, especially if you come across ones that have been A)Praised too much & then fall flat when you hear them & B) Price to value ratio is quite badly skewed in our part of the world.


I can see light @ the end of this tunnel as far as mpw is concerned. He is not far off from where he needs to be & am sure he is now really fed up of playing the Speaker Poker Game hyeah:

 

[denom]

Link to the fancy Artora(now taken over by Roksan & called Oxygene)

Roksan Oxygene - System - CD Player, Integrated Amplifier

Full two dhinchak but no so as far as price is concerned ( 1.85L )

 

[ruenigma]

So is it gonna be the erstwhile king of the bookshelf hill Platinum M2s to adorn mpw's listening room, or the jury is awaiting the arguments of one Tannoy D6T?

 

[mpw]

or maybe something else sarang.. actually.. i am getting tired of lugging the amp but there are 2 more places to go to.

Mustering up energy and courage ( to tell my wife and kids ) that i am off for another audition..maybe this week..

;-))

maybe a couple of beers will help before i plonk the dough ( what say denom ?? )

mpw

 

[anm]

have you heard the quads?